WaveMan2k3

If I owned any classic chances are I would turn it into a hotrod and thus i would be using a new crate engine so I wouldnt't have a problem doing a conversion. I can imagine alot of classic car ownered would convert their babies by buying a new engine so they could convert it over if it meant that they wouldn't be paying out of their hiney's for gas to fuel the things B)

future9er24

unless you can find a way to convert it into hydro....or would that ruin the collectability of the car?

jgsmuzzy

Sorry waveman, I think my explanation is subject to cultural dialogue differences. I was referring to the fact that if you say two H two O quickly, it sounds like the sound an owl makes........... And it was meant to be a light hearted joke......
Anyhow, back on topic

James

Decipher

DING DING DING!! HOT DOG WE HAVE A WIENER!! THANK YOU!

Decipher

Hey no problem man. I'm relieved you took it that way. A few minutes after I posted that I thought "Dang, I shouldn't have said that. He could so easily take that as a harsh insult."

TampaBear67

Heard on the News Yesterday, Gas Prices in Iran right now are $ 0.05 a Gallon, That's Five Cents! If Oil in Iran is so plentiful that they pay Five Cents a Gallon After refining it, Imagine how Cheap Hydrogen would be, considering that Most of the Universe is Made Up of Hydrogen.

Decipher

You can go that route, or just convert it. It's nothing special to convert it. Just change the fuel storage system, the fuel lines, and possibly the injectors/carborator. If even. The RX-8 can change between the two with the flip of a switch, so that leads me to believe that there is hardly any modification needed to run on Hydrogen.

Wombert

Thanks, Robert (and the others). Nice post. Good points. The fact alone that the administration refused to sign the Kyoto protocol is a good reason not to vote for Bush again. I just don't get why people rather care for the fuel prices of today than for their children's life of tomorrow...

Spooty

What exactly would need to be changed to make an engine run on hydrogen? I would assume ignition timing, maybe compression and valve timing. Stock injectors might work but if you're running a carb that would have to be replaced.

WaveMan2k3

You can go that route, or just convert it. It's nothing special to convert it. Just change the fuel storage system, the fuel lines, and possibly the injectors/carborator. If even. The RX-8 can change between the two with the flip of a switch, so that leads me to believe that there is hardly any modification needed to run on Hydrogen. [/b][/quote]
No dude you'd have to get a brand new generation fuel injected motor. It said in one of the links either I posted or someone else posted in here. So to convert over a classic you'd have to get a new crate engine and then upgrade that to hydro. Now you're probably thing why would I get a new engine just because it is fuel injected, when i can just get a new fuel injected intake manifold to replace the carbs? Well the answer cannot be anymore simple really. Hydro ICE's need to have one thing that old classic cars don't have, an on board computer. Classic engines aren't compatible with on board pcs to control how lean the fuel mixture is and all that good stuff. That has only been in cars sine the late '80s. So all older cars would need the engine totally upgraded at this point in time. If I had lets say an old '69 Mach 1, and I wanted to convert it over to running on hydro. I'd get myself a new Ford 351 (Racing) Clevland Crate Engine and all the computer components that we got now yo upgrade everything on the Mach 1 so that it would be a new car. But hey thats just me.

Spooty

I'm not sure I agree with that, WaveMan. What do the new motors have that the old ones don't? Sensors, that's what. Sure some of the technology is better but that shouldn't affect whether it can run hydro or not. I'm sure the sensors could be retro-fitted. You would have sensors like O2, exhaust temp, water temp, etc. All that could be put on without having to get a new engine.

And honestly I don't think any of that is absolutely necessary. The reason I say that is because some of the natural gas conversions that are available for existing cars. They have modified computers for newer vehicles to optimize it's use but older vehicles don't need it. If I'm not mistaken some don't have any computer at all and the ones that do have limited or no sensors. It's like carburetors. Everything use to have a carb and they were simply mechanical devices. Then they started hooking up all theses sensors to the engine and carb and connecting them to a computer. Now the engine ran better, more efficiently and under more diverse conditions. But the old mechanical carbs still worked fine. That's the way it is for natural gas and I would assume it would be the same for hydrogen

