FORD RACING SUPERCHARGER It's Coming!
4/13/06, 09:54 PM
#21
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(wsmatau @ April 13, 2006, 5:34 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
I'm guessing at which kit will be possibly offerred with a warranty. You may be right that they only offer the non-intercooled kit that "only" puts out 405rwhp with the warranty(although I think an intercooled kit---even at 6 psi---is much more "warranty friendly". But the HO kit definitely is ready for production and is produced in conjunction with FRPP. It is a beast. It was originally supposed to be on the Shelby, but Whipple canceled/lost its contract with Lysholm and had a major supply problem that wouldn't allow them to continue with the shelby project and have it completed according to Ford's timeline. Now imagine the Shelby with a Whipple up on top! [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/drool.gif[/img]
This new compressor is supposed to be even better than the older 2300 model. That, with the weight savings, of a GT over the Shelby should produce some interesting comparisons. Of course the Shelby will have a forged bottom end and tons more potential right off the showroom floor.
But if Ford does offer this HO kit as a warrented item (I can dream can't I?) I don't see why anyone would look elsewhere. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/worship.gif[/img]
[/b][/quote]
The HO kit will be killer warrented or no. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/drool.gif[/img] Maybe next summer I can afford one.... and others will determine what else has to be upgraded to accomodate it.
I'm guessing at which kit will be possibly offerred with a warranty. You may be right that they only offer the non-intercooled kit that "only" puts out 405rwhp with the warranty(although I think an intercooled kit---even at 6 psi---is much more "warranty friendly". But the HO kit definitely is ready for production and is produced in conjunction with FRPP. It is a beast. It was originally supposed to be on the Shelby, but Whipple canceled/lost its contract with Lysholm and had a major supply problem that wouldn't allow them to continue with the shelby project and have it completed according to Ford's timeline. Now imagine the Shelby with a Whipple up on top! [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/drool.gif[/img]
This new compressor is supposed to be even better than the older 2300 model. That, with the weight savings, of a GT over the Shelby should produce some interesting comparisons. Of course the Shelby will have a forged bottom end and tons more potential right off the showroom floor.
But if Ford does offer this HO kit as a warrented item (I can dream can't I?) I don't see why anyone would look elsewhere. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/worship.gif[/img]
[/b][/quote]
The HO kit will be killer warrented or no. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/drool.gif[/img] Maybe next summer I can afford one.... and others will determine what else has to be upgraded to accomodate it.
4/14/06, 07:01 AM
#23
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Wonder if they will do it for Automatics like Roush?[/b][/quote]
I sure hope so. This is what I have been waiting for with great anticipation. Let us all pray to the S/C Gods to make this system come with a factory warranty. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/worship.gif[/img]
I sure hope so. This is what I have been waiting for with great anticipation. Let us all pray to the S/C Gods to make this system come with a factory warranty. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/worship.gif[/img]
4/14/06, 11:37 AM
#24
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nonsensez9 @ April 13, 2006, 4:11 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
What, Ford offering a $6000 upgrade to a GT that will spank a GT500??? I'm not inclined to think so. I'm thinking 400rwhp at best.
[/b][/quote]
What do you think the GT500 is going to make? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/headscratch.gif[/img] My estimate is around 400-425 at the wheels. Plus it weighs 400 lbs more than a Mustang GT. That's not really an impressive power to weight ratio, IMO.
What, Ford offering a $6000 upgrade to a GT that will spank a GT500??? I'm not inclined to think so. I'm thinking 400rwhp at best.
[/b][/quote]
What do you think the GT500 is going to make? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/headscratch.gif[/img] My estimate is around 400-425 at the wheels. Plus it weighs 400 lbs more than a Mustang GT. That's not really an impressive power to weight ratio, IMO.
4/14/06, 12:29 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mustangfan123 @ April 13, 2006, 8:45 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
If people want real hp,ford should make a ford racing supercharger that produces 575-625rwhp as a top model s/c.Then a 475-525rwhp s/c as a middle class one.Then a base one with 375-425rwhp.[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen.gif[/img] Just my idea.Its kinda like the saleen options.You know 330hp,then 435hp,and next 550hp.
[/b][/quote]
You need to make sure that you are comparing fwhp to fwhp and rwhp to RWHP. The Whipple HO kit puts out 490 RWHP which equates to nearly 575 fwhp. This is higher than what most "tuners" (<450rwhp) feel is safe, but the guys at Whipple swear it is safe with their tune and mods included in the kit. I wouldn't try to repully it without a built bottom end. Whipple says the w140x compressor in this kit is good up to about 800hp.
