retrofit a 2013/14 cluster
1/6/15, 05:57 PM
#162
Mach 1 Member
I will probably by this weekend. I have made more progress in the last 1hr with this new CAN hardware/software than in the last 2 months... lol
Eventually i'm going to need a Track App cluster for testing.... If anyone has one...
-Matt
Eventually i'm going to need a Track App cluster for testing.... If anyone has one...
-Matt
Last edited by zeroaviation; 1/6/15 at 06:32 PM.
1/6/15, 10:02 PM
#164
Legacy TMS Member
Thread Starter
I do have my 2013 cluster that I bought for my 2005.
1/7/15, 01:11 PM
#165
Legacy TMS Member
Thread Starter
1) On the 2005 cluster, the airbag indicator and seat belt indicator and tone (24 and 23 on the plug for 2005) come from the RCM. The 2013/14 must be receiving these signals through the CANbus.
Result - no airbag warning light, no seat belt warning light, no seat belt chime
Fix - Black Box - plug these wires into the BB and then send the proper signals to the cluster via HSCAN wires, as the cluster expects.
2) Traction control indicator is a signal and return on the 2005 and so are 2 separate wires. But it is only 1 wire for 2013/14.
Result - traction control warning light is always on. TCS is off and can't be turned on?
Fix - Black Box - plug these wires into the BB and then send the proper signal to the cluster to pin 7 on the cluster.
3) The key in the ignition warning on the 2005 goes straight to the cluster to pin 13. On the 2013/14, it goes to the SJB on C2280B pin#35. Info must be sent via CANbus again.
Result - IDK
Fix - Black Box - plug the wire into the BB and then send the proper signal via the HSCAN wires to the cluster.
4) PATS is in the cluster for 2013/14 and is pin# 22 and 23. Don't need these, so don't worry about it. Car will start without it.
Result - the car & lock warning light keep flashing when car is on. No PATS?
Fix - IDK - maybe turn off PATS altogether? Or BB can somehow keep PATS working.
5) On the 2013/14 cluster, pin# 9 and 10 are for a compass.
Result - IDK
Fix - get the 10-14 autodimming mirror with compass and wire it straight to the cluster pin#9 and 10. Or leave it alone.
6) Oil pressure goes direct to the 2013/14 cluster into pin# 5. On the 2005, it goes to the SJB on C2280C pin# 42. Maybe disconnecting it to the SJB and rewiring it to go to the cluster will work? Otherwise, once again the info is sent via CANbus.
Result - no oil pressure reading
Fix - reroute the wire going to pin#42 on C2280C on the SJB. Run it to the connector on the cluster pin #5. Not sure if teh reading is accurate, but seems to be.
7) Fuel level is also sent directly to the cluster in 2013/14. In 2005 it goes to the SJB (C2280C pin# 31, 43, 44) and then CANbus to the cluster. Again I am thinking of disconnecting the wires to the SJB and rewiring them to go to the cluster instead.
Result - no fuel reading or anything associated with fuel, like average fuel consumption, km to empty etc,
Fix - reroute the wires going to the SJB to the cluster instead as shown below:
On C2280C, pin #43 is the signal for the fuel level sensor. That will go to pin# 18 on the cluster.
On C2280C, pin# 31 is the return for the fuel level sensor. That goes to pin# 19 on the cluster.
On C2280C, pin# 44 is the signal for the fuel pump (fuel sender). That goes to pin# 15 on the cluster.
On C2280C, pin#31 is also the return for the fuel pump (fuel sender). It goes to pin# 16 on the cluster.
The reading is not accurate, though. Lexiion says that a 2010 fuel pump and sensors are needed for this. Seems he is right.
8) There is no overdrive indicator on the 13/14 cluster, only hill assist indicator.
Result - hill assist does not light up.
Fix - IDK - Maybe hill assist can be changed to light up as O/D via the BB?
9) cruise control light - cruise will not work right as the resistances in the 13/14 switch are completely different, and there is a new function as well.
Result - no cruise control
Fix - The circuit board of the 13/14 switch needs to have the resistances changed to make it work almost 100%. I already have a solution for this in another thread for this, but to get the cruise lights to turn on, a module will need to be included in the BB to make the proper signals and send them via HSCAN wires.
10) parking brake light is always on
Result - parking brake warning light is always on.
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret the signal on the HSCAN wires.
