Ford to Build the 2015 GT350!
1/3/13 | 09:11 PM
#81
FR500 Member
Joined: December 9, 2011
Posts: 3,513
Likes: 6
From: Corpus Christi, TX
I have to agree; too narrow of a power gap between base and V6.
2.3 Ecoboost Base model (285-300hp)-it might most likely be a 2.0 Eco.
3.7 V6 base(330 hp) with optional 3.5 Ecoboost V6 (365 hp)
GT, Carryover V8 (440-450hp)
GT350 DI 5.0L V8 (525 hp)
GT500 Ecoboost(twin turbo and DI) 5.0L V8 (600+ hp)-probably not available until 2016/17.
All come standard with SRA, with optional IRS for those who want it. And hopefully no MT82s. I could be wrong about the power gaps though. The ford edge 3.5L V6 is rated very close to the 3.7L V6 sport (less than 20 hp gap.) So who knows
1/4/13 | 10:28 AM
#82
I might edit the above slightly to:
S: 2.0 Ecoboost Base model (275hp) -As much for the higher MPG as anything else. Maybe going to 2.3l but more for a broadened torque band than peak numbers.
SE: 3.7 V6 base (325-350 hp) - A V motor upgrade that will provide good performance and music (beyond a four banger blat), and distinguish it from the increasingly ubiquitous UTF (Universal Turbo Four), yet still with good mpg.
ST: 3.5 Ecoboost V6 (375-400 hp) - Seems to be working well in the F-150 trucks, so why not on the Stangs. Basically, this will be a more avant garde approach to performance and more mpg-friendly option than the...
GT: 5.0 V8 (425hp) - Basically a carry over for those old-schoolers who must have a V8, if perhaps with DI more for mpg than hp benefits.
GT350: DI 5.0L V8 (450-475 hp) - Basically a tuned GT 5.0 with added DI (presuming GT doesn't already have it). While only slightly more powerful than the Boss models it supersedes, lighter weight and modern suspension will give significantly better overall performance.
GT500: EB 5.0 (twin turbo and DI) 5.0L V8 (550-600 hp) - Maybe down somewhat from the stratospheric (ridiculous) power levels of the SC 5.7, but lighter weight, sleeker body and better trannies will basically maintain performance but with a significant boost in mpg and decrease in stink. Rumors hint that it might well appear in MY 2015, if not launched right alongside the lesser Stangs.
If the lineup is a bit cluttered between the 2nd and 4th options, then I would surmise the 3.7 would be the one to go.
Overall there won't be huge boosts in HP and, in some instances, the numbers might go down a bit (GT500). However, there will be a greater emphasis on overall performance with the new, lighter, sleeker and more sophisticated S550 platform, so actual numerical performance will at least be maintained if not increased slightly.
Dynamic, and thus useable, performance will be much better than the current platform and driving enjoyment even greater yet. It will be less about simply how fast the Stang will go (still very fast), but how well the Stang goes fast (much better). All this while complying with ever more stringent efficiency and stink standards.
Pure/simple numbers guys and bar stool racers might be slightly disappointed by this seeming stasis, but those who actually take the wheel and drive will be delighted by the actual experience.
Anyways, there my crystal ball, for today.
S: 2.0 Ecoboost Base model (275hp) -As much for the higher MPG as anything else. Maybe going to 2.3l but more for a broadened torque band than peak numbers.
SE: 3.7 V6 base (325-350 hp) - A V motor upgrade that will provide good performance and music (beyond a four banger blat), and distinguish it from the increasingly ubiquitous UTF (Universal Turbo Four), yet still with good mpg.
ST: 3.5 Ecoboost V6 (375-400 hp) - Seems to be working well in the F-150 trucks, so why not on the Stangs. Basically, this will be a more avant garde approach to performance and more mpg-friendly option than the...
GT: 5.0 V8 (425hp) - Basically a carry over for those old-schoolers who must have a V8, if perhaps with DI more for mpg than hp benefits.
