What's the BFD with IRS?
10/30/08, 05:33 PM
#501
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Yes, I wanted you to pull out the data. 
Do you really think that a mustang shopper also looks at the Nissan and Accord? Highly doubtful. The camaro, yes. The camaro isnt even in the game yet! When it does come around the mustang will shoot right back in front with its newer powertrains. Maybe the 2010 is a lame duck year with holdover powertrains. Maybe not. Nothing is set in stone about the V6 application..yet.
Do you really think that a mustang shopper also looks at the Nissan and Accord? Highly doubtful. The camaro, yes. The camaro isnt even in the game yet! When it does come around the mustang will shoot right back in front with its newer powertrains. Maybe the 2010 is a lame duck year with holdover powertrains. Maybe not. Nothing is set in stone about the V6 application..yet.Though I'm partial to the Mustang I have also owned other coupes, a Toyota Celica and a Mitsubishi 3000GT. Both, were like the Mustang in that they offered style and performance. Now the imports are making outstanding power from V6s some reaching V8 levels. If I was forced to go with a V6 I'd choose the Accord over the Mustang.
The Mustang is a quick affordable car, anyone looking to go fast for cheap money will consider all alternatives. Go to a local drag strip, I bet you will see as many imports and compacts compared to Mustangs and Camaros...... SRT4s vs Cobalt SS and is almost the Mustang vs. Camaro of the next generation.
10/30/08, 05:41 PM
#502
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Say what you will about preferring the SRA but where are you basing your 98% claim? This is simply not true! I will bet my life saving that the Camaro SS will be the better handling car compared to the upcoming Mustang! The idea of added cost is a myth. Back in 99' Ford added an IRS to the Mustang Cobra and added minimal cost to the MSRP and the car benefited a great deal.
IRS power levels? The fastest cars in the world all have them (Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborghini...)! Look at the newest and greatest American supercar the 09' Corvette ZR1. We care talking well north of 600HP from the factory with an "overrated" IRS setup!
IRS power levels? The fastest cars in the world all have them (Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborghini...)! Look at the newest and greatest American supercar the 09' Corvette ZR1. We care talking well north of 600HP from the factory with an "overrated" IRS setup!
What about the 05-06 GTO, newest Nissan 350Z, RX8. Yes only the GTO is a V8 but the other two are fairly powerful RWD coupes with IRS than handle quite well within the price range of a Mustang GT, heck the Subaru WRX is an engineering marvel and priced about the same as a Mustang GT.
I guess my main argument is that blaming cost as the culprit for not getting an IRS is bogus. Ford's 99-04 IRS equipped Cobras where within the same price range as the SS Camaro of the day.
10/30/08, 05:43 PM
#503
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I agree with jarradsay, how are these cars not competition to the Mustang? They are all sporty coupes with similar power. These cars are all about style and performance over function. While the typical 4 cyl 4 door mid-size sedan is the more popular choice during these days, most average coupe consumers (typically young, single, no children) would consider all these cars.
Though I'm partial to the Mustang I have also owned other coupes, a Toyota Celica and a Mitsubishi 3000GT. Both, were like the Mustang in that they offered style and performance. Now the imports are making outstanding power from V6s some reaching V8 levels. If I was forced to go with a V6 I'd choose the Accord over the Mustang.
The Mustang is a quick affordable car, anyone looking to go fast for cheap money will consider all alternatives. Go to a local drag strip, I bet you will see as many imports and compacts compared to Mustangs and Camaros...... SRT4s vs Cobalt SS and is almost the Mustang vs. Camaro of the next generation.
Though I'm partial to the Mustang I have also owned other coupes, a Toyota Celica and a Mitsubishi 3000GT. Both, were like the Mustang in that they offered style and performance. Now the imports are making outstanding power from V6s some reaching V8 levels. If I was forced to go with a V6 I'd choose the Accord over the Mustang.
The Mustang is a quick affordable car, anyone looking to go fast for cheap money will consider all alternatives. Go to a local drag strip, I bet you will see as many imports and compacts compared to Mustangs and Camaros...... SRT4s vs Cobalt SS and is almost the Mustang vs. Camaro of the next generation.
10/30/08, 05:46 PM
#504
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I guess my main argument is that blaming cost as the culprit for not getting an IRS is bogus. Ford's 99-04 IRS equipped Cobras where within the same price range as the SS Camaro of the day.[/QUOTE]
I always thought I would like the RX8, until I saw the price and then drove it. Way underpowered. WRX wasnt as fast or quick as the mustang. Would be fun driving our ice covered roads, or dirt roads. But I definitely dont like the current styling. Liked the previous generation.
10/30/08, 06:06 PM
#505
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I always thought I would like the RX8, until I saw the price and then drove it. Way underpowered. WRX wasnt as fast or quick as the mustang. Would be fun driving our ice covered roads, or dirt roads. But I definitely dont like the current styling. Liked the previous generation.[/quote]
Hey Subaru has quickly learned the era of their ways after an unpopular 08' into. The 09' WRX now has a lot more power 265HP! Magazines list them reaching 0-60 in 4.8 sec and 1/4 in 13.5 for less money than a Mustang GT! It is a blast to drive, AWD turbos are cool I think Ford should offer us something like this once we get the euro spec Focus in the US.