11) Trunk ajar warning does not work.
Result - car gives no warning that the trunk is open.
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret the signal on the HSCAN wires.
12) TPMS has no signal as 05 didn't have TPMS.
Result - TPMS warning light is always on.
Fix - ignore or get TPMS sensors and the TPMS module for 07-09 cars?
13) High Beam indicator not working
Result - when high beam is selected, the high beam indicator will not light up. Headlights and high beams still function as they should, however.
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret the signal on the HSCAN wires.
14) extra digital guages, such as air inlet temp, air/fuel ratio, cylinder head temp, tranny temp will not work as the signals from the PCM are not recognized by the cluster.
Result - no readings for those digital guages
Fix - Black Box can reinterpret the signals on the HSCAN wires. Or you can flash the cluster using a 2010 VIN to remove those guages.
15) Track Apps won't work. Lexiion is currently trying to get this to work in his 2010 car, but even though he got the 13/14 ABS module, he still can't get it to work. I think not possible for 05-09 cars.
Result - track apps will display but not be functional.
Fix - Flash the cluster to that of a 10 car. Then Track Apps will be removed from the menu altogether. Or BB could have the sensors built into it and send this to cluster via HSCAN wires.
16) Cluster is in night mode and can't be changed to daytime mode.
Result - cluster will always be in night time mode
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret signal on HSCAN wires.
17) Steering selection and ambient lighting are selectable on the cluster, but not available on the car.
Result - you can select these options, but will get nothing.
Fix - you can flash the cluster using a 2010 VIN which will get rid of the steering feel option, but the ambient lighting will still be there but be useless. The only way to select steering feel modes is to convert the car to electric steering. Possible, but pricey and who knows what needs to be changed in the car. Lexiion is looking into doing this for his 2010. Ambient lighting is controlled by a separate module in the center console for 07-09 cars. No idea if it can be changed to work from the cluster.
18) Sport Select Shift available on the cluster for automatics, but 05-09 automatic cars don't have this.
Result - When you put the automatic car into 1, the cluster will recognize a manual shift and say "Sport Shift Selected". When put into 2, 2 is displayed on the cluster. When put into 3, 3 is selected on the cluster.
Fix - either flash the cluster to that of a manual and that may get rid of the message, or just leave it.
19)there is no 5 way directional pad to navigate the menus. The 'info-reset' buttons on the center stack will not be useful.
Result - can't access any features beyond the title screen.
Fix - use a 2013/14 wheel with appropriate switches. This requires even more work. Or use an off the shelf d pad and adapt it to the 05-09. The old 'info-reset' buttons should be removed with the blankout put in.
The Black Box will be wired to the HScan wires. It will also have to have some way of plugging some wires that normally go to the cluster go to it instead. Wires 13, 20, 21, 23, 24 will all need to plug into the black box.
Result - no airbag warning light, no seat belt warning light, no seat belt chime
Fix - Black Box - plug these wires into the BB and then send the proper signals to the cluster via HSCAN wires, as the cluster expects.
2) Traction control indicator is a signal and return on the 2005 and so are 2 separate wires. But it is only 1 wire for 2013/14.
Result - traction control warning light is always on. TCS is off and can't be turned on?
Fix - Black Box - plug these wires into the BB and then send the proper signal to the cluster to pin 7 on the cluster.
3) The key in the ignition warning on the 2005 goes straight to the cluster to pin 13. On the 2013/14, it goes to the SJB on C2280B pin#35. Info must be sent via CANbus again.
Result - IDK
Fix - Black Box - plug the wire into the BB and then send the proper signal via the HSCAN wires to the cluster.
4) PATS is in the cluster for 2013/14 and is pin# 22 and 23. Don't need these, so don't worry about it. Car will start without it.
Result - the car & lock warning light keep flashing when car is on. No PATS?
Fix - IDK - maybe turn off PATS altogether? Or BB can somehow keep PATS working.
5) On the 2013/14 cluster, pin# 9 and 10 are for a compass.
Result - IDK
Fix - get the 10-14 autodimming mirror with compass and wire it straight to the cluster pin#9 and 10. Or leave it alone.
6) Oil pressure goes direct to the 2013/14 cluster into pin# 5. On the 2005, it goes to the SJB on C2280C pin# 42. Maybe disconnecting it to the SJB and rewiring it to go to the cluster will work? Otherwise, once again the info is sent via CANbus.
