89Trooper

You can ask Scott about why he didn't call you when the car was on the dyno.

I didn't want a "revised" tune, I wanted a "correct" tune. Scott got scared and we all know it. When I got the boost back to normal levels, he fixed the tune. I hope he would do it for free... it took him all of 5 minutes.

turbo05gt

Hey Tom what size is your BOV flange? Give me a call tomorrow and I will send you one you can test on your car. I may be able to send another Tial waste gate also. Its really not that hard to make things right here.

Granatelli

And I feel the same way

Quote:

Originally Posted by 89Trooper

I have offered to inspect the turbo 4 or 5 times but you don’t want to take if off because is it too much work.
Taken out of context... it's too much work (a waste of time) if it was fine all along.

We don't know that until we inspect it

Quote:

Originally Posted by 89Trooper

If everything else checks out and the turbo is the only thing left to blame, then (and only then) will I remove it.

Then send the other parts back

Quote:

Originally Posted by 89Trooper

If I send you the BOV today and that is not the problem, then tomorrow it will be send the waste gate, then send the turbo, then send the intercooler.
That would be "throwing parts at it", which I don't do. From my research I have learned that this is pointing toward boost leaking in the intake. If all my clamps are tight, what's left on the intake side? The BOV.

technically the intake is the stuff before the turbo. Your probelm is on the pressure side - that would include the waste gate.

You know I have been totally reasonable

If giving Tom my cell phone so he can call anytime he wants is bad business then I am guilty of bad business

If calling the tuner for Tom so I could get the full round down of all the events that transpired is bad business then I am guilty of bad business

If trying to get his car redyno for 3 days while I was in Florida is bad business then I am guilty of bad business

Granatelli

You already said the tune was basically the same. All Scott did was bump the timing in the mid range. The MAF is doing the work. If the car is tuned for 13psi then it will run perfect at 8 or 10.

I have been a gentleman never corrected you - I only voiced my opinion. You valued our opinion when you purchased the kit and when we were doing what you wanted us to do. Now you are choosing to believe what you want to. While that is your prerogative we need to agree to disagree on a few things.

Granatelli

Thanks -

89Trooper

That would be awesome! The part number on the BOV is G176... the base measures 2 1/8" across.

I'll have to check out what size the WG is tomorrow.

turbo05gt

Is the BOV an HKS? Id bet that Tial is a 38mm maybe a 42mm.

89Trooper

Then send the other parts back
I will. Remember, I said I wanted to do the balloon test first? And I wanted to see what changes a boost controller makes?

technically the intake is the stuff before the turbo. Your probelm is on the pressure side - that would include the waste gate.
I'll see what happens with the balloon - before and after a boost controller is installed.

You already said the tune was basically the same. All Scott did was bump the timing in the mid range. The MAF is doing the work. If the car is tuned for 13psi then it will run perfect at 8 or 10.
The tune is designed for 8psi (at least it says so when I upload it... it says "39lb Injectors, 8psi". It better not be made for 13 psi.

I have been a gentleman never corrected you - I only voiced my opinion. You valued our opinion when you purchased the kit and when we were doing what you wanted us to do. Now you are choosing to believe what you want to. While that is your prerogative we need to agree to disagree on a few things.
If things I have said are misrepresented here, I will correct anybody and everybody. I don't believe a thing yet until I do some troubleshooting this weekend. After that, I'll know some things that I don't understand at this time. So I am not "choosing to believe what I want to". After I am educated this weekend, I will "choose to believe what I will then KNOW".

89Trooper

Yes, it's an HKS (I meant to type that the base is 2 1/8" across)... not sure about the Tial, but I will try to get a part number off of it on Saturday.

Thanks!

turbo05gt

hmm dont see that part # anywhere on HKS's site??

