Learning how to drive standard
7/25/05, 07:16 AM
#21
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Doug, the feeling will come with time. When I first started learning I had to watch my tach and determine when to let my clutch out in first. But after a few weeks it will start coming naturally and you won't even think about it. Its a balance between your left and right foot. The easiest way to sum it up for me is its like riding a bike. The more you practice the more natural it becomes. You'll have it soon enough.
As for hill starts James is absolutely correct, this is how I did them when I was learning.
Or if you can get your hands on a cheap Subaru, they had a hill-holder feature on their manual transmissions. When you can to a stop on a hill you could let off the brake and the car would hold itself there giving you an easier time getting going. That or an old Studebaker, they had them too. But I don't think you would have the cash for one of those
Practice, practice, Practice!
As for hill starts James is absolutely correct, this is how I did them when I was learning.
Or if you can get your hands on a cheap Subaru, they had a hill-holder feature on their manual transmissions. When you can to a stop on a hill you could let off the brake and the car would hold itself there giving you an easier time getting going. That or an old Studebaker, they had them too. But I don't think you would have the cash for one of those
Practice, practice, Practice!
7/25/05, 07:19 AM
#22
After all these years,
My C/T still sucks!
My C/T still sucks!
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You all have NO idea how much I miss stick.
My way of circumstance(no manuals available when I got gifted with her) Ellie is an auto.
She's fun to drive but quite boring at the same time.
My way of circumstance(no manuals available when I got gifted with her) Ellie is an auto.
She's fun to drive but quite boring at the same time.
7/25/05, 07:24 AM
#23
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When I learned my husband found it necessary to say:
~If you cant find 'em, grind 'em~
But it seems harder then it actually is. Once you get it down pat, you don't even realize that you are driving standard / shifting. It all comes natural
Good luck, and don't get discouraged!
~If you cant find 'em, grind 'em~
But it seems harder then it actually is. Once you get it down pat, you don't even realize that you are driving standard / shifting. It all comes natural
Good luck, and don't get discouraged!
7/25/05, 07:27 AM
#24
After all these years,
My C/T still sucks!
My C/T still sucks!
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Ha- I learned standard in BILOXI!
I got stuck on the drawbridge once.......Before I learned to take off on a hill.People are probably STILL cursing me.
I got stuck on the drawbridge once.......Before I learned to take off on a hill.People are probably STILL cursing me.
7/25/05, 09:54 PM
#25
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Originally posted by scottie1113+July 25, 2005, 12:31 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(scottie1113 @ July 25, 2005, 12:31 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, double clutching is exactly what it implies. When going down in gears you shift into neutral, rev the engine to match the rpm's in the lower gear, shift and let the clutch back in. It takes fancy footwork to do it correctly. It's a lot faster than it sounds and when you combine it with heel and toe downshifting you've got the car set up for the corner. It's usually done on a track but you can also do it in the twisties. Not necessary today but with non synchro gearboxes it was a necessity.
As for starting on a hill, that's easy. Set the parking brake and when it's time to go slip the clutch until it engages then release the parking brake and you're off with no rolling back. I learned this in San Francisco many years ago. The alternative was backing into a cable car. That's no fun and I've seen it happen.
DSG is for Lesson #2. They are good things.
Less than 10% of all cars sold today have manual trannies and I suspect they will disappear altogether in the next 10 years to be replaced by Tiptronics, DSG's and the like. And I think that's a good thing...
[/b]
As for starting on a hill, that's easy. Set the parking brake and when it's time to go slip the clutch until it engages then release the parking brake and you're off with no rolling back. I learned this in San Francisco many years ago. The alternative was backing into a cable car. That's no fun and I've seen it happen.
DSG is for Lesson #2. They are good things.
Less than 10% of all cars sold today have manual trannies and I suspect they will disappear altogether in the next 10 years to be replaced by Tiptronics, DSG's and the like. And I think that's a good thing...
[/b]
Kool, thanks
<!--QuoteBegin-EleanorsMine@July 25, 2005, 8:22 AM
You all have NO idea how much I miss stick.
My way of circumstance(no manuals available when I got gifted with her) Ellie is an auto.
She's fun to drive but quite boring at the same time.
[/quote]
why didnt u just order a 05 GT with a 5 speed then?
