cdynaco

So is my neighbor's Kia...

Zastava_101

How many vehicles Jaguar and Aston Martin were selling each year? Maybe 40,000-50,000?
I don't see VW and Toyota having declined sale due to automotive climate.

No, I don't think Ford builds crap anymore. I just don't think that Ford should be asking same MSRPs as Toyota and Honda. After all, Ford almost went out of business not that long ago and does not have reputation for quality (not to mention resale value compared to Toyota and Honda).
Why would I spend same amount of money on, let's say Focus instead of Civic? Focus drives better, no doubt about that, but Civic is well known for quality and 10 years from now will be worth much more $$$.

Zastava_101

Ask him if he wants to do a trade.

Zastava_101

How exactly is Ford any different?

AlsCobra

Ford is no different. The F150, Mustang, and the now gone Crown Vic were always great products. Everything else Ford has Produced in the last 20 years has been CRAP! Yeah I said it. CRAP! Not to say that GM or Chrysler has really been any better. Honda and Toyota have went down in quality in the last few years also though. It seems that reliability and quality have taken a back seat to technology. I have seen power windows, windshield wipers, power seats, power door locks, stereos, hvac systems, etc etc etc.... Last 20 years without a problem. Now none of that lasts 3/36. Honda was always a very simplistic vehicle and thats why they lasted. My point is, if it works great, why try and improve on it?

cdynaco

Ford did not 'almost go out of business'. You should stop spreading that falsehood. They leveraged their assets and reinvested that for future growth in a global business. If they were 'almost out of business', neither lenders or investors would have provided those funds to reorganize their business plan. No one with a brain would give money to a failing company that is beyond turnaround - even with collateral - because when a company fails their collateral takes a huge haircut also. Which means lenders and investors eat millions in losses.

It is YOUR opinion ad nauseum on this forum that Ford 'does not have reputation for quality'.

Regardless, that has nothing to do with what MSRP they should charge compared to (non-union) Toyota and Honda. They have to be competitive but they also have to cover their costs and overhead, engineering to stay ahead of the curve, add some profit, and reward their owners the shareholders.

I always appreciate your knowledge and point/counterpoint, but your dislike/lack of belief in Ford products is YOUR experience - not mine and not the whole world as you often imply.

I have hundreds of thousands of miles on FORD's in rural areas in all weather, where if you're stranded due to mechanical failure you're screwed for a few days. The success of my career depended upon my vehicles as well as my ability. Since 1981, with experience on 10 different new Ford's, I have not had any flaws from the factory, nor had any problems that left me stranded as the miles and years added up. I would trade after 100k (except for my F150).
On one, I had a fuel filter starting to plug (90's ethanol) but still ran to get me to a gas station, and another one had a relay issue that was problematic that a Chevron station replaced. That is it!
Even when my F150 broke a ring at 215k, it still ran. $9600 new off the lot, $1800 new engine, I have gotten my money out of that Ford many times over. Bullitt has been absolutely flawless.

Sorry you've had bad luck, but the track record from my personal experience keeps me coming back to Ford.

Zastava_101

I didn't really had too bad of experiences with Fords, but I always liked them because I felt I was getting the most for my money. Yeah they broke down every now and then, but they were not overpriced like Toyotas and Hondas and they had the most standard equipment. So I didn't mind spending few hundreds of dollars on repairs every now and then, since I got it for thousands cheaper than Toyota or Honda.
But all that changed lately and that's my problem with newer Fords - they're just as overpriced as Toyotas and Hondas. I have no doubts that they're built well, but Ford still needs to prove that their cars can last for a long time. I don't care how well built they're brand new, I don't wanna have any issues as soon as my warranty is up.
I'm glad your F-150 has been reliable for you, but last summer I spent $400 on mine to replace brakes. And this is a truck with 22,000 miles on the odometer. I could've got killed on the highway when brakes failed at 70 mph (so much for Toyota's brakes issues, I almost got killed by Ford).
My 190,000 miles Camry doesn't has brake issue and 20,000 miles F-150 does?

I would still buy a new Ford, but only if its thousands of dollars cheaper than Civic or Corolla. That's why I like Korean cars, I feel they're not overpriced and you get the most for your money.

Flagstang

doesnt sound like you take good care of your cars.

Flagstang

its bull how this thread about the new little ford became ford vs kia... this thread is about how great the little suv is and how much people like it. Things are cheap for a reason.. not everyone is worried about a coule grand when it comes to buying something that you will really liek vs buying a kia. Some would rather go to mom and pop shops and some would buy american over others. Stop being so cheap you only live once.

ford20

I like the escape, I have yet to see one in person since last I checked none of the dealers had them in stock but I wouldn't mind owning one. The interior looks nice and it seems like a nice little SUV for a DD but I prefer bigger cars like the Crown Vics and the Taurus and am not really an SUV person. But I think ford has a really good product on their hands with the Escape.