Result - no oil pressure reading
Fix - reroute the wire going to pin#42 on C2280C on the SJB. Run it to the connector on the cluster pin #5. Not sure if teh reading is accurate, but seems to be.
7) Fuel level is also sent directly to the cluster in 2013/14. In 2005 it goes to the SJB (C2280C pin# 31, 43, 44) and then CANbus to the cluster. Again I am thinking of disconnecting the wires to the SJB and rewiring them to go to the cluster instead.
Result - no fuel reading or anything associated with fuel, like average fuel consumption, km to empty etc,
Fix - reroute the wires going to the SJB to the cluster instead as shown below:
On C2280C, pin #43 is the signal for the fuel level sensor. That will go to pin# 18 on the cluster.
On C2280C, pin# 31 is the return for the fuel level sensor. That goes to pin# 19 on the cluster.
On C2280C, pin# 44 is the signal for the fuel pump (fuel sender). That goes to pin# 15 on the cluster.
On C2280C, pin#31 is also the return for the fuel pump (fuel sender). It goes to pin# 16 on the cluster.
The reading is not accurate, though. Lexiion says that a 2010 fuel pump and sensors are needed for this. Seems he is right.
8) There is no overdrive indicator on the 13/14 cluster, only hill assist indicator.
Result - hill assist does not light up.
Fix - IDK - Maybe hill assist can be changed to light up as O/D via the BB?
9) cruise control light - cruise will not work right as the resistances in the 13/14 switch are completely different, and there is a new function as well.
Result - no cruise control
Fix - The circuit board of the 13/14 switch needs to have the resistances changed to make it work almost 100%. I already have a solution for this in another thread for this, but to get the cruise lights to turn on, a module will need to be included in the BB to make the proper signals and send them via HSCAN wires.
10) parking brake light is always on
Result - parking brake warning light is always on.
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret the signal on the HSCAN wires.
11) Trunk ajar warning does not work.
Result - car gives no warning that the trunk is open.
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret the signal on the HSCAN wires.
12) TPMS has no signal as 05 didn't have TPMS.
Result - TPMS warning light is always on.
Fix - ignore or get TPMS sensors and the TPMS module for 07-09 cars?
13) High Beam indicator not working
Result - when high beam is selected, the high beam indicator will not light up. Headlights and high beams still function as they should, however.
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret the signal on the HSCAN wires.
14) extra digital guages, such as air inlet temp, air/fuel ratio, cylinder head temp, tranny temp will not work as the signals from the PCM are not recognized by the cluster.
Result - no readings for those digital guages
Fix - Black Box can reinterpret the signals on the HSCAN wires. Or you can flash the cluster using a 2010 VIN to remove those guages.
15) Track Apps won't work. Lexiion is currently trying to get this to work in his 2010 car, but even though he got the 13/14 ABS module, he still can't get it to work. I think not possible for 05-09 cars.
Result - track apps will display but not be functional.
Fix - Flash the cluster to that of a 10 car. Then Track Apps will be removed from the menu altogether. Or BB could have the sensors built into it and send this to cluster via HSCAN wires.
16) Cluster is in night mode and can't be changed to daytime mode.
Result - cluster will always be in night time mode
Fix - IDK - BB will have to reinterpret signal on HSCAN wires.
17) Steering selection and ambient lighting are selectable on the cluster, but not available on the car.
Result - you can select these options, but will get nothing.
Fix - you can flash the cluster using a 2010 VIN which will get rid of the steering feel option, but the ambient lighting will still be there but be useless. The only way to select steering feel modes is to convert the car to electric steering. Possible, but pricey and who knows what needs to be changed in the car. Lexiion is looking into doing this for his 2010. Ambient lighting is controlled by a separate module in the center console for 07-09 cars. No idea if it can be changed to work from the cluster.
18) Sport Select Shift available on the cluster for automatics, but 05-09 automatic cars don't have this.
Result - When you put the automatic car into 1, the cluster will recognize a manual shift and say "Sport Shift Selected". When put into 2, 2 is displayed on the cluster. When put into 3, 3 is selected on the cluster.
Fix - either flash the cluster to that of a manual and that may get rid of the message, or just leave it.
19)there is no 5 way directional pad to navigate the menus. The 'info-reset' buttons on the center stack will not be useful.
