What's the BFD with IRS?
#441
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How is it that if the mustang doesnt have IRS you wont be able to drive one? Sounds like you are the one who drank the Kool ade. Thousands of mustangs are sold every month despite having an SRA. Do you really think these sales will cease to exist if it has an SRA for 2010?
What about my hypothetical test? Do you really think the average mustang or camaro buyer, without knowing what type of suspension is under the car, can tell?
#442
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Oooh, touched a nerve there Eric? What I meant by bias is that they already have preconceived ideas about what is the best for suspension layouts. Give the cars to some basic people who do not understand the arguments about the IRS versus the SRA.
Every single car that you listed costs thousands and thousands of more dollars than the mustang. It should ride better in every way. Hence, my description of a good test between the mustang and a car that will be in the same class. Not a bunch of overpriced exotics.
Every single car that you listed costs thousands and thousands of more dollars than the mustang. It should ride better in every way. Hence, my description of a good test between the mustang and a car that will be in the same class. Not a bunch of overpriced exotics.
#443
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I think people will notice the difference in ride quality. My mother, who knows absolutely nothing about cars, can tell the difference in the suspension between a Honda Accord and BMW 545i. She made a comment about it the other day when we were talking about the Accord. She said the steering feels lighter (less effort) and the suspension is softer and less sporty. Again, this is coming from a women who has zero mechanical knowledge.
Will they be able to tell without any coercion from anyone? Meaning, if you said drive these two throughout some different courses and tests and give us your feedback. Without saying "The camaro has IRS, the mustang has an SRA, which one is better?"
Try this instead: "How did each ride? Does one ride significantly better than the other? Enough to make you not want to buy the other one?"
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Examples being the Neon. Very sporty ride. Grand Am, not so much. Focus, not that aggressive. Civic, very utilitarian. Prius, yuck. The only one I havent owned... the prius.
#446
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I'm not even referring to brand. You take any given make, hell even two different model years of the same car and you'll notice a different ride. It's to be expected.
I know I'm oversimplifying, but you know what I'm saying.
I know I'm oversimplifying, but you know what I'm saying.
Last edited by zzcoop; 10/29/08 at 11:37 AM.
#447
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You can take two models, same year and equipment and they will drive differently, especially used cars. Yes I do get what you are saying.
#448
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Right every single journalist is biased against Ford. Ridiculous!!! First the mustang doesn't have 400 ponies. I would love a 5.0 with 400 naturally aspirated poneys. Second, a well sorted out IRS is better. This does not apply to drag racing, however the regular corvette does very well against the shelby. Further it does apply pretty much everywhere else including, ride quality & handling. There is a reason the world's finest cars have irs... IT'S BETTER.
By all reports the Camaro is a much better car. Do I want Ford to equal or surpass it so I can still drive mustangs as I have since I got my 69 mach in 1976. Yes I do. But, I'm not such a koolade drinker as to kid myself. Ford has some catching up to do.
By all reports the Camaro is a much better car. Do I want Ford to equal or surpass it so I can still drive mustangs as I have since I got my 69 mach in 1976. Yes I do. But, I'm not such a koolade drinker as to kid myself. Ford has some catching up to do.
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#449
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Umm yeah you can. I've been looking to buy a GT500 for a while now and it is still cheaper for me to buy a Corvette. The invoice on the Vette is much lower than the MSRP so the dealers can afford to take a bigger hit on it, I am yet to see a new GT500 sell for less than $45,000 kudos to you, looks like you got an excellent price though I find it surprising because none in the area that are loaded are under $48,000. Did you get yours under MSRP? The loaded ones I have seen have been just a shade under $50,000.
Ford's own web sight lists the base MSRP on the 09' GT500 at $43,125 so don't kid yourself nobody got one of these new for 42k!
Chevy lists the 08' Vette's base MSRP at $46,950 on there web sight. Though in 09' the MSRP has jumped up to $49,400.
A dealer offered me a well optioned 08' Vette for $42,000 firm, the best I could do on a GT500 was MSRP.
As far as the 70HP goes, who cares if you are faster with the 430.
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Where you get that MSRP for the GT500?!?
Umm yeah you can. I've been looking to buy a GT500 for a while now and it is still cheaper for me to buy a Corvette. The invoice on the Vette is much lower than the MSRP so the dealers can afford to take a bigger hit on it, I am yet to see a new GT500 sell for less than $45,000 kudos to you, looks like you got an excellent price though I find it surprising because none in the area that are loaded are under $48,000. Did you get yours under MSRP? The loaded ones I have seen have been just a shade under $50,000.
