Boss 302 vs Camaro ZL-1 in Motor Trend
1/17/12, 06:59 PM
#21
Before everyone gets too excited over this minor win lets look at some facts.
With 136 more HP, and 176 more TQ it better put up some pretty good track times especially with wider tires and fancy shocks. But with 176LBS of torque MORE that's the best it could do?? Great job GM, you successfully beat a car with 76 less CI and N/A that cost's 7K more, just barely. But the win was from the two fastest laps on ONE track by ONE driver. How will that blown pig fare after a real road race where the Boss loves to run? Cause we all know how well blowers love heat. You can get a couple of good first laps out if it, but what happens after 10+ laps in normal summer temps?
Put the ZO6's 427 in a Camaro and see if it can beat a Boss on the track, I'll call the weight penalty vs more power a draw. If it can do that I'll be impressed an give it high praise.
With 136 more HP, and 176 more TQ it better put up some pretty good track times especially with wider tires and fancy shocks. But with 176LBS of torque MORE that's the best it could do?? Great job GM, you successfully beat a car with 76 less CI and N/A that cost's 7K more, just barely. But the win was from the two fastest laps on ONE track by ONE driver. How will that blown pig fare after a real road race where the Boss loves to run? Cause we all know how well blowers love heat. You can get a couple of good first laps out if it, but what happens after 10+ laps in normal summer temps?
Put the ZO6's 427 in a Camaro and see if it can beat a Boss on the track, I'll call the weight penalty vs more power a draw. If it can do that I'll be impressed an give it high praise.
1/17/12, 07:06 PM
#22
My post from another forum....
Personally, I hope I get to see a ZL1 at the track. I'm very much looking forward to the challenge. I see the Camaro runs the same width tires as I do on track. I'm pretty sure the 400 lb weight savings on similar tires will offset the extra 150 hp it has for the first lap or two......until it starts pulling timing from the blower, then it's game on
Personally, I hope I get to see a ZL1 at the track. I'm very much looking forward to the challenge. I see the Camaro runs the same width tires as I do on track. I'm pretty sure the 400 lb weight savings on similar tires will offset the extra 150 hp it has for the first lap or two......until it starts pulling timing from the blower, then it's game on
...the driver is the key, and I can't wait to shame some inept ZL1 owners on-track in my poor little BOSS 302.
1/17/12, 07:07 PM
#23
This is the configuration I'm guessing they ran, cutting out the two red circled areas and taking the straight bypasses.
I would love to see some in-car video of their laps to be certain, and also to pick up some Pobst Secrets!
I would love to see some in-car video of their laps to be certain, and also to pick up some Pobst Secrets!
1/17/12, 07:34 PM
#24
Cobra Member
The ZL1 achieved 1.0 g, the LS achieved 1.01 g on the track. If the driver wasnt so afraid to run up on the curbs with the LS, the LS would have run closer to the ZL1. I want a braver driver in the LS. 
I want a braver driver in the LS.
1/17/12, 07:54 PM
#25
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My post from another forum....
Personally, I hope I get to see a ZL1 at the track. I'm very much looking forward to the challenge. I see the Camaro runs the same width tires as I do on track. I'm pretty sure the 400 lb weight savings on similar tires will offset the extra 150 hp it has for the first lap or two......until it starts pulling timing from the blower, then it's game on
Personally, I hope I get to see a ZL1 at the track. I'm very much looking forward to the challenge. I see the Camaro runs the same width tires as I do on track. I'm pretty sure the 400 lb weight savings on similar tires will offset the extra 150 hp it has for the first lap or two......until it starts pulling timing from the blower, then it's game on
More competition = more innovation and more fun.This is like anything else, TVs, computers, smart phones... faster and more powerful with every new model. The race is on!
I would say that I always thought of MT to be a bigger fan of the Euro cars, then Chevy, then Ford, certainly not Ford biased - ever. It's been driving me crazy for years.
1/18/12, 02:07 AM
#26
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I love my LS. No questions about it. However I can appreciate other cars and brands. That being said the new suspension Chevy has on it's Vettes, the CTS-V, and now Camaro is no joke. Yes those cars have big motors and are powerful. But that magnetorheological suspension is amazing. It is so good Ferrari now has something similar they run on their cars.....
1/18/12, 02:11 AM
#27
I love my LS. No questions about it. However I can appreciate other cars and brands. That being said the new suspension Chevy has on it's Vettes, the CTS-V, and now Camaro is no joke. Yes those cars have big motors and are powerful. But that magnetorheological suspension is amazing. It is so good Ferrari now has something similar they run on their cars.....
1/18/12, 03:00 AM
#28
Bullitt Member
I don't think it would have changed the outcome of the article that much if any, but ...
The suspension setting was set incorrectly for the LS. The article states that the shocks/struts were set at "5 at all four corners". Track prep for the LS has the rear shocks set at 3 or 4 depending on the track. This is probably why the car wasn't as settled as it should have been.
The suspension setting was set incorrectly for the LS. The article states that the shocks/struts were set at "5 at all four corners". Track prep for the LS has the rear shocks set at 3 or 4 depending on the track. This is probably why the car wasn't as settled as it should have been.