Result - can't access any features beyond the title screen.
Fix - use a 2013/14 wheel with appropriate switches. This requires even more work. Or use an off the shelf d pad and adapt it to the 05-09. The old 'info-reset' buttons should be removed with the blankout put in.
The Black Box will be wired to the HScan wires. It will also have to have some way of plugging some wires that normally go to the cluster go to it instead. Wires 13, 20, 21, 23, 24 will all need to plug into the black box.
Last edited by jim010; 1/7/15 at 01:12 PM.
2/18/15, 03:46 PM
#167
Mach 1 Member
Slow, my car is in storage until it warms up a little.
Progress is being made however. I have mapped 50% of the relevant stuff. Plus, I have also found a local 05 Mustang willing to donate his car to the conversion.
-Matt
Progress is being made however. I have mapped 50% of the relevant stuff. Plus, I have also found a local 05 Mustang willing to donate his car to the conversion.
-Matt
3/5/15, 02:06 PM
#168
Legacy TMS Member
Thread Starter
Update:
Matt is looking at changing out the steering column from a 10-14 into an 05 in order to get the 13/14 steering wheel and switches. Apparently the current clockspring does not have enough slots to accommodate the extra wires needed for the 5 way directional button.
He is also looking into akdoggie's thread on how he retrofitted the 10-12 steering wheel as a possible alternative. But while akdoggie used 10-12 switches, the 13-14 switches use more wires because of the 5 way directional button, and the currents are different for the cruise control.
Matt is looking at changing out the steering column from a 10-14 into an 05 in order to get the 13/14 steering wheel and switches. Apparently the current clockspring does not have enough slots to accommodate the extra wires needed for the 5 way directional button.
He is also looking into akdoggie's thread on how he retrofitted the 10-12 steering wheel as a possible alternative. But while akdoggie used 10-12 switches, the 13-14 switches use more wires because of the 5 way directional button, and the currents are different for the cruise control.
3/5/15, 07:39 PM
#169
Mach 1 Member
Update:
Matt is looking at changing out the steering column from a 10-14 into an 05 in order to get the 13/14 steering wheel and switches. Apparently the current clockspring does not have enough slots to accommodate the extra wires needed for the 5 way directional button.
He is also looking into akdoggie's thread on how he retrofitted the 10-12 steering wheel as a possible alternative. But while akdoggie used 10-12 switches, the 13-14 switches use more wires because of the 5 way directional button, and the currents are different for the cruise control.
Matt is looking at changing out the steering column from a 10-14 into an 05 in order to get the 13/14 steering wheel and switches. Apparently the current clockspring does not have enough slots to accommodate the extra wires needed for the 5 way directional button.
He is also looking into akdoggie's thread on how he retrofitted the 10-12 steering wheel as a possible alternative. But while akdoggie used 10-12 switches, the 13-14 switches use more wires because of the 5 way directional button, and the currents are different for the cruise control.
I used a steering wheel from a 2013-14 (had to swap the left side switch). There are only 2 wires "leftover", which by process of elimination should be the d-pad. The WPT2142 has 6 wires, and 4 are needed for the Audio SWCs, so the remaining 2 could be available...
3/29/15, 06:30 PM
#171
Member
Join Date: March 29, 2015
Posts: 1
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im new
Just want to introduce myself on here and let everyone know that I'm the guy that is letting my car be zeroaviaton's, aka Matt, guinea pig for the gauge conversion. I just bought my 06 mustang gt about a month ago and Matt had asked me if I wanted to be the victim of this lol I agreed to it cause I 100% trust Matt since I've known him for awhile and he has taught me many things about the mustang that has been very helpful. My car right now has a C&L CAI, SLP Loudmouth axle backs and a full race tune. tune is by Matt himself. Ran the 1/4 mile last weekend and my best time was 14.4 @100mph. My first manual car and absolutely love it so far and have many plans for this car in the future.
3/31/15, 10:11 AM
#172
Legacy TMS Member
Thread Starter
Hi Ryan,
Thanks for helping out on this. Just wondering on what some issues:
You guys decided to use the steering column from a 10-14. Is that because of the clack spring connectors not having enough slots for the extra wires (and if so, why not change the connectors?), or something else?
Are you currently testing using the d-pad? Any ideas on getting cruise to work right?
Is track apps being looked at or are we just going to flash the cluster to get rid of them?