GT350: DI 5.0L V8 (450-475 hp) - Basically a tuned GT 5.0 with added DI (presuming GT doesn't already have it). While only slightly more powerful than the Boss models it supersedes, lighter weight and modern suspension will give significantly better overall performance.
GT500: EB 5.0 (twin turbo and DI) 5.0L V8 (550-600 hp) - Maybe down somewhat from the stratospheric (ridiculous) power levels of the SC 5.7, but lighter weight, sleeker body and better trannies will basically maintain performance but with a significant boost in mpg and decrease in stink. Rumors hint that it might well appear in MY 2015, if not launched right alongside the lesser Stangs.
If the lineup is a bit cluttered between the 2nd and 4th options, then I would surmise the 3.7 would be the one to go.
Overall there won't be huge boosts in HP and, in some instances, the numbers might go down a bit (GT500). However, there will be a greater emphasis on overall performance with the new, lighter, sleeker and more sophisticated S550 platform, so actual numerical performance will at least be maintained if not increased slightly.
Dynamic, and thus useable, performance will be much better than the current platform and driving enjoyment even greater yet. It will be less about simply how fast the Stang will go (still very fast), but how well the Stang goes fast (much better). All this while complying with ever more stringent efficiency and stink standards.
Pure/simple numbers guys and bar stool racers might be slightly disappointed by this seeming stasis, but those who actually take the wheel and drive will be delighted by the actual experience.
Anyways, there my crystal ball, for today.
1/4/13 | 10:41 AM
#83
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: January 6, 2006
Posts: 14,047
Likes: 166
From: Bay Area, CA
I might edit the above slightly to:
S: 2.0 Ecoboost Base model (275hp) -As much for the higher MPG as anything else. Maybe going to 2.3l but more for a broadened torque band than peak numbers.
SE: 3.7 V6 base (325-350 hp) - A V motor upgrade that will provide good performance and music (beyond a four banger blat), and distinguish it from the increasingly ubiquitous UTF (Universal Turbo Four), yet still with good mpg.
ST: 3.5 Ecoboost V6 (375-400 hp) - Seems to be working well in the F-150 trucks, so why not on the Stangs. Basically, this will be a more avant garde approach to performance and more mpg-friendly option than the...
GT: 5.0 V8 (425hp) - Basically a carry over for those old-schoolers who must have a V8, if perhaps with DI more for mpg than hp benefits.
GT350: DI 5.0L V8 (450-475 hp) - Basically a tuned GT 5.0 with added DI (presuming GT doesn't already have it). While only slightly more powerful than the Boss models it supersedes, lighter weight and modern suspension will give significantly better overall performance.
GT500: EB 5.0 (twin turbo and DI) 5.0L V8 (550-600 hp) - Maybe down somewhat from the stratospheric (ridiculous) power levels of the SC 5.7, but lighter weight, sleeker body and better trannies will basically maintain performance but with a significant boost in mpg and decrease in stink. Rumors hint that it might well appear in MY 2015, if not launched right alongside the lesser Stangs.
If the lineup is a bit cluttered between the 2nd and 4th options, then I would surmise the 3.7 would be the one to go.
Overall there won't be huge boosts in HP and, in some instances, the numbers might go down a bit (GT500). However, there will be a greater emphasis on overall performance with the new, lighter, sleeker and more sophisticated S550 platform, so actual numerical performance will at least be maintained if not increased slightly.
Dynamic, and thus useable, performance will be much better than the current platform and driving enjoyment even greater yet. It will be less about simply how fast the Stang will go (still very fast), but how well the Stang goes fast (much better). All this while complying with ever more stringent efficiency and stink standards.
Pure/simple numbers guys and bar stool racers might be slightly disappointed by this seeming stasis, but those who actually take the wheel and drive will be delighted by the actual experience.
Anyways, there my crystal ball, for today.