I've heard rumors that the pre-production Shelbys were dynoing in the 460rwhp range with just a CAI and tune. With a repully and new exhaust they were hitting 600+. That is off the top of my head because I don't want to research it right now, those numbers may be off.
It all depends on what you want. I'm of the opinion that 450 hp is about all you need on the street. After that the driver is the biggest variable in the chain.
If people want real hp,ford should make a ford racing supercharger that produces 575-625rwhp as a top model s/c.Then a 475-525rwhp s/c as a middle class one.Then a base one with 375-425rwhp.[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen.gif[/img] Just my idea.Its kinda like the saleen options.You know 330hp,then 435hp,and next 550hp.
[/b][/quote]
You need to make sure that you are comparing fwhp to fwhp and rwhp to RWHP. The Whipple HO kit puts out 490 RWHP which equates to nearly 575 fwhp. This is higher than what most "tuners" (<450rwhp) feel is safe, but the guys at Whipple swear it is safe with their tune and mods included in the kit. I wouldn't try to repully it without a built bottom end. Whipple says the w140x compressor in this kit is good up to about 800hp.
I've heard rumors that the pre-production Shelbys were dynoing in the 460rwhp range with just a CAI and tune. With a repully and new exhaust they were hitting 600+. That is off the top of my head because I don't want to research it right now, those numbers may be off.
It all depends on what you want. I'm of the opinion that 450 hp is about all you need on the street. After that the driver is the biggest variable in the chain.
4/14/06, 11:25 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(don_w @ April 14, 2006, 10:40 AM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
What do you think the GT500 is going to make? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/headscratch.gif[/img] My estimate is around 400-425 at the wheels. Plus it weighs 400 lbs more than a Mustang GT. That's not really an impressive power to weight ratio, IMO.
[/b][/quote]
the number I've been seeing bandied about is 485 fwhp. I have no idea what that translates to at the wheels.
What do you think the GT500 is going to make? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/headscratch.gif[/img] My estimate is around 400-425 at the wheels. Plus it weighs 400 lbs more than a Mustang GT. That's not really an impressive power to weight ratio, IMO.
[/b][/quote]
the number I've been seeing bandied about is 485 fwhp. I have no idea what that translates to at the wheels.
4/14/06, 11:58 PM
#28
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ford4v429 @ April 13, 2006, 8:54 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
the only differences in these might be pullies. and engine life. General consensus seems to be 4~450 hp&ft/lb limit for the powder metal stock rods. upping boost is easy, not blowing the bottom end onto the pavement is another issue...buying a low pressure blower will get you good increases, but to get to the 'wow' levels, you would really need to buy a steel crank and forged rods/pistons(likely just an assembled shortblock), just to make certain the motor wont grenade first time you step on it hard.
[/b][/quote]
Good points....transmissions and driveline components are also a consideration. How about a couple more engine options with some forged pieces?
the only differences in these might be pullies. and engine life. General consensus seems to be 4~450 hp&ft/lb limit for the powder metal stock rods. upping boost is easy, not blowing the bottom end onto the pavement is another issue...buying a low pressure blower will get you good increases, but to get to the 'wow' levels, you would really need to buy a steel crank and forged rods/pistons(likely just an assembled shortblock), just to make certain the motor wont grenade first time you step on it hard.
[/b][/quote]
Good points....transmissions and driveline components are also a consideration. How about a couple more engine options with some forged pieces?
4/15/06, 12:04 AM
#29
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(wsmatau @ April 13, 2006, 5:18 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
Why would you even try to repully the car. It will kick the heck out of virtually any other stocker out there.
[/b][/quote]
Well, if I forge my engine. I'd definately want to be able to do it. 450 on the street, 600 at the track.
Even with stock I'd still like to run 450 at the track and then around 410 around the house
Why would you even try to repully the car. It will kick the heck out of virtually any other stocker out there.
[/b][/quote]
Well, if I forge my engine. I'd definately want to be able to do it. 450 on the street, 600 at the track.
Even with stock I'd still like to run 450 at the track and then around 410 around the house
4/15/06, 03:41 PM
#31
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nonsensez9 @ April 14, 2006, 10:28 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
the number I've been seeing bandied about is 485 fwhp. I have no idea what that translates to at the wheels.
[/b][/quote]
Assuming a ~15% drivetrain loss... between 400 and 425rwhp.
the number I've been seeing bandied about is 485 fwhp. I have no idea what that translates to at the wheels.
[/b][/quote]
Assuming a ~15% drivetrain loss... between 400 and 425rwhp.