WaveMan2k3

Well no matter what you'd have to convert the engine over to fuel injected so no carbs. I know for a fact that the site with the hydro corvette said it has to be fuel injected or else it wont work. As for the sensors yah granted some can be retro-fitted some parts though might not be able to, it's hard to say really because of the limited amount that we as a group know about Hydro ICE's. I have a feeling though that they would need a lot more then just a few sensors because I got the idea from that site with the corvette that it would take a heck of a lot of money at the moment to just upgrade a modern engine to run on hydrogen. So i can only imagine just how much would need to go into converting a classics engine over, because lets face it they aren't as efficient as new engines and they don't have like half the crap on them that new engines got (senors and other computer components, lets not forget with a modern engine all u have to do is hook up a computer to the diagnostics port in the interior and u can add like 90+ hp and 75+ tq to the vehicle, some even more then that). New engines granted they are based on the same principles as the old classics they are much more complex because of all the computer and its sensors and controllers all over the engine and the rest of the vehicle for that matter. All of those cost a heck of alot of money to add to an engine of any era nevermind having to pay a ton more money to get a kit to convert it all over to hydrogen. All that money with all the retro-fitting to a classic's engine could possibly double the cost of converting. Again though its hard to really say right, but granted new crate engines cost an arm and a leg to get but they already have all the computer and the sensors and controllers all hooked up to them so that they can make the hp that that engine is supposed to be making. So it wouldnt cost as much so convert it over to hydrogen. I don't remember if I've already stated this but all classic engines are designed around the most basic of engine principles because they normally run carbs and don't have all the sensors and controllers.

but hey if I'm wrong I'll admit it, its just all that stuff that the old engines don't have cost a ton to get nevermind to get installed correctly and on Ol'd engines that cost could just sky rocket because of all the work needed to convert it over so it is basically a new engine (so you'd be able to convert the car to hydro). But that was all what I understood when i read that sites info. Like I said if I read that wrong, I'll admit it. I got no problems with that.

Spooty

No problem, WaveDude. What's great about this thread is that we are all learning something. I could be wrong in what I said too but you and the others here have made me think about something that is very exciting.

I had looked into converting a couple of my vehicles to LP and a lot of that information seemed to apply to hydrogen also. So I just wanted to relay that. Whether it applies or not remains to be seen.

Horsepower844182

I see we had a couple of more people vote for "No" and "Maybe"...I can't think of a reason not to use it... :scratch:

Little or no power loss
Renewable
Potential to be very cheap
No emission (not only does that mean less pollution but that also means the end of emission laws)
Since it's still burned you still get an exhaust sound (To tell you the truth, this was my biggest turnoff of Hydro...I want my V8 Rumble...)


Why vote no?

Lalo

DING DING DING!! HOT DOG WE HAVE A WIENER!! THANK YOU! [/b][/quote]
just reposting it to make sure more people read it

ManEHawke

You can go that route, or just convert it. It's nothing special to convert it. Just change the fuel storage system, the fuel lines, and possibly the injectors/carborator. If even. The RX-8 can change between the two with the flip of a switch, so that leads me to believe that there is hardly any modification needed to run on Hydrogen. [/b][/quote]
I KNOW I can convert it, but I will choose not too. i wouldnt want a fresh exhaust smell out of an all out american classic. But everyone can do as they wish. For a new car i'm all for hydro though.

Decipher

Cool. That's entirely your prerogative.

WaveMan2k3

Thats a very true statement you made. Both of us are just going by things that we are learning in this thread and little bits that we read on other sites, so either one of us can potentionally be wrong, but who knows we can both be correct at the sametime too. At this point we just don't know. As far as some points of converting some vehicles to LP having a lot in common with converting over to hydrogen. I can see that because when it comes down to it, bottem line is that you're really just changing over the sensors and fuel nozzels and what not, but it will always be based off of the Gas ICE, right? So of coarse they will have stuff in common with eachother. To be honest I'm kinda tempted to do a little experiment of my own now. Only thing is that I dont have the money to do it. I want to buy myself an old car and it doesnt really matter what the car is because this is an experiment (although I'd perfer a mustang because they are my favorite cars in the world or an old '67 Mercury Meteor Fastback [i know a dealer in town that has own just sitting there and it's only worth about $200 CDN; something along those lines) and get a new crate engine since i doubt that engine will start because its been sitting there for so long. Now this is where the experiment will lye. I want to buy a conversion kit and turn the car into a Hydro ICE and bring the car literally up to date inside and looking to the future engine-wise. Then we can see just how good the Hydro ICE really is. 'Cause lets face it a '67 Mercury Meteor Fastback is a moster in size. So if I can get some awsome power out of it and not have to worry about emissions (due to the fact there wouldn't be any emissions) I would then have an experimental hydro-hotrod that I'd hardly have to worry about filling up. All I would need is $$ because I know it will take a poo load of it and I currently am well broke. But I'm willing to take donations so I can get an old car to do this on.

Oh and one more thing I'd pay to get a stainless steel exhaust system made custom for it. No NOT STEEL but "stainless steel" because I'd never have to worry about my pipes rusting on me.

future9er24

hey everybody. i was wonderin, u know how H is alot less dense than regular gasoline? would that mean a hydro car would need bigger fuel reserves? or does the combustability (is that even a word) of hydrogen make up for it?

MustangMan311

same here