Ok well my 1991 Crown Victoria had around 140,000 miles on it before I got rid of it and didnt have many issues, my 2003 Crown Vic had 180,000+ miles on it before the original tranny went, at work the 2003 E-350 7.3L Power Stroke had 340,00o miles on it. My Moms 92 Taurus Station Wagon had around 140,000 miles on it before she wrecked it without any issues.

cdynaco

Thousands cheaper? Never gonna happen. Nor should it.

I've had 2 Toyota's in my life. Pretty dependable. Took em both over 100k. But what tune up and maintenance parts I did need were priced in the $tupid range. Trans ocean shipping, exchange rate, and all that.

ANY part from ANY brand - regardless of that part being proven dependable - reserves the right to fail at any time. Yet you judge (and often slam) Ford because of YOUR one part that failed. At 22k that should have been fixed under new car warranty. If you bought it used, then you have no idea how the previous owner cared for the vehicle.

You got a bad part. Get over it.



I'm not convinced on the new Escape. I'm not sure about all of these short wheel base, semi high center of gravity SUV's, on mountain roads in the snow. I'd have to drive one in winter conditions to be convinced. But for city living it might be a hoot.

Zastava_101

I took great care of my cars.
After all, my '94 Camry did last 190,000 miles and its still running strong.

Zastava_101

I bought it brand new. Dealership refused to fix it under warranty, stating that its was a normal wear and tear.

MARZ

Yikes, I was merely asking the source of your information. By "automotive climate," I was referring to massive vehicles such as big trucks and SUVs the Big 3 used to sell in mass quantities earlier this decade. When gas prices spiked, demand for them plummeted. Ford and GM were caught unprepared, in my opinion, because they were so focused on said large, albeit very profitable, vehicles -- VW and Toyota were not, as well as other, foreign automakers. When demand for gas-guzzling vehicles dropped, the roles reversed -- consumers began looking for smaller, more-efficient vehicles, moving away from trucks and SUVs, and that's exactly what VW and Toyota offered.

I would add that VW isn't exactly known for their quality vehicles -- none of the German automakers are, as far as I know. Toyota, once known for their stellar quality, aren't what they used to be, either.

Rick Schmidt

How Dare that 12 + year old car not still be just like it was when it was new. I Guess I should be mad too since my 01 has a few glitches in it now. And if it's falling apart as bad as ya say I'd have to agree about taking care of it better. My 01 has 65000 on it and while it has glitches and a few other issues related to age it's not "falling apart" but then I do take care of her and she wasn't mistreated by her previous owners.

Zastava_101

Depends where you live ... VWs have been pretty reliable in Europe.

My aunt has a '85 VW Golf 1.6 diesel, there is almost 550,000 km (345,000 miles) on the odometer and she still uses it as a daily driver.

MARZ

I guess, applying your logic, I can assert that Ford has impecable quality because I'm on my third FMC vehicle and have had ZERO problems with any of them. My dad once owned a 1999 or 2000 Jetta TDI, and my mother, a 2002 or 2003 TDI. Both of their VWs were plagued with electrical gremlins almost from day one, though, gremlins notwithstanding, both were great cars with excellent, über-efficient diesel engines. I'd also like to add that my dad's 2003 Dodge Ram Cummins has almost 200,000 miles on it and, as far as I know, he's experienced no quality issues. In fact, the interior is still squeak- and rattle-free and he's still on the original brakes!

Flagstang

my first car was a 1993 ford taurus gl and I sold it with 150k miles and all it ever needed was tires, belts, water pump and windshields. I lived in WA and it made it though snow, salt, ice, rain, the ocean, mud and and never had any rust because I washed it and kept it clean and that was my first car. Now I take even better car of my cars.

Flagstang

anywho

:backontopic:

The head room is really good. The littel suv handles very well. The options are really nice! I like that you can turn the stereo on to plan wihtout needing the key. The 2.0 ecoboost is fun! The rear cargo area work for anything I need. It really is like a big fiesta.

Resolution78

LOL..... this thread has turned into mayhem..... heck even i had issues with an 80s ford ranger 3 trannies in one year..... to bad ford was paying an import company MAZDA for there tranns if i remember right......

I'm sure it had nothing to do with me driving like a complete @#$% spinning second chirping third and having a welded posi rear in it. ( i got it free 7.5 inch not sure why it never broke lol )

I'm hard on everything i own and i know why i blow up transmissions when i do.

I made the mistake of COSIGNING for a 2003 tiberon..... at like 30k miles when the wheel bearing went bad for the second time the dealer wouldnt cover it said i must have hit a big pothole or something.... i traded it in on my 2005 dodge ram daytona truck before it got outa the shop ( wish i bought a roush now )

shore imports may be assembled in the US, but where are the parts made going into these cars made, there info out there..... our beloved mustang is around 50 percent imported parts...... this still makes me sad but i love my boss regardless