7/25/05, 10:11 PM
#26
Originally posted by Hotrod@July 24, 2005, 5:19 PM
From what I understand you had to double clutch in older tranny that were not synchronized. You have to do that to match the revs so the gears would line up (thats correct aint it?). In newer trannys this is not nesscesary so I dont know what vin was talking about.
From what I understand you had to double clutch in older tranny that were not synchronized. You have to do that to match the revs so the gears would line up (thats correct aint it?). In newer trannys this is not nesscesary so I dont know what vin was talking about.
7/25/05, 10:14 PM
#27
http://www.elecdesign.com/Articles/Index.c...&ArticleID=6137
try Google double clutching gives you loads of ideas and not the Condor method.
http://www.elecdesign.com/Articles/Index.c...&ArticleID=6137
Now, if you have driven old cars, or trucks, or sports or racing cars, you will be amused at this play on words. That's because double-clutching is also a procedure to save wear and tear on your gearbox, and on your clutch, at the expense of a little extra work for your left leg. What exactly is double-clutching (or, as the British call it, "double de-clutching"), and why is it significant?
Let's say you're accelerating in second gear. When you're ready to shift into third, you decide not to use the standard approach, which is just to tromp on the clutch, take your foot off the gas, shove the shift lever into third, and let the clutch back out. Instead, you opt to double-clutch properly:
First, you take your foot off the gas and kick in the clutch. You shift into neutral, AND let the clutch out. You wait perhaps 0.3 to 1.0 seconds for the engine to slow down from its high revs, depending on how fast you were revving when you started to shift and how much inertia the engine has to slow down. THEN you kick in the clutch and shift into third, and let the clutch out quickly, feeding the gas appropriately. If you have judged it right, when you let the clutch out, there isn't any JERK. And when you shove the lever into third, the gears and engine are at a synchronized speed, so there's minimum wear on the synchronizers, which are the tiny clutches that bring the clutch plate and the gears into smooth synchrony. There's also usually less wear on the clutch plates.
What's the big deal? The main point is that when you try to shift into third gear, the engine has slowed itself and the clutch plate down to the right speed—just about the same speed as the gearbox—so it saves wear on the synchronizers and the clutch. It can also save shock and strain on the whole drive-train, because the speeds are just about synchronized when you let out the clutch.
Well, big deal, you say. Cars haven't needed double-clutching since the synchromesh transmission was popularized 50 years ago. Why bother? Why fool around with anachronistic motions? Isn't it just buying trouble? Even Tom and Ray Magliozzi* claim that double-clutching is silly and stupid and wasteful of energy. Ah, but I can give you reasons why it is beneficial.
First, in most cars, the actual gears are always in constant mesh, and the synchronizers only decide which pair of gears to connect to their shaft. But many trucks and some racing cars are still set up with a non-synchromesh gearbox. With trucks, because they have so many gears, it's noticeably more efficient not to have all of the gears in mesh all of the time. So with the "crash-box," you HAVE TO double-clutch, or you will not be able to shift. The same holds true for racing cars—to gain the last couple percent of efficiency, only one set of gears is in mesh at any time, and you have to actually synchronize their speeds or you can't get it in gear. Despite the obvious drawbacks of having to double-clutch, the gearbox is stronger and more efficient than a comparable synchromesh one, and has less tendency to overheat.
Other reasons for double-clutching: Because it is the right way to operate the clutch. Because it saves wear and tear on your synchronizers in the long run, if you're planning to run your car over 200,000 miles, as I do. Because it is fun to do. Because in very cold weather, (-10° F, for example) you may have to double-clutch to shift gears at all, at least for the first few miles.
One very important reason is that, if your clutch linkage ever fails, you can still shift and get home by double-clutching, getting the engine and gears' speeds synchronized and then just EASING the shifter into the right gear. In the last 1,050,000 miles of driving VWs, I have lost my clutch about 3 times, and each time, with careful planning, I've been able to drive home safely. One time I pulled into the Customs House at Calais, Maine, and discovered my clutch was out. I eased along carefully and managed to get all the way home, 350 miles, to Boston, where it was convenient to put the car in the shop to have the clutch repaired—much more convenient than in the middle of a vacation, or the middle of Maine.
Another reason is that on some old cars, first gear isn't synchromesh, so if you need to shift into first without coming to a full stop, you have to double-clutch. Also, a lot of cars these days are made with weak, chintzy synchros, so they soon wear out, and to drive them gracefully, you need to double-clutch.