S: 2.0 Ecoboost Base model (275hp) -As much for the higher MPG as anything else. Maybe going to 2.3l but more for a broadened torque band than peak numbers.
SE: 3.7 V6 base (325-350 hp) - A V motor upgrade that will provide good performance and music (beyond a four banger blat), and distinguish it from the increasingly ubiquitous UTF (Universal Turbo Four), yet still with good mpg.
ST: 3.5 Ecoboost V6 (375-400 hp) - Seems to be working well in the F-150 trucks, so why not on the Stangs. Basically, this will be a more avant garde approach to performance and more mpg-friendly option than the...
GT: 5.0 V8 (425hp) - Basically a carry over for those old-schoolers who must have a V8, if perhaps with DI more for mpg than hp benefits.
GT350: DI 5.0L V8 (450-475 hp) - Basically a tuned GT 5.0 with added DI (presuming GT doesn't already have it). While only slightly more powerful than the Boss models it supersedes, lighter weight and modern suspension will give significantly better overall performance.
GT500: EB 5.0 (twin turbo and DI) 5.0L V8 (550-600 hp) - Maybe down somewhat from the stratospheric (ridiculous) power levels of the SC 5.7, but lighter weight, sleeker body and better trannies will basically maintain performance but with a significant boost in mpg and decrease in stink. Rumors hint that it might well appear in MY 2015, if not launched right alongside the lesser Stangs.
If the lineup is a bit cluttered between the 2nd and 4th options, then I would surmise the 3.7 would be the one to go.
Overall there won't be huge boosts in HP and, in some instances, the numbers might go down a bit (GT500). However, there will be a greater emphasis on overall performance with the new, lighter, sleeker and more sophisticated S550 platform, so actual numerical performance will at least be maintained if not increased slightly.
Dynamic, and thus useable, performance will be much better than the current platform and driving enjoyment even greater yet. It will be less about simply how fast the Stang will go (still very fast), but how well the Stang goes fast (much better). All this while complying with ever more stringent efficiency and stink standards.
Pure/simple numbers guys and bar stool racers might be slightly disappointed by this seeming stasis, but those who actually take the wheel and drive will be delighted by the actual experience.
Anyways, there my crystal ball, for today.
I've been saying this, minus the GT350 and probably minus the EB V6, but it does make for more choices. I think if Ford could leverage this many models under the Mustang lineup, they'd sell 200k easy. I'd swap the V6 and turbo 4 models though -
Base - 3.7 V6 carryover - fleet sales and budget minded consumers
ST - 2.3 T, 330/350 hp/torque - premium 4 banger option with higher mpg, and more torque than base model, spiritual successor to SVO
GT - 5.0 V8 carryover
GT350 - if Ford even gets the rights to use the name, 5.0 H.O. V8 or maybe EcoBoost V6, spiritual successor to original GT350 and/or Boss, I'd bet a tuned 5.0 though, and leave the EcoBoost V6 out of the Mustang altogether
GT500 - TT 5.0 V8 EgoBoost
1/4/13 | 11:27 AM
#84
Mach 1 Member
Joined: September 10, 2009
Posts: 956
Likes: 0
From: Boston
I've been saying this, minus the GT350 and probably minus the EB V6, but it does make for more choices. I think if Ford could leverage this many models under the Mustang lineup, they'd sell 200k easy. I'd swap the V6 and turbo 4 models though -
Base - 3.7 V6 carryover - fleet sales and budget minded consumers
ST - 2.3 T, 330/350 hp/torque - premium 4 banger option with higher mpg, and more torque than base model, spiritual successor to SVO
GT - 5.0 V8 carryover
GT350 - if Ford even gets the rights to use the name, 5.0 H.O. V8 or maybe EcoBoost V6, spiritual successor to original GT350 and/or Boss, I'd bet a tuned 5.0 though, and leave the EcoBoost V6 out of the Mustang altogether
GT500 - TT 5.0 V8 EgoBoost
Base - 3.7 V6 carryover - fleet sales and budget minded consumers
ST - 2.3 T, 330/350 hp/torque - premium 4 banger option with higher mpg, and more torque than base model, spiritual successor to SVO
GT - 5.0 V8 carryover