1/18/12, 06:40 AM
#30
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I don't think the win for the ZL1 comes as any big surprise. I'm happy that the Boss performed as well as it did against a car with far more HP and TQ.
I knew the ZL1 was going to be a very solid performer and would be a pretty impressive car. But the real battle is still looming.
I guess you could say the Boss was just a tune up fight for the ZL1, but it's real challenge is with the '13 GT500. Does the GT500 send the ZL1 running away with it's tail between it's legs? We'll know the answer to that question in a couple of months.
I knew the ZL1 was going to be a very solid performer and would be a pretty impressive car. But the real battle is still looming.
I guess you could say the Boss was just a tune up fight for the ZL1, but it's real challenge is with the '13 GT500. Does the GT500 send the ZL1 running away with it's tail between it's legs? We'll know the answer to that question in a couple of months.
1/18/12, 06:50 AM
#31
Nobody on this forum could get within seconds of the times he's posting in either of these cars.
I don't think it would have changed the outcome of the article that much if any, but ...
The suspension setting was set incorrectly for the LS. The article states that the shocks/struts were set at "5 at all four corners". Track prep for the LS has the rear shocks set at 3 or 4 depending on the track. This is probably why the car wasn't as settled as it should have been.
The suspension setting was set incorrectly for the LS. The article states that the shocks/struts were set at "5 at all four corners". Track prep for the LS has the rear shocks set at 3 or 4 depending on the track. This is probably why the car wasn't as settled as it should have been.
Last edited by MrBonus; 1/18/12 at 06:53 AM.
1/18/12, 07:35 AM
#33
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I have a feeling the 2013 GT500 will be faster around the track but the ZL1 with it's suspension will be better composed.
Last edited by bpmurr; 1/18/12 at 07:39 AM.
1/18/12, 08:38 AM
#34
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That's the difference I run from my buddies in their modded Z06s (500 rwhp, coilovers and bigger tires) on both power tracks like BIR and technical tracks like MAM or MPH. I'm surprised the Camaro can run with a Z06 since it's almost 1,000 lbs heavier. Something doesn't sound right.
1/18/12, 08:55 AM
#35
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2 seconds is an eternity.... Especially when the slower car has r comps. I wonder what the zl1 would run on the corsas. Then again the corsas are known to be crap after a day on the track, and they didn't mention the condition of the tires. Another variable to add to the mix ....
Btw I would have bought the zl1 if it were out at the time, I've got no shame or brand loyalty....
In fact I already have my eyes on the f30 m3
Btw I would have bought the zl1 if it were out at the time, I've got no shame or brand loyalty....
In fact I already have my eyes on the f30 m3
1/18/12, 10:00 AM
#36
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I think the subjective commentary is as important as the objective stuff...and they were impressed with the zl1, so hat's off to gm...because I do think it will make Ford work harder on the stang and because it improves the 'cred of american muscle in general.
re: R compounds and all the objective timing stuff...remember that the 'regular' boss, run by MT, ran faster than Rnady ran the LS at LS in the bet driver's car shootout.
re: R compounds and all the objective timing stuff...remember that the 'regular' boss, run by MT, ran faster than Rnady ran the LS at LS in the bet driver's car shootout.
1/18/12, 10:15 AM
#37
I think the subjective commentary is as important as the objective stuff...and they were impressed with the zl1, so hat's off to gm...because I do think it will make Ford work harder on the stang and because it improves the 'cred of american muscle in general.
re: R compounds and all the objective timing stuff...remember that the 'regular' boss, run by MT, ran faster than Rnady ran the LS at LS in the bet driver's car shootout.
re: R compounds and all the objective timing stuff...remember that the 'regular' boss, run by MT, ran faster than Rnady ran the LS at LS in the bet driver's car shootout.
1/18/12, 10:29 AM
#39
I Have No Life
Said this in the other thread.
Interesting that they didn't put the 2012 GT500 up against it.
Was it that they really wanted to put 'built for track' cars on the track...or....
Even before the 5.8 came out, they didn't want to show how close the cars are (if they are) and hurt the already deflated view on the ZL1 once the 650 comes out.
Can you imagine if the ZL1 was pitted against it in the article, lost...and thats even before the new car comes out?
I would be VERY curious if they had one there and tested it...
Interesting that they didn't put the 2012 GT500 up against it.
Was it that they really wanted to put 'built for track' cars on the track...or....
Even before the 5.8 came out, they didn't want to show how close the cars are (if they are) and hurt the already deflated view on the ZL1 once the 650 comes out.
Can you imagine if the ZL1 was pitted against it in the article, lost...and thats even before the new car comes out?
I would be VERY curious if they had one there and tested it...
1/18/12, 11:32 AM
#40
Cobra Member
I appreciate that Motor Trend compared the ZL1 to the Boss 302 LS. I am sure alot of Boss 302 LS owners are wondering how their Boss 302 LS stacks up against the ZL1. The ZL1 will be considered a track car so it is only naturual to compare the leader of track cars to it. However, knowing the main focus of the article was the new ZL1, I am sure the driver left a little on the table for the LS. Does anyone really think the driver would try and embarass the theme of the article ?