Keep us posted, Ryan?
Thanks for helping out on this. Just wondering on what some issues:
You guys decided to use the steering column from a 10-14. Is that because of the clack spring connectors not having enough slots for the extra wires (and if so, why not change the connectors?), or something else?
Are you currently testing using the d-pad? Any ideas on getting cruise to work right?
Is track apps being looked at or are we just going to flash the cluster to get rid of them?
Keep us posted, Ryan?
4/2/15, 10:46 AM
#173
Mach 1 Member
Hi Ryan,
Thanks for helping out on this. Just wondering on what some issues:
You guys decided to use the steering column from a 10-14. Is that because of the clack spring connectors not having enough slots for the extra wires (and if so, why not change the connectors?), or something else?
Are you currently testing using the d-pad? Any ideas on getting cruise to work right?
Is track apps being looked at or are we just going to flash the cluster to get rid of them?
Keep us posted, Ryan?
Thanks for helping out on this. Just wondering on what some issues:
You guys decided to use the steering column from a 10-14. Is that because of the clack spring connectors not having enough slots for the extra wires (and if so, why not change the connectors?), or something else?
Are you currently testing using the d-pad? Any ideas on getting cruise to work right?
Is track apps being looked at or are we just going to flash the cluster to get rid of them?
Keep us posted, Ryan?
As of right now, we will have a somewhat functioning version of track apps. But more research will need to be done. BBv2 will have a built in accelerometer to feed data to the ICM.
-Matt
4/14/15, 10:02 AM
#175
Mach 1 Member
This weekend I built (half) of the hardware needed for the conversion. This half takes care of the HSCAN Messages. If you check out the video below, you will notice that there is no Traction Control light, advance track light, Check Engine Light, Seatbelt light, Airbag light.
This week, I will invest building the other half (MSCAN) to handle TPMS warnings/re-working and other small stuff.
If the weekend is nice, we will be re-installing the cluster into the car with the new prototype black box, and go from there.
-Matt
This week, I will invest building the other half (MSCAN) to handle TPMS warnings/re-working and other small stuff.
If the weekend is nice, we will be re-installing the cluster into the car with the new prototype black box, and go from there.
-Matt
4/14/15, 10:44 AM
#176
Mach 1 Member
This weekend I built (half) of the hardware needed for the conversion. This half takes care of the HSCAN Messages. If you check out the video below, you will notice that there is no Traction Control light, advance track light, Check Engine Light, Seatbelt light, Airbag light.
This week, I will invest building the other half (MSCAN) to handle TPMS warnings/re-working and other small stuff.
If the weekend is nice, we will be re-installing the cluster into the car with the new prototype black box, and go from there.
-Matt
cluster work - YouTube
This week, I will invest building the other half (MSCAN) to handle TPMS warnings/re-working and other small stuff.
If the weekend is nice, we will be re-installing the cluster into the car with the new prototype black box, and go from there.
-Matt
cluster work - YouTube
LEXiiON
4/15/15, 09:04 AM
#178
Mach 1 Member
Its a trooper!
Yea, we will need one eventually. I will shoot you an email later this week.
-Matt
-Matt
4/20/15, 09:13 AM
#180
Mach 1 Member
Thanks mrkabc!
Heres another update. The prototype hardware has been finalized, and I will be starting PCB Design this week. The first revision will be a prototype hardware (meaning not compact, and will have several debug points) and should be in my hands in 4 weeks. (China PCB manufacturing is slow plus shipping)
As you can see from the video, when I push the button on the touchscreen. We are simulating it being installed in a 2013 car.
More to come this week as hardware/software comes together.
Left to investigate (Which we already have figured out)
1. Fuel level input
2. Brake input
3. Oil Level Input
Cheers,
-Matt
Heres another update. The prototype hardware has been finalized, and I will be starting PCB Design this week. The first revision will be a prototype hardware (meaning not compact, and will have several debug points) and should be in my hands in 4 weeks. (China PCB manufacturing is slow plus shipping)
As you can see from the video, when I push the button on the touchscreen. We are simulating it being installed in a 2013 car.
More to come this week as hardware/software comes together.
Left to investigate (Which we already have figured out)
1. Fuel level input
2. Brake input
3. Oil Level Input
Cheers,
-Matt
Last edited by zeroaviation; 4/20/15 at 09:16 AM.