Ford's own web sight lists the base MSRP on the 09' GT500 at $43,125 so don't kid yourself nobody got one of these new for 42k!
Chevy lists the 08' Vette's base MSRP at $46,950 on there web sight. Though in 09' the MSRP has jumped up to $49,400.
A dealer offered me a well optioned 08' Vette for $42,000 firm, the best I could do on a GT500 was MSRP.
As far as the 70HP goes, who cares if you are faster with the 430.
Umm yeah you can. I've been looking to buy a GT500 for a while now and it is still cheaper for me to buy a Corvette. The invoice on the Vette is much lower than the MSRP so the dealers can afford to take a bigger hit on it, I am yet to see a new GT500 sell for less than $45,000 kudos to you, looks like you got an excellent price though I find it surprising because none in the area that are loaded are under $48,000. Did you get yours under MSRP? The loaded ones I have seen have been just a shade under $50,000.
Ford's own web sight lists the base MSRP on the 09' GT500 at $43,125 so don't kid yourself nobody got one of these new for 42k!
Chevy lists the 08' Vette's base MSRP at $46,950 on there web sight. Though in 09' the MSRP has jumped up to $49,400.
A dealer offered me a well optioned 08' Vette for $42,000 firm, the best I could do on a GT500 was MSRP.
As far as the 70HP goes, who cares if you are faster with the 430.
#452
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Thats a great deal on the 08 Vette with the current incentives. Its true that there are no incentives on the GT500s at this time, but I have been seeing used GT500s go for less than $40k thru the auction chute with less than 6000 miles on them. Heck, Ive seen regular premium GTs for $14k with 30k in miles.
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I have seen low mile GTs sell cheap but I'm still searching for a bargain GT500! I'm hoping that the 10' GT500 blows the current one out of the water so we can see a large market of low mile 07-09 GT500s. At this point I can't rationalize spending close to 50 large on one of these.
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At my small town Ford dealer, I have developed a personal relationship with the dealership owner. I buy all my new vehicles from him. I got the 4th of four total 2007-2008 GT500's he got. He isn't getting any 2009's.
I made my deal and reserved my spot to order my GT500 in early 2007, I paid a small ADM, when everyone was paying a large ADM.
Today, NEW GT500's can be had for MSRP all day long. Just do a search of Ebay or Craigslist. As FordBlueHeart has already pointed out, you can pick up under 5000 mile GT500's for $35,000 to $45,000 all over the place...
I ordered my car to my specification, I guess not totally loaded, I have ABSOLUTELY no use for the $2000 navigation, or $1300 worth of excess stereo junk.
Besides, as nice as the Corvettes are, and they are quite nice, I am a FORD Guy.
My GT500 Window Sticker
![](http://forums.bradbarnett.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=65459&stc=1&d=1225308944)
My friends Corvette Window Sticker
![](http://forums.bradbarnett.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=65460&stc=1&d=1225309237)
That is nice, I've driven the new Corvette, It is a nice car. It sounds like you need to pull the trigger on the Chevy.
You still have to pay over $70,000 to get a Corvette with 500 Horsepower. I like being in the FACTORY 500 Horsepower Club...
I'm a Ford Guy, even if the Corvette has a performance edge for a price premium, I'm still going with the 500 Horsepower FORD every time.
I made my deal and reserved my spot to order my GT500 in early 2007, I paid a small ADM, when everyone was paying a large ADM.
Today, NEW GT500's can be had for MSRP all day long. Just do a search of Ebay or Craigslist. As FordBlueHeart has already pointed out, you can pick up under 5000 mile GT500's for $35,000 to $45,000 all over the place...
I ordered my car to my specification, I guess not totally loaded, I have ABSOLUTELY no use for the $2000 navigation, or $1300 worth of excess stereo junk.
Besides, as nice as the Corvettes are, and they are quite nice, I am a FORD Guy.
Umm yeah you can. I've been looking to buy a GT500 for a while now and it is still cheaper for me to buy a Corvette. The invoice on the Vette is much lower than the MSRP so the dealers can afford to take a bigger hit on it, I am yet to see a new GT500 sell for less than $45,000 kudos to you, looks like you got an excellent price though I find it surprising because none in the area that are loaded are under $48,000. Did you get yours under MSRP? The loaded ones I have seen have been just a shade under $50,000.
You still have to pay over $70,000 to get a Corvette with 500 Horsepower. I like being in the FACTORY 500 Horsepower Club...
I'm a Ford Guy, even if the Corvette has a performance edge for a price premium, I'm still going with the 500 Horsepower FORD every time.