As far as styling goes it has grown on me, less boy-racer than the previous gen. I'm not saying a WRX would ever replace my Mustang but, it would be a worthy stablemate
Hey Subaru has quickly learned the era of their ways after an unpopular 08' into. The 09' WRX now has a lot more power 265HP! Magazines list them reaching 0-60 in 4.8 sec and 1/4 in 13.5 for less money than a Mustang GT! It is a blast to drive, AWD turbos are cool I think Ford should offer us something like this once we get the euro spec Focus in the US.
As far as styling goes it has grown on me, less boy-racer than the previous gen. I'm not saying a WRX would ever replace my Mustang but, it would be a worthy stablemate
10/30/08, 07:35 PM
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my buddy bought a '05 WRX STI brand new and had it for a little over a yr....that car was a real thrill...and I am not a fan of imports really...but he sold it for a brand new Silverado...
10/30/08, 09:08 PM
#507
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Most of the cars you are listing are NOT PONY CARS.
Yeah, they are in the same class with the Mustang like the early 70's Opel GT was in the same class as the Corvette. That must be why the Opel GT was commonly referred to as the poor man's Corvette...
The Mustang has always been the "original" Pony Car and it still is the preeminent a Pony Car.
The pony car is a class of automobile launched and inspired by the Ford Mustang in 1964. It describes an affordable, compact, highly styled car with a sporty or performance-oriented image.
Iacocca's marketing studies revealed that if a unique-looking sporty car could be offered at an affordable price, it would find many buyers. Ford's response to this demand was the Mustang, launched on April 17, 1964, which proved to be an enormous success. The company was forecasting sales for the first year to reach 100,000 units. However, Ford dealers took 22,000 orders the first day and the company had to shift production mid-year. The extended model year sales totaled 618,812 Mustangs.
Defining the class
The Mustang provided the template for the new class of automobiles. Although it was based on the platform of the Falcon, it had a unique body (offered as a hardtop coupé and a convertible) with distinctive, "long hood, short deck" proportions. In basic form it was mechanically mundane, with a 170 cu in (2.8 L) six-cylinder engine coupled to a three-speed manual transmission. It carried an attractive base price of US$2,368 that included bucket seats, carpeting, floor shifter, sport steering wheel, and full wheel covers. The Mustang also had an extensive option list offering a range of V8 engines, Cruise-O-Matic automatic transmission or four-speed manual gearbox, radios, air conditioning, power steering, and other accessories. A V8 Mustang with all available options would cost about 60% more than a basic model with a six-cylinder engine, which made it an extremely profitable model for Ford.
The requirements were therefore set:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pony_car
The new Camaro and Challenger are modern Pony Cars, most of the cars you are listing are NOT PONY CARS.Iacocca's marketing studies revealed that if a unique-looking sporty car could be offered at an affordable price, it would find many buyers. Ford's response to this demand was the Mustang, launched on April 17, 1964, which proved to be an enormous success. The company was forecasting sales for the first year to reach 100,000 units. However, Ford dealers took 22,000 orders the first day and the company had to shift production mid-year. The extended model year sales totaled 618,812 Mustangs.
Defining the class
The Mustang provided the template for the new class of automobiles. Although it was based on the platform of the Falcon, it had a unique body (offered as a hardtop coupé and a convertible) with distinctive, "long hood, short deck" proportions. In basic form it was mechanically mundane, with a 170 cu in (2.8 L) six-cylinder engine coupled to a three-speed manual transmission. It carried an attractive base price of US$2,368 that included bucket seats, carpeting, floor shifter, sport steering wheel, and full wheel covers. The Mustang also had an extensive option list offering a range of V8 engines, Cruise-O-Matic automatic transmission or four-speed manual gearbox, radios, air conditioning, power steering, and other accessories. A V8 Mustang with all available options would cost about 60% more than a basic model with a six-cylinder engine, which made it an extremely profitable model for Ford.
The requirements were therefore set:
- Attractive, sporty styling
- Affordable base price
- Extensive options, including six-cylinder and V8 engines
- Aggressive, youth-oriented marketing and advertising.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pony_car
The Mustang has always been the "original" Pony Car and it still is the preeminent a Pony Car.
Last edited by Black GT500; 10/30/08 at 09:13 PM.
10/31/08, 12:09 AM
#509
Cobra Member
Yes, I wanted you to pull out the data. Do you really think that a mustang shopper also looks at the Nissan and Accord? Highly doubtful. The camaro, yes. The camaro isnt even in the game yet! When it does come around the mustang will shoot right back in front with its newer powertrains. Maybe the 2010 is a lame duck year with holdover powertrains. Maybe not. Nothing is set in stone about the V6 application..yet.
Do you really think that a mustang shopper also looks at the Nissan and Accord? Highly doubtful. The camaro, yes. The camaro isnt even in the game yet! When it does come around the mustang will shoot right back in front with its newer powertrains. Maybe the 2010 is a lame duck year with holdover powertrains. Maybe not. Nothing is set in stone about the V6 application..yet.