Note, when down-shifting, you have to shift into neutral and then blip the throttle momentarily before you shift into the lower gear. It requires practice and a good feel, a good touch, to do it right, especially considering the embarrassing noises you make if you miss your shift into a low gear on a crash-box. For example, you should aim to have the revs just a little high, so if you miss, the engine will soon slow down, and then gears will be at the right speed to mesh and the cogs will slip in....
OKAY, Pease, I'll try this double-clutching some day; but why do you bring up all this stuff in an electronics magazine? Ah, there's an excellent analogy: In most conventional switching regulators, the power transistor turns on while there's lots of voltage across it, and after it turns off, the voltage usually increases to a large voltage. When the transistors turn on, the diodes are already carrying significant current, and the transistors have to turn the diodes off. This is all somewhat stressful, and causes the transistors and diodes to have large turn-on and turn-off surges—pulses of power on every cycle. Of course, diodes and transistors have been designed to withstand these stresses and surges with excellent reliability; we see them all the time.
Still, people have specially designed "resonant mode" switchers to have zero-voltage and zero-current switching. In these regulators, most turn-on and turn-off stresses are eliminated, because the transistor is at a very low voltage when you turn it on, and at a very low current when you're ready to turn it off. Consequently, most voltage and current transients are greatly decreased. Less filtering and shielding is therefore required, enabling the complete regulator to have low Radio Frequency Interference (RFI). Now, to design such a supply takes a more complicated controller IC, more expensive parts, a very careful layout, and a lot of expertise in the electrical design. So while you get some advantages, you have to pay for them.
Now, when you want to build a compact, high-performance, switch-mode regulator at switching frequencies up to about 1 MHz, conventional switchers can do at least as well as resonant ones in terms of cost, size, and performance. But if you need a switcher even smaller and faster than that (most users do not), when the switching frequency rises above 2 MHz, the resonant-mode switchers begin to show real advantages.
try Google double clutching gives you loads of ideas and not the Condor method.
http://www.elecdesign.com/Articles/Index.c...&ArticleID=6137
Now, if you have driven old cars, or trucks, or sports or racing cars, you will be amused at this play on words. That's because double-clutching is also a procedure to save wear and tear on your gearbox, and on your clutch, at the expense of a little extra work for your left leg. What exactly is double-clutching (or, as the British call it, "double de-clutching"), and why is it significant?
Let's say you're accelerating in second gear. When you're ready to shift into third, you decide not to use the standard approach, which is just to tromp on the clutch, take your foot off the gas, shove the shift lever into third, and let the clutch back out. Instead, you opt to double-clutch properly:
First, you take your foot off the gas and kick in the clutch. You shift into neutral, AND let the clutch out. You wait perhaps 0.3 to 1.0 seconds for the engine to slow down from its high revs, depending on how fast you were revving when you started to shift and how much inertia the engine has to slow down. THEN you kick in the clutch and shift into third, and let the clutch out quickly, feeding the gas appropriately. If you have judged it right, when you let the clutch out, there isn't any JERK. And when you shove the lever into third, the gears and engine are at a synchronized speed, so there's minimum wear on the synchronizers, which are the tiny clutches that bring the clutch plate and the gears into smooth synchrony. There's also usually less wear on the clutch plates.
What's the big deal? The main point is that when you try to shift into third gear, the engine has slowed itself and the clutch plate down to the right speed—just about the same speed as the gearbox—so it saves wear on the synchronizers and the clutch. It can also save shock and strain on the whole drive-train, because the speeds are just about synchronized when you let out the clutch.
Well, big deal, you say. Cars haven't needed double-clutching since the synchromesh transmission was popularized 50 years ago. Why bother? Why fool around with anachronistic motions? Isn't it just buying trouble? Even Tom and Ray Magliozzi* claim that double-clutching is silly and stupid and wasteful of energy. Ah, but I can give you reasons why it is beneficial.
First, in most cars, the actual gears are always in constant mesh, and the synchronizers only decide which pair of gears to connect to their shaft. But many trucks and some racing cars are still set up with a non-synchromesh gearbox. With trucks, because they have so many gears, it's noticeably more efficient not to have all of the gears in mesh all of the time. So with the "crash-box," you HAVE TO double-clutch, or you will not be able to shift. The same holds true for racing cars—to gain the last couple percent of efficiency, only one set of gears is in mesh at any time, and you have to actually synchronize their speeds or you can't get it in gear. Despite the obvious drawbacks of having to double-clutch, the gearbox is stronger and more efficient than a comparable synchromesh one, and has less tendency to overheat.
