Ford responds to the NHTSA investigation/MT-82 problems: your fault
11/9/11, 08:34 PM
#101
Originally Posted by jmatero
Sorry, but you don't fix what isn't broken... And you don't know you product is breaking unless customers report it.
Changes made since the 2011 production began:
04/26/2010: Revised Clutch Pedal Return Spring
For clutch stay-out at high RPMs
01/07/2011: Revised Clutch Spring Finger Height
For clutch stay-out at high RPMs
10/19/2010: Revised fastener/thread locker
Addresses clutch fastener back out
09/07/2010: Changed 5th/6th gear surface finish
Addresses grinding during 5th gear shifts
07/25/2011: Added phosphate coating to gears
Reduces gear noise
07/25/2011: Lower viscosity lubricant
To reduce shift effort in all temps
08/31/2011: Changed clearance between 2nd gear friction ring & cone
Resolve ring to gear face contact and gear clash
02/25/2011: Fourth gear weld incomplete during production
Process verification to ensure complete gear welding
07/01/2011: Vehicle message center
Extended skip-shift illumination time so drivers aware of engagement
That's a LOT of changes in to a drivetrain in a year. I mean, seriously, welding issues with gears in China. Also, the docs state there have been repairs to 3% of 2011/2012 vehicles. That doesn't even count folks who didn't take it in and are sitting on the sidelines waiting for a fix.
Changes made since the 2011 production began:
04/26/2010: Revised Clutch Pedal Return Spring
For clutch stay-out at high RPMs
01/07/2011: Revised Clutch Spring Finger Height
For clutch stay-out at high RPMs
10/19/2010: Revised fastener/thread locker
Addresses clutch fastener back out
09/07/2010: Changed 5th/6th gear surface finish
Addresses grinding during 5th gear shifts
07/25/2011: Added phosphate coating to gears
Reduces gear noise
07/25/2011: Lower viscosity lubricant
To reduce shift effort in all temps
08/31/2011: Changed clearance between 2nd gear friction ring & cone
Resolve ring to gear face contact and gear clash
02/25/2011: Fourth gear weld incomplete during production
Process verification to ensure complete gear welding
07/01/2011: Vehicle message center
Extended skip-shift illumination time so drivers aware of engagement
That's a LOT of changes in to a drivetrain in a year. I mean, seriously, welding issues with gears in China. Also, the docs state there have been repairs to 3% of 2011/2012 vehicles. That doesn't even count folks who didn't take it in and are sitting on the sidelines waiting for a fix.
11/9/11, 08:37 PM
#102
Ahhh, the guest of honor has arrived. Now its a party. Shake that bear. 
Last edited by Rather B.Blown; 11/9/11 at 08:41 PM.
11/9/11, 08:40 PM
#105
A Man Just Needs Some....
Somebody just ban his ****. I don't feel like reading another 10 pages about jmatero. Dude probably doesn't even own a stang and if he does, it needs to catch fire.
11/9/11, 08:42 PM
#106
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Ive taken mine to the dealer 3 times and to a different dealer the third time. Same response ever time " its normal ". At 7k miles mine still whines and now that its getting colder its starting to grind much worse than last winter. I never expected Ford to do anything about it in this crappy economy.
11/9/11, 08:43 PM
#107
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11/9/11, 08:44 PM
#108
Originally Posted by AlsCobra
Somebody just ban his ****. I don't feel like reading another 10 pages about jmatero. Dude probably doesn't even own a stang and if he does, it needs to catch fire.
I guess this is one instance where absence doesn't make the heart grow fonder.
Or the fart go Honda (but that is a different joke)
11/9/11, 08:46 PM
#110
Originally Posted by chevys
I have forgotten more about Fords than you will ever know. Get a life.
11/9/11, 08:46 PM
#111
Legacy TMS Member
Having read the report, it seems that the response was in line with what has been reported regarding the symptoms that people have described (emotional overreactions aside).
Having flipped through the gears in a Boss 302 while parked a little while back, I could see where shifting might be considered "difficult" because of the gear spacing. The action felt OK to me, just different than my current Tremec.
I suspect that even if this transmission was built in another country, similar complaints could have arisen. Of all of this issues described, only one seems related to what some have labeled as "poor Chinese quality" in the actual transmission unit
a) cold shifting - fluid only
b) clutch plate bolt -not transmission
c) clutch stayout - not transmission
d) 5th gear synchronization - transmission
If there are durability concerns, the 5 yr/60000 mi powertrain warranty should cover this, no?
The documents included in the report are interesting and give some insight into the time duration for responding to this, specifically pages 73 and 74, which detail all the running changes.