GT350 - if Ford even gets the rights to use the name, 5.0 H.O. V8 or maybe EcoBoost V6, spiritual successor to original GT350 and/or Boss, I'd bet a tuned 5.0 though, and leave the EcoBoost V6 out of the Mustang altogether
GT500 - TT 5.0 V8 EgoBoost
I dont think you will see anything between the base model and the GT, I dont think having a v6 and turbo 4 would make alot of sense as they would most likely be cannibalizing v6 buyers rather than bringing in incremental customers. I would think ford will go with one of them but not both. ford knows the typical base engine buyer is not an all out performance enthusiast (not that there are not a few budget minded ones out there) even the performance pack for the current v6 still retains the 120 mph speed limiter. I would think that if the turbo 4 offers the performance a customer would expect from a 20-25k base engine sports coupe they will go that route. if they feel a customer would not be happy with the performance they will stick with the v6.
I agree that the ecoboost 3.5 is a huge long shot, ford just doesn't sell enough mustangs to make it worth while to set the car up for basically the same performance as the GT with only a few MPG improvement. for a low volume vehicle it just wouldnt make sense to have numerous variants that they cannot charge significantly more for. from the f150 we know the 3.5 is actually more expensive than the 5.0 to put in a vehicle and ford sells more 3.5 ecoboost pickups than they do total mustangs. unlike the f150 the 5.0 is actually a better motor for this application with all things considered, raw, power, feel, sound...
1/4/13 | 11:39 AM
#85
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: January 6, 2006
Posts: 14,047
Likes: 166
From: Bay Area, CA
I dont think you will see anything between the base model and the GT, I dont think having a v6 and turbo 4 would make alot of sense as they would most likely be cannibalizing v6 buyers rather than bringing in incremental customers. I would think ford will go with one of them but not both. ford knows the typical base engine buyer is not an all out performance enthusiast (not that there are not a few budget minded ones out there) even the performance pack for the current v6 still retains the 120 mph speed limiter. I would think that if the turbo 4 offers the performance a customer would expect from a 20-25k base engine sports coupe they will go that route. if they feel a customer would not be happy with the performance they will stick with the v6.
I agree that the ecoboost 3.5 is a huge long shot, ford just doesn't sell enough mustangs to make it worth while to set the car up for basically the same performance as the GT with only a few MPG improvement. for a low volume vehicle it just wouldnt make sense to have numerous variants that they cannot charge significantly more for. from the f150 we know the 3.5 is actually more expensive than the 5.0 to put in a vehicle and ford sells more 3.5 ecoboost pickups than they do total mustangs. unlike the f150 the 5.0 is actually a better motor for this application with all things considered, raw, power, feel, sound...
I just don't see the lineup going turbo 4 to V8, though. I think they will carryover the V6 as the bargain basement model, that they can sell to rental agencies and people who want the simple 4-seat coupe without all the "doodads," then be able to sell the 2.0/2.3T model as a premium offering, with higher mpg and better performance than the V6. I guess we'll find out soon though...
Last edited by laserred38; 1/4/13 at 11:41 AM.
1/4/13 | 02:05 PM
#87
Mach 1 Member
Joined: September 10, 2009
Posts: 956
Likes: 0
From: Boston
Yes, but Ford isn't going to put a turbo 4 engine into the base model. It doesn't make financial sense for fleet cars. That and the turbo 4 is a premium option in most of the cars it's offered in, even the Edge and Explorer, not to mention the Fusion, Escape and Focus ST. That engine isn't a base model engine. Hyundai can get away with it because they don't sell G Coupes to fleets, they don't have a V8 high end model, and the 2.0T is marketed as a track car. It's already been said that a version of EcoBoost will show up in the next Mustang, so we know it's coming.