Granatelli

Tom - I keep telling you there is very little difference in the tune becuase the MAF sees the amount of air flow and adjusts. As for what pops up on teh screen - those are just notes that Scott put in there. If it said Happy Birthday would that make you think Scott is a nice guy? - My point is I have not turned my back on you but we do have procedures

Granatelli

I feel like picking on me any more call my cell phone

89Trooper

It's this one:

http://www.streetunit.com/HKS_SSQV_U...1004-ak001.htm

89Trooper

I would think he is confused... my birthday is in April.

JR - I'm not picking on you. God, I'd hate to see this thread if I was upset or angry! Geez...

The tune is great! Scott was great! The MPG is great! The power is great! The kit looks great! The quality is great! The car sounds great!

The torque and spooling? Not so great!

Give me a chance to do some troubleshooting. I have to work 50 hours a week for the Mouse and don't have all the time in the world and it's dark when I get home.

Here is my plan:

By Saturday night, I'll know more about whether the WG is leaking with my "balloon test"... in other words, whether it starts to crack the spring at 3psi, instead of opening at 6psi. If it does blow up the balloon, I don't think that is a malfunction... I think that is the nature of the beast and will be corrected with a boost controller (I will also prove or disprove this with a balloon AFTER a boost controller is installed).

I will also visually inspect the intercooler on Saturday.

It figures - the boost controller won't be here until Monday. Hopefully I can put it in Monday night when I get home and do some road testing with the boost gauge on Tuesday. Then I'll know if the boost is coming in any quicker.

Knight

i sure hope you didn't buy a boost controller in the false hopes that it helps boost build faster.

The only reason that could be true is if the WG is not working correctly in the first place.

Granatelli

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knight

I sure hope you didn't buy a boost controller in the false hopes that it helps boost build faster.

I dig your one liners. I agree as well. Where I go into a multi paragraph dissertation, you just through a simple sentence out there and get to the point. PERFECT.

Clearly there is a far left side and a far right side to the debate. 1 or 2 wafflers but for the most part hard left or hard right.

Here is what I can tell you. I have the same kit on my 05

It makes 6psi at 3,000 rpm with the boost controller basically turned off - in Tom's case that would be **** turned as far counter clockwise as possible. That means the boost controller is doing nothing and the turbo is riding the WG spring - just like Knight and I are telling you all. At 4000 it has 6psi and at 6000 it has (guess) 6psi.

Now I set the boost controller for 10psi. Guess how much boost it has at 3,000. Knight will tell you...tick....tock....tick...tock - it has 6psi at 3000. It has 8 psi by 3500 and 10 psi from 3800 to 6000.

Now I set the boost controller for 13psi. Guess how much boost it has at 3,000. Knight will tell you...tick....tock....tick...tock - it has 6psi at 3000. It has 9.5 psi by 3500, 10 psi by 3800 and 13psi from 4100 to 6000.

Now I set the boost controller for 16psi (my max) Guess how much boost it has at 3,000. Knight will tell you...tick....tock....tick...tock - it has 6psi at 3000. It has 10.75 psi by 3500, 13.2 psi by 3800 and 16psi from 4100 to 6000.

So what is going on here? The WG spring determines the minimum boost. The design of the kit in relationship to the turbo sizing determines how well the car will "spool". In the case of the GMS turbo kit it has full boost (as it relates WG spring) at 3,000. You could weld the WG shut or take it off the car and cap it as if it did not exist and guess how much boost the kit will have at 3000?

Knight..........CORRECT 6 psi at 3000 and then very shortly after that about 25

Granatelli

I know I have shown this video 1000 times but you can see how a BOV should work very clearly

http://www.gmsvideos.com/video_detail.php?mId=1417

Granatelli

Tom - You make it hard not to want to fly back out there and fix this thing myself. I am as interested as everyone as to why it spools slower then the other 200+ that are out there. While it may not comfort you at this point - you are the exception not the rule...I am sure we will all figure this thing out

Bullitt995

Ok wait a second, are you guys talking about MANUAL boost controllers? Because my eboost has features and controls that a manual boost controller won't.

Knight

Thanks for the kind words, i just couldn't stand seeing all the misinformation being spewed form some of the people here.


I will gladly except a position at Granatelli as the tech explanations interpreter.