I will say that concerns found in 3% of the total production over the 2011 and 2012 model years, given it has been not that many cars, is a somewhat larger number of instances of things to cause concern. However, the fact that they can be identified and tracked using the data that Ford dealers capture tells me that Ford people were quite aware and not "keeping quiet".
Again, the dealership communication processes most likely could have helped to reduce the "not knowing" anxiety.
Hopefully all those legitimately experiencing the described symptoms can get things satisfactorily addressed at a service department that is aware of this.
Having flipped through the gears in a Boss 302 while parked a little while back, I could see where shifting might be considered "difficult" because of the gear spacing. The action felt OK to me, just different than my current Tremec.
I suspect that even if this transmission was built in another country, similar complaints could have arisen. Of all of this issues described, only one seems related to what some have labeled as "poor Chinese quality" in the actual transmission unit
a) cold shifting - fluid only
b) clutch plate bolt -not transmission
c) clutch stayout - not transmission
d) 5th gear synchronization - transmission
If there are durability concerns, the 5 yr/60000 mi powertrain warranty should cover this, no?
The documents included in the report are interesting and give some insight into the time duration for responding to this, specifically pages 73 and 74, which detail all the running changes.
I will say that concerns found in 3% of the total production over the 2011 and 2012 model years, given it has been not that many cars, is a somewhat larger number of instances of things to cause concern. However, the fact that they can be identified and tracked using the data that Ford dealers capture tells me that Ford people were quite aware and not "keeping quiet".
Again, the dealership communication processes most likely could have helped to reduce the "not knowing" anxiety.
Hopefully all those legitimately experiencing the described symptoms can get things satisfactorily addressed at a service department that is aware of this.
11/9/11, 08:52 PM
#112
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Im a real poster and if you dont think the China built m82 has issues you are a fool. This thing is bad susspect and shakey. Let me know how yours holds up down the road. I would be scarded to death.
11/9/11, 08:56 PM
#113
Originally Posted by Tony Alonso
Having read the report, it seems that the response was in line with what has been reported regarding the symptoms that people have described (emotional overreactions aside).
Having flipped through the gears in a Boss 302 while parked a little while back, I could see where shifting might be considered "difficult" because of the gear spacing. The action felt OK to me, just different than my current Tremec.
I suspect that even if this transmission was built in another country, similar complaints could have arisen. Of all of this issues described, only one seems related to what some have labeled as "poor Chinese quality" in the actual transmission unit
a) cold shifting - fluid only
b) clutch plate bolt -not transmission
c) clutch stayout - not transmission
d) 5th gear synchronization - transmission
If there are durability concerns, the 5 yr/60000 mi powertrain warranty should cover this, no?
The documents included in the report are interesting and give some insight into the time duration for responding to this, specifically pages 73 and 74, which detail all the running changes.
I will say that concerns found in 3% of the total production over the 2011 and 2012 model years, given it has been not that many cars, is a somewhat larger number of instances of things to cause concern. However, the fact that they can be identified and tracked using the data that Ford dealers capture tells me that Ford people were quite aware and not "keeping quiet".
Again, the dealership communication processes most likely could have helped to reduce the "not knowing" anxiety.
Hopefully all those legitimately experiencing the described symptoms can get things satisfactorily addressed at a service department that is aware of this.
Having flipped through the gears in a Boss 302 while parked a little while back, I could see where shifting might be considered "difficult" because of the gear spacing. The action felt OK to me, just different than my current Tremec.
I suspect that even if this transmission was built in another country, similar complaints could have arisen. Of all of this issues described, only one seems related to what some have labeled as "poor Chinese quality" in the actual transmission unit
a) cold shifting - fluid only
b) clutch plate bolt -not transmission
c) clutch stayout - not transmission
d) 5th gear synchronization - transmission
If there are durability concerns, the 5 yr/60000 mi powertrain warranty should cover this, no?
The documents included in the report are interesting and give some insight into the time duration for responding to this, specifically pages 73 and 74, which detail all the running changes.
I will say that concerns found in 3% of the total production over the 2011 and 2012 model years, given it has been not that many cars, is a somewhat larger number of instances of things to cause concern. However, the fact that they can be identified and tracked using the data that Ford dealers capture tells me that Ford people were quite aware and not "keeping quiet".
Again, the dealership communication processes most likely could have helped to reduce the "not knowing" anxiety.
Hopefully all those legitimately experiencing the described symptoms can get things satisfactorily addressed at a service department that is aware of this.