I just don't see the lineup going turbo 4 to V8, though. I think they will carryover the V6 as the bargain basement model, that they can sell to rental agencies and people who want the simple 4-seat coupe without all the "doodads," then be able to sell the 2.0/2.3T model as a premium offering, with higher mpg and better performance than the V6. I guess we'll find out soon though...
I just don't see the lineup going turbo 4 to V8, though. I think they will carryover the V6 as the bargain basement model, that they can sell to rental agencies and people who want the simple 4-seat coupe without all the "doodads," then be able to sell the 2.0/2.3T model as a premium offering, with higher mpg and better performance than the V6. I guess we'll find out soon though...
1/7/13 | 11:12 AM
#88
GTR Member
Joined: September 28, 2009
Posts: 6,284
Likes: 1
If this is true, I don't see it being anything other than a bespoke V8 for the car. Knowing the kinds of witchcraft and voodoo that SVT can whip up, I hope it's some type of NA Boss 302/ZL1 on steroids. Do the same thing they did with Raptor to Mustang; go outside their comfort zone and make one wild ride.
Last edited by Overboost; 1/7/13 at 11:22 AM.
1/7/13 | 11:16 AM
#89
I Have No Life
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 10,446
Likes: 12
From: Canada
If this is true, I don't see it being anything other than a bespoke V8 for the car. Knowing the kinds of witchcraft and voodoo that SVT can whip up, I hope it's some type of NA Boss 302/ZL1 on steroids. Do the same thing they did with Raptor to Mustang; go outside their comfort zone and make one wild ride.
Lil bit of black magic never hurt anyone.
Last edited by Boomer; 1/7/13 at 11:21 AM.
1/7/13 | 11:22 AM
#90
GTR Member
Joined: September 28, 2009
Posts: 6,284
Likes: 1
1/7/13 | 11:45 AM
#93
I Have No Life
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 10,446
Likes: 12
From: Canada
Base/GT/SVT
with the odd SE every cycle or 2
I doubt we'd see 2x SVT vehicles at the same time, on the same platform.
1/7/13 | 01:09 PM
#95
GTR Member
Joined: October 18, 2006
Posts: 5,553
Likes: 11
From: England
I think we've been spoilt by having both the Boss and the GT500 available at the same time.
Just thinking out loud..........Perhaps a GT350 would sit somewhere in the middle.......less powerful than the GT500, but a better balanced package, like the Boss. Lets face it, if the Trinity engine was a 2 year only deal, then beating 662bhp for the next generation car is going to be tough. I don't see it happening. But a Mustang that has the track ability of the Boss, with power somewhere between the Boss' 444bhp and the GT500's 662bhp would be quite a car!
Also, from a marketing perspective, any new GT500 with less than 662bhp would be a backward step. But call it GT350, and that issue goes away. I'm aware the monikers have nothing to do with the power outputs of the two cars, but Joe Public will always expect a GT500 to be top dog in the power stakes.
1/7/13 | 01:14 PM
#96
I Have No Life
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 10,446
Likes: 12
From: Canada
I think we've been spoilt by having both the Boss and the GT500 available at the same time.
Just thinking out loud..........Perhaps a GT350 would sit somewhere in the middle.......less powerful than the GT500, but a better balanced package, like the Boss. Lets face it, if the Trinity engine was a 2 year only deal, then beating 662bhp for the next generation car is going to be tough. I don't see it happening. But a Mustang that has the track ability of the Boss, with power somewhere between the Boss' 444bhp and the GT500's 662bhp would be quite a car!
Also, from a marketing perspective, any new GT500 with less than 662bhp would be a backward step. But call it GT350, and that issue goes away. I'm aware the monikers have nothing to do with the power outputs of the two cars, but Joe Public will always expect a GT500 to be top dog in the power stakes.