10/31/08, 10:50 AM
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You might also want to throw in the new Hyundai Coupe as it is, in 3.8 form, a RWD 2+2 sport coupe with more HP than a Stang GT and arguably better brakes and suspension (Brembos and IRS). I don't doubt that there will be some cross shopping outside of each makes own fanboys. Now if Hyundai would drop that nice 4.6 in the thing, that would really shake up the Pony Car market with its first serious foreign V8 contender, but I don't think Hyundai has enough spine for that sort of bold move.
10/31/08, 12:02 PM
#513
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Yeah, they are in the same class with the Mustang like the early 70's Opel GT was in the same class as the Corvette. That must be why the Opel GT was commonly referred to as the poor man's Corvette...
The Mustang has always been the "original" Pony Car and it still is the preeminent a Pony Car.
The pony car is a class of automobile launched and inspired by the Ford Mustang in 1964. It describes an affordable, compact, highly styled car with a sporty or performance-oriented image.
Iacocca's marketing studies revealed that if a unique-looking sporty car could be offered at an affordable price, it would find many buyers. Ford's response to this demand was the Mustang, launched on April 17, 1964, which proved to be an enormous success. The company was forecasting sales for the first year to reach 100,000 units. However, Ford dealers took 22,000 orders the first day and the company had to shift production mid-year. The extended model year sales totaled 618,812 Mustangs.
Defining the class
The Mustang provided the template for the new class of automobiles. Although it was based on the platform of the Falcon, it had a unique body (offered as a hardtop coupé and a convertible) with distinctive, "long hood, short deck" proportions. In basic form it was mechanically mundane, with a 170 cu in (2.8 L) six-cylinder engine coupled to a three-speed manual transmission. It carried an attractive base price of US$2,368 that included bucket seats, carpeting, floor shifter, sport steering wheel, and full wheel covers. The Mustang also had an extensive option list offering a range of V8 engines, Cruise-O-Matic automatic transmission or four-speed manual gearbox, radios, air conditioning, power steering, and other accessories. A V8 Mustang with all available options would cost about 60% more than a basic model with a six-cylinder engine, which made it an extremely profitable model for Ford.
The requirements were therefore set:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pony_car
The new Camaro and Challenger are modern Pony Cars, most of the cars you are listing are NOT PONY CARS.Iacocca's marketing studies revealed that if a unique-looking sporty car could be offered at an affordable price, it would find many buyers. Ford's response to this demand was the Mustang, launched on April 17, 1964, which proved to be an enormous success. The company was forecasting sales for the first year to reach 100,000 units. However, Ford dealers took 22,000 orders the first day and the company had to shift production mid-year. The extended model year sales totaled 618,812 Mustangs.
Defining the class
The Mustang provided the template for the new class of automobiles. Although it was based on the platform of the Falcon, it had a unique body (offered as a hardtop coupé and a convertible) with distinctive, "long hood, short deck" proportions. In basic form it was mechanically mundane, with a 170 cu in (2.8 L) six-cylinder engine coupled to a three-speed manual transmission. It carried an attractive base price of US$2,368 that included bucket seats, carpeting, floor shifter, sport steering wheel, and full wheel covers. The Mustang also had an extensive option list offering a range of V8 engines, Cruise-O-Matic automatic transmission or four-speed manual gearbox, radios, air conditioning, power steering, and other accessories. A V8 Mustang with all available options would cost about 60% more than a basic model with a six-cylinder engine, which made it an extremely profitable model for Ford.
The requirements were therefore set:
- Attractive, sporty styling
- Affordable base price
- Extensive options, including six-cylinder and V8 engines
- Aggressive, youth-oriented marketing and advertising.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pony_car
The Mustang has always been the "original" Pony Car and it still is the preeminent a Pony Car.
10/31/08, 12:29 PM
#515
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I think the main difference in performance between the Asian and US cars is that the Americans focus more on power and acceleration while the Asians focus more on overall handling.
10/31/08, 06:41 PM
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I have alot of friends that have imports as mentioned above, and I don't consider any of them at any point in time to ever purchase or think about purchasing a mustang. They are more into light, better handling cars with more european styling cues. Now me, I like a car that forces me into my seat when I put the pedal to the floor, but thats just me.
11/1/08, 07:38 AM
#518
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You might also want to throw in the new Hyundai Coupe as it is, in 3.8 form, a RWD 2+2 sport coupe with more HP than a Stang GT and arguably better brakes and suspension (Brembos and IRS). I don't doubt that there will be some cross shopping outside of each makes own fanboys. Now if Hyundai would drop that nice 4.6 in the thing, that would really shake up the Pony Car market with its first serious foreign V8 contender, but I don't think Hyundai has enough spine for that sort of bold move.
Hyundai's Coupe (Genesis i think is called) will offer two good engines. The basic and mid trim will have a turbo 2.0L four cyl at 220 hp and the premium will have a 310 hp 3.8L V6 Here are more details.
And a sedan version is offered too, with an optional 4.6L V8
in Europe by the moment 
11/2/08, 12:40 PM
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11/2/08, 04:53 PM
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