(BTW, are you sure you are on the right thread for that type post :-))
11/9/11, 08:59 PM
#114
Legacy TMS Member
11/9/11, 09:02 PM
#115
Cobra Member
From Tony Alonso :"Again, the dealership communication processes most likely could have helped to reduce the "not knowing" anxiety."
I have to agree on this one. Th sad fact is most dealers do as little as possible, and I don't care which make they are selling. It would be different if the factory was allowed to sell directly to the consumer, but thanks to Congress that is against the law. My dealer knew nothing about the MT82 problems when I asked them to do the fluid TSB for cold weather shifting. They didn't even have the fluid in stock. I spoke to a second dealer in another city, in SD, and received the same comments..what problems? Also, my salesman had the "deer in the headlights" look when I asked about the skip shift feature, when I initially test drove the car. He had no idea what I was talking about.
Communication is key and Ford needs to "encourage" the dealer network to start treating the customer like a valuable commodity or they will go somewhere else. All the consumer is asking, is to be treated like an intelligent individual.
I have to agree on this one. Th sad fact is most dealers do as little as possible, and I don't care which make they are selling. It would be different if the factory was allowed to sell directly to the consumer, but thanks to Congress that is against the law. My dealer knew nothing about the MT82 problems when I asked them to do the fluid TSB for cold weather shifting. They didn't even have the fluid in stock. I spoke to a second dealer in another city, in SD, and received the same comments..what problems? Also, my salesman had the "deer in the headlights" look when I asked about the skip shift feature, when I initially test drove the car. He had no idea what I was talking about.
Communication is key and Ford needs to "encourage" the dealer network to start treating the customer like a valuable commodity or they will go somewhere else. All the consumer is asking, is to be treated like an intelligent individual.
11/9/11, 09:06 PM
#116
Clearly you have no intentions of buying, so please, go somewhere where you can actually contribute something other than your personal whining.
11/9/11, 09:09 PM
#117
A Man Just Needs Some....
Originally Posted by SD CALSPCL
From Tony Alonso :"Again, the dealership communication processes most likely could have helped to reduce the "not knowing" anxiety."
I have to agree on this one. Th sad fact is most dealers do as little as possible, and I don't care which make they are selling. It would be different if the factory was allowed to sell directly to the consumer, but thanks to Congress that is against the law. My dealer knew nothing about the MT82 problems when I asked them to do the fluid TSB for cold weather shifting. They didn't even have the fluid in stock. I spoke to a second dealer in another city, in SD, and received the same comments..what problems? Also, my salesman had the "deer in the headlights" look when I asked about the skip shift feature, when I initially test drove the car. He had no idea what I was talking about.
Communication is key and Ford needs to "encourage" the dealer network to start treating the customer like a valuable commodity or they will go somewhere else. All the consumer is asking, is to be treated like an intelligent individual.
I have to agree on this one. Th sad fact is most dealers do as little as possible, and I don't care which make they are selling. It would be different if the factory was allowed to sell directly to the consumer, but thanks to Congress that is against the law. My dealer knew nothing about the MT82 problems when I asked them to do the fluid TSB for cold weather shifting. They didn't even have the fluid in stock. I spoke to a second dealer in another city, in SD, and received the same comments..what problems? Also, my salesman had the "deer in the headlights" look when I asked about the skip shift feature, when I initially test drove the car. He had no idea what I was talking about.
Communication is key and Ford needs to "encourage" the dealer network to start treating the customer like a valuable commodity or they will go somewhere else. All the consumer is asking, is to be treated like an intelligent individual.
11/9/11, 09:13 PM
#118
Originally Posted by AlsCobra
After working in dealership service departments for 10+ years, the majority of "consumers" are NOT intelligent individuals. This is made apparent by some of the postings just in this thread alone. No offense guys.
the majority of the human race are NOT intelligent individuals.
But arent we all just victims? Lets blame our parents.
11/9/11, 09:19 PM
#119
Legacy TMS Member
In contrast to many of the technicians with whom I've directly talked, those folks, if they have the time to break away, actually treated me quite well. Of course, this is all dealer-dependent.
11/9/11, 09:19 PM
#120
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But the internet - The GREAT equalizer - has changed that for those wanting to be informed. (Excepting the drivel from certain posters of course.) I love walking into my Chrysler Dealer and knowing more about the issue than they do at the counter. Same with my Ford Dealer when I ordered Bullitt.
I'm pretty sure they were thinking "What's a forum??".
However, though things are still slow to catch up, FORD has been on it by plugging in online.
Think of what that means. As far as providing what the consumer wants. Thank goodness I have griped loudly and often on that ugly freakin' diaper!
That was the worst, most conflicted design EVER!
Last edited by cdynaco; 11/9/11 at 09:27 PM.