Just thinking out loud..........Perhaps a GT350 would sit somewhere in the middle.......less powerful than the GT500, but a better balanced package, like the Boss. Lets face it, if the Trinity engine was a 2 year only deal, then beating 662bhp for the next generation car is going to be tough. I don't see it happening. But a Mustang that has the track ability of the Boss, with power somewhere between the Boss' 444bhp and the GT500's 662bhp would be quite a car!
Also, from a marketing perspective, any new GT500 with less than 662bhp would be a backward step. But call it GT350, and that issue goes away. I'm aware the monikers have nothing to do with the power outputs of the two cars, but Joe Public will always expect a GT500 to be top dog in the power stakes.
Seems to skip each other gen and come in closer to the end of the runs.
And then notice how the next version of the GT always seems to be closer to the outgoing SE wrt performance or HP.
In that case I'd guess we'll probably see some BOSS stuff or numbers trickle to the next GT.
If history repeats itself, we'll see the base/GT come forward at the beginning with an SVT at the same time or just after. Probably no SE for a while, unless its like a Bullitt type compared to an all out BOSS.
I'm really interested to see what SVT has up its sleeve.
Kids let loose in the candy shop.
Last edited by Boomer; 1/7/13 at 01:16 PM.
1/7/13 | 06:35 PM
#97
Cobra R Member
Joined: January 10, 2011
Posts: 1,752
Likes: 1
From: Ontario
All the talk of engine and nomenclature is fine and. Good but I'm excited to see what Ford can do with IRS on a Mustang. A lot of praise is been heaped on the chassis engineers across platforms lately, so I'm excited to SE what an unchained Mustang is capable of. I want to see the 1LE and ZL1 relegated back to where they belong...playing catch up.
1/7/13 | 08:31 PM
#98
Mach 1 Member
Joined: September 23, 2008
Posts: 879
Likes: 0
Yes, but Ford isn't going to put a turbo 4 engine into the base model. It doesn't make financial sense for fleet cars. That and the turbo 4 is a premium option in most of the cars it's offered in, even the Edge and Explorer, not to mention the Fusion, Escape and Focus ST. That engine isn't a base model engine. Hyundai can get away with it because they don't sell G Coupes to fleets, they don't have a V8 high end model, and the 2.0T is marketed as a track car. It's already been said that a version of EcoBoost will show up in the next Mustang, so we know it's coming.
I just don't see the lineup going turbo 4 to V8, though. I think they will carryover the V6 as the bargain basement model, that they can sell to rental agencies and people who want the simple 4-seat coupe without all the "doodads," then be able to sell the 2.0/2.3T model as a premium offering, with higher mpg and better performance than the V6. I guess we'll find out soon though...
I just don't see the lineup going turbo 4 to V8, though. I think they will carryover the V6 as the bargain basement model, that they can sell to rental agencies and people who want the simple 4-seat coupe without all the "doodads," then be able to sell the 2.0/2.3T model as a premium offering, with higher mpg and better performance than the V6. I guess we'll find out soon though...
Dave
1/7/13 | 08:46 PM
#99
I Have No Life
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 10,446
Likes: 12
From: Canada
They are throwing the EcoBoosts in everything now.
I don't see it geting the V6, but the I4-T is perfectly fine for a base car.
It might also sway buyers that are younger and can't get an 8, but wouldn't 'be caught dead in a V6'
"But its got a TURBO!"
1/7/13 | 09:31 PM
#100
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: January 6, 2006
Posts: 14,047
Likes: 166
From: Bay Area, CA
And the 3.7 was reserved for higher end passenger cars like the Fusion Sport
They are throwing the EcoBoosts in everything now.
I don't see it geting the V6, but the I4-T is perfectly fine for a base car.
It might also sway buyers that are younger and can't get an 8, but wouldn't 'be caught dead in a V6'
"But its got a TURBO!"