4/15/06, 05:32 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(don_w @ April 15, 2006, 2:44 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
Assuming a ~15% drivetrain loss... between 400 and 425rwhp.
[/b][/quote]
the $/hp ratio is what ain't that great either. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrinjester.gif[/img] at least for the first 6 or 8 months
Assuming a ~15% drivetrain loss... between 400 and 425rwhp.
[/b][/quote]
the $/hp ratio is what ain't that great either. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrinjester.gif[/img] at least for the first 6 or 8 months
4/16/06, 10:15 AM
#33
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There are quite a few chioces for measuring horsepower and it is always important to compare apples to apples. Gross vs Net vs Rearwheel horsepower and also the type of Dyno measuring it.
kc
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4/16/06, 01:27 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nonsensez9 @ April 15, 2006, 5:35 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
the $/hp ratio is what ain't that great either. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrinjester.gif[/img] at least for the first 6 or 8 months
[/b][/quote]
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrinjester.gif[/img] I'm guessing that you mean that you will end up buying new tires every 6 months. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/eek.gif[/img]
the $/hp ratio is what ain't that great either. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrinjester.gif[/img] at least for the first 6 or 8 months
[/b][/quote]
[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrinjester.gif[/img] I'm guessing that you mean that you will end up buying new tires every 6 months. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/eek.gif[/img]
4/16/06, 01:28 PM
#35
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When and if an S/C is offered with a complete warranty. it would certainly interest me - guess we should know something definite pretty soon. Thanks Kevin and keep us informed
4/16/06, 01:30 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gt6974a @ April 15, 2006, 12:07 AM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
Well, if I forge my engine. I'd definately want to be able to do it. 450 on the street, 600 at the track.
Even with stock I'd still like to run 450 at the track and then around 410 around the house
[/b][/quote]
Sorry if I misunderstood. I thought you meant you were looking for MORE boost.
And, yeah, with a forged bottom end it would be easy to have this setup get silly quickly [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thumb.gif[/img]
Well, if I forge my engine. I'd definately want to be able to do it. 450 on the street, 600 at the track.
Even with stock I'd still like to run 450 at the track and then around 410 around the house
[/b][/quote]
Sorry if I misunderstood. I thought you meant you were looking for MORE boost.
And, yeah, with a forged bottom end it would be easy to have this setup get silly quickly [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thumb.gif[/img]
4/16/06, 02:26 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(don_w @ April 14, 2006, 1:40 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
What do you think the GT500 is going to make? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/headscratch.gif[/img] My estimate is around 400-425 at the wheels. Plus it weighs 400 lbs more than a Mustang GT. That's not really an impressive power to weight ratio, IMO.
[/b][/quote]
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?s=...ndpost&p=616179
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?showtopic=42774
What do you think the GT500 is going to make? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/headscratch.gif[/img] My estimate is around 400-425 at the wheels. Plus it weighs 400 lbs more than a Mustang GT. That's not really an impressive power to weight ratio, IMO.
[/b][/quote]
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?s=...ndpost&p=616179
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?showtopic=42774
4/16/06, 04:25 PM
#38
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Al Blue4.6l @ April 16, 2006, 1:29 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?s=...ndpost&p=616179
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?showtopic=42774
[/b][/quote]
Three-month old speculation doesn't necessarily correlate to production reality.
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?s=...ndpost&p=616179
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?showtopic=42774
[/b][/quote]
Three-month old speculation doesn't necessarily correlate to production reality.
4/16/06, 04:31 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(don_w @ April 16, 2006, 6:28 PM) Quoted post</div><div class='quotemain'>
Three-month old speculation doesn't necessarily correlate to production reality.
[/b][/quote]
A: given what the motor is, and the numbers that the Ford GT produces, Brad's numbers seem pretty reasonable.
B: I dont think brad would have posted what he did without getting those numbers from good authority
C: ford has been pretty good about under rating motors lately. look at the 03/04 cobras. they were underrated by about 40hp.
Three-month old speculation doesn't necessarily correlate to production reality.
[/b][/quote]
A: given what the motor is, and the numbers that the Ford GT produces, Brad's numbers seem pretty reasonable.
B: I dont think brad would have posted what he did without getting those numbers from good authority
C: ford has been pretty good about under rating motors lately. look at the 03/04 cobras. they were underrated by about 40hp.
4/16/06, 04:41 PM
#40
If it's really in the neighbor of 485fwhp (as now is being reported), they would have to underrate it by some 100hp to get up to 485+ at the wheels. But who cares about hp numbers anyway, they mean diddly... let's see a timeslip from a real live production model purchased by Joe Schmoe. Only then will we know if it's enough power to push that heavy thing down the track.