#456
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At my small town Ford dealer, I have developed a personal relationship with the dealership owner. I buy all my new vehicles from him. I got the 4th of four total 2007-2008 GT500's he got. He isn't getting any 2009's.
I made my deal and reserved my spot to order my GT500 in early 2007, I paid a small ADM, when everyone was paying a large ADM.
Today, NEW GT500's can be had for MSRP all day long. Just do a search of Ebay or Craigslist. As FordBlueHeart has already pointed out, you can pick up under 5000 mile GT500's for $35,000 to $45,000 all over the place...
I ordered my car to my specification, I guess not totally loaded, I have ABSOLUTELY no use for the $2000 navigation, or $1300 worth of excess stereo junk.
Besides, as nice as the Corvettes are, and they are quite nice, I am a FORD Guy.
My GT500 Window Sticker
![](http://forums.bradbarnett.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=65459&stc=1&d=1225308944)
My friends Corvette Window Sticker
![](http://forums.bradbarnett.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=65460&stc=1&d=1225309237)
That is nice, I've driven the new Corvette, It is a nice car. It sounds like you need to pull the trigger on the Chevy.
You still have to pay over $70,000 to get a Corvette with 500 Horsepower. I like being in the FACTORY 500 Horsepower Club...
I'm a Ford Guy, even if the Corvette has a performance edge for a price premium, I'm still going with the 500 Horsepower FORD every time.
I made my deal and reserved my spot to order my GT500 in early 2007, I paid a small ADM, when everyone was paying a large ADM.
Today, NEW GT500's can be had for MSRP all day long. Just do a search of Ebay or Craigslist. As FordBlueHeart has already pointed out, you can pick up under 5000 mile GT500's for $35,000 to $45,000 all over the place...
I ordered my car to my specification, I guess not totally loaded, I have ABSOLUTELY no use for the $2000 navigation, or $1300 worth of excess stereo junk.
Besides, as nice as the Corvettes are, and they are quite nice, I am a FORD Guy.
My GT500 Window Sticker
My friends Corvette Window Sticker
That is nice, I've driven the new Corvette, It is a nice car. It sounds like you need to pull the trigger on the Chevy.
You still have to pay over $70,000 to get a Corvette with 500 Horsepower. I like being in the FACTORY 500 Horsepower Club...
I'm a Ford Guy, even if the Corvette has a performance edge for a price premium, I'm still going with the 500 Horsepower FORD every time.
As far as you stating your reasons for the GT500 over the Vette I say good for you, don't let a
Devil's Advocate try to sway you! Variety is the spice of life my friend!
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#457
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Oooh, touched a nerve there Eric? What I meant by bias is that they already have preconceived ideas about what is the best for suspension layouts. Give the cars to some basic people who do not understand the arguments about the IRS versus the SRA.
Every single car that you listed costs thousands and thousands of more dollars than the mustang. It should ride better in every way. Hence, my description of a good test between the mustang and a car that will be in the same class. Not a bunch of overpriced exotics.
Every single car that you listed costs thousands and thousands of more dollars than the mustang. It should ride better in every way. Hence, my description of a good test between the mustang and a car that will be in the same class. Not a bunch of overpriced exotics.
Let's be clear about the biased thing. Many journalists have driven the new camaro, challenger and the Mustang. Most of us, I suspect you included, haven't. This automaticaly gives them a more informed opinion. Not necessarily right, but more informed. To assume the solid axle is going to be found to be superior by common folks without any experience with these cars is perhapsed biased... perhapsed!
Ford was cutting corners for the sake of keeping the cost down. The new mustang is an awesome car. I enjoy mine everyday. I have been driving primarily mustangs for 30 years. But, the truth is a flaming sword. If Chevy can put out 400 ponies, better ride and handling for 30-35k, Ford is going to lose sales. It is my hope that the next gen mustang mops up the floor with them, but given the financial realities, I'm not holding my breath.
#458
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Well actually it doesn't matter if the new Camaro or Challenger are good bad or ugly, it doesn’t matter if they are equal to, better or worse. The Mustang will lose sales to the Camaro and Challenger regardless of how it stacks up against them simply by virtue of the fact that many Mustang buyers are actually Chevy and Dodge Boys who have had only one Pony Car choice, The Ford Mustang, for many years, and given the option now, they will be going back to their roots…
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Well actually it doesn't matter if the new Camaro or Challenger are good bad or ugly, it doesn’t matter if they are equal to, better or worse. The Mustang will lose sales to the Camaro and Challenger regardless of how it stacks up against them simply by virtue of the fact that many Mustang buyers are actually Chevy and Dodge Boys who have had only one Pony Car choice, The Ford Mustang, for many years, and given the option now, they will be going back to their roots…