Overboost

Apples and oranges.

Zastava_101

Not really.
If people's buying power didn't go up by 20% or so in 5 years, neither should prices of cars. I understand that every new model is better than the previous one and needs to be more expensive, but we're talking about $8,000 difference in prices in only 5 years. Not even Mustang GT went up that much, and they switched from the old 4.6L to the new 5.0L.
I'm sorry, but I just don't like global products. If I wanted a Euro styled and powered car (at European high prices), I would look at Volkswagen - not Ford.

Overboost

No, it really is. Ford doesn't influence the public's disposable income, so pricing is driven by it's own costs and profit margins. VW is a **** poor example of how to cut costs and try to sell more cars. How many $14k Jettas do you see running around, or on dealer lots for that matter? Very few.

If you're buying a new car today, the costs for a car of the same segment from multiple car makers are close. I'd say within $1500 of one another. Throw incentives in the mix and you're right on par with one another. I don't get how blaming Ford for rising costs makes it better. You act like they're the only ones who do it.

With that said, watch the price of the Fusion over the new models life. They'll probably increase at a fraction of the 2012-13 because the costs of an all new platform and R&D cost isn't free.

Zastava_101

I'm not saying that Ford is doing something that the rest of the industry is not doing. And there is a thing or two that Ford could do. Not everybody wants loaded cars. I personally don't want any special equipment on my car. CD player, A/C and power windows - that's it, I don't need leather seats, SYNC .... So yeah, I actually like the move that VW made with Jetta and I wish Ford would follow up with Focus. I don't care if 95% of the cars on dealer lots are loaded with fancy equipment. Its nice to know that for people like myself there are still choices out there (and with Ford, there just aren't). And if I have to visit 10 dealers to maybe find one car like that - that's fine, I can live with that.
Like I said, I just hate that all of the sudden, Ford has become just another import. Their cars look nothing American and they also don't drive like traditional Fords. I wish Ford stayed with their traditional roots, where their cars maybe were not the best, but they offered the best value for the money. Instead of this "we're just as good as Toyota and/or Honda, but you also need to pay Toyota's/Honda's prices for our cars". If I wanted to pay Honda's high prices, I would buy a Honda (not Ford), at least I would know that I would be getting the best re-sale value 5 or 6 years from now.

Evil_Capri

2013 Fusion S Starting MSRP $21,700
2013 Focus S Starting MSRP $16,200

Subjective statement. Actually I think it could be argued that Toyota's drive like "traditional" American cars . . . they remind me of the "new" Oldsmobile for the 21st Century. Which is fine for many, many people . . .


If you want a stripped out old person's car . . . get a used Crown Vic. (No offense to old people, or Crown Vics!)

Zastava_101

True, but for $22,000 you get the Fusion with the outdated 2.5L engine which is rated at only 170 hp and 22/34 mpg or something like that. I would rather get the new Nissan Altima which is rated at 182 hp and 28/37 mpg for the same money.
The cheapest EcoBoost (that can match Altima's power and fuel economy) starts at $25,000, which IMO, is just too much.

I'm actually regreting the decision that I didn't buy one of old-body-style 2011 Focus when the new global model came out. They were really cheap back then, I saw them for as little as $12,000 brand new after all discounts.

Flagstang

lets agree that you are be overly cheap and move on..

Zastava_101

Think what you want, it makes no difference to me ...

Flagstang

I just do not understand the whole "this car is 800 less and that car has 3 more hp".. Pick what you like and go with it.

Zastava_101

I liked Fords because I always felt they're offering the most for the price.
But I don't think that's the case anymore.

I like Kia Optima's and Nissan Altima's offers and prices, but I still couldn't imagine driving a car without Ford's badge on it.

Flagstang

I look to the old saying "you get what you pay for"

Overboost

I think they're hitting strides on value more now than ever. They've trimmed the fat and got to a point where they make quality vehicles that are class leading in many cases, they drive better than ever and finally have a "soul", even at the base level. They've righted the ship and become a competitive force in the market.

StangMahn

I'd much rather pay 3k extra for a car at the start, than something I'm going to dislike in 2 years, have to spend a fortune on repairs, and not be able to sell it for a decent price.

Say what you will, but Ford is making some fantastic cars right now. I'm trying to find a used car for my sister, and it's absolutely impossible to find an older Fusion at a decent price, because people know what they can get for them. They're not as bad as Honda's, but they're not too far off.

New cars cost money, new technologies cost money, new laws cost money, that's just the way it (unfortunately) is. I spoke with one of Ford's exec's a few months ago, and this was one of the subjects we spoke about. They hate the pricing going up as much as the next guy, but they're forced to. As for you saying all you want is a cd player and power windows, remember, that's just you. Most people these days want 57-way power seats, satnav, a sync like system, and 900 mpg. You can't get all that for the same price as a simple power windows and cd player price. Shocking, isn't it. That's the way of the industry these days. They know they have to have gadgets and economy, or people will buy something else, even if it's for a bit more.

Zastava_101

Why not offer both? Offer a stripped down cheap car for people like me and offer more expensive loaded cars for people who want them. Everyone wins.

Flagstang

I would think having a split stock like that would suck at the end of the year to sell and it would harm values for the higher model.

Overboost

Not to mention offering a car devoid of modern electronic features for manual ones creates engineering expenses for other variations of the vehicle. Factor the additional cost in vs. the projected sales and I doubt it makes sense.

I think it's time to finally admit that in the US, anything compact and up isn't going to be manual windows and no AC. Deal with it.

Zastava_101

It can be done; Ford just chose to move up in class and not to deal with customers who made Ford what it is today.

Volkswagen, the most successful car company in the world, managed to build and sell Passat in the USA for under $20,000. Sure, they have more expensive models (SEL V6 starts at $33,000), but they managed to earn $20+ billion in profit last year by offering anything from 8,000 euros Up to 80,000 euros Phaeton.

cdynaco

What do you mean? That is a huge (and incorrect) generalization.

I helped Ford become what it is today and I still buy Ford. And my income level stinks.

Overboost

Oh they did? Or did they just try to be more efficient with their funds and engineering and not waste it on stuff the majority of the buying public doesn't want. Again, you act like Ford is the only one doing this, and they aren't. Stop being narrow minded and not looking at the big picture.

VW is a bad example, simply because they are the most profitable auto maker around right now. If you look at GM, Chrysler, and Toyota, they are very similar to Ford and their product strategy. They've moved into the 21st century, maybe it's time for you to do the same.

Zastava_101

I really wouldn't use GM and Chrysler as examples. Their poor product strategy (among many other reasons) is the reason why government had to save them. And even a big Toyota had their shares of losses over the past few years.

VW is the most profitable car company in the world because every sale is important to them, no matter how cheap (Skoda, Seat, VW) or expensive (Audi, Porsche, Lamborghini, Bentley, Bugatti) is. Anything from 6,500 euros Skoda Citigo to 1.5 milion euros Bugatti Veyron. Its the same strategy that made GM #1 back in the 1920s.