Other reasons for double-clutching: Because it is the right way to operate the clutch. Because it saves wear and tear on your synchronizers in the long run, if you're planning to run your car over 200,000 miles, as I do. Because it is fun to do. Because in very cold weather, (-10° F, for example) you may have to double-clutch to shift gears at all, at least for the first few miles.
One very important reason is that, if your clutch linkage ever fails, you can still shift and get home by double-clutching, getting the engine and gears' speeds synchronized and then just EASING the shifter into the right gear. In the last 1,050,000 miles of driving VWs, I have lost my clutch about 3 times, and each time, with careful planning, I've been able to drive home safely. One time I pulled into the Customs House at Calais, Maine, and discovered my clutch was out. I eased along carefully and managed to get all the way home, 350 miles, to Boston, where it was convenient to put the car in the shop to have the clutch repaired—much more convenient than in the middle of a vacation, or the middle of Maine.
Another reason is that on some old cars, first gear isn't synchromesh, so if you need to shift into first without coming to a full stop, you have to double-clutch. Also, a lot of cars these days are made with weak, chintzy synchros, so they soon wear out, and to drive them gracefully, you need to double-clutch.
Note, when down-shifting, you have to shift into neutral and then blip the throttle momentarily before you shift into the lower gear. It requires practice and a good feel, a good touch, to do it right, especially considering the embarrassing noises you make if you miss your shift into a low gear on a crash-box. For example, you should aim to have the revs just a little high, so if you miss, the engine will soon slow down, and then gears will be at the right speed to mesh and the cogs will slip in....
OKAY, Pease, I'll try this double-clutching some day; but why do you bring up all this stuff in an electronics magazine? Ah, there's an excellent analogy: In most conventional switching regulators, the power transistor turns on while there's lots of voltage across it, and after it turns off, the voltage usually increases to a large voltage. When the transistors turn on, the diodes are already carrying significant current, and the transistors have to turn the diodes off. This is all somewhat stressful, and causes the transistors and diodes to have large turn-on and turn-off surges—pulses of power on every cycle. Of course, diodes and transistors have been designed to withstand these stresses and surges with excellent reliability; we see them all the time.
Still, people have specially designed "resonant mode" switchers to have zero-voltage and zero-current switching. In these regulators, most turn-on and turn-off stresses are eliminated, because the transistor is at a very low voltage when you turn it on, and at a very low current when you're ready to turn it off. Consequently, most voltage and current transients are greatly decreased. Less filtering and shielding is therefore required, enabling the complete regulator to have low Radio Frequency Interference (RFI). Now, to design such a supply takes a more complicated controller IC, more expensive parts, a very careful layout, and a lot of expertise in the electrical design. So while you get some advantages, you have to pay for them.
Now, when you want to build a compact, high-performance, switch-mode regulator at switching frequencies up to about 1 MHz, conventional switchers can do at least as well as resonant ones in terms of cost, size, and performance. But if you need a switcher even smaller and faster than that (most users do not), when the switching frequency rises above 2 MHz, the resonant-mode switchers begin to show real advantages.
7/26/05, 12:26 AM
#29
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these will help you even more.
http://www.standardshift.com/videos.html
You should get it all efficiently in no time, you'll feel great when you show off to friends. Doing it with family may get you in trouble lol.
Have fun.
http://www.standardshift.com/videos.html
You should get it all efficiently in no time, you'll feel great when you show off to friends. Doing it with family may get you in trouble lol.
Have fun.
7/26/05, 08:32 AM
#30
After all these years,
My C/T still sucks!
My C/T still sucks!
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BTW Mr Doug..
Ellies a six.......And I am proud of it. I didn't want a GT...I just wanted a manual..
BUT when your husband hands you a big check and says go get your car, you go get it.
Ellies a six.......And I am proud of it. I didn't want a GT...I just wanted a manual..
BUT when your husband hands you a big check and says go get your car, you go get it.
7/26/05, 11:00 AM
#31
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Hahaha, i dont have to worry about that as i will never have a husband
At first i thought the V6 was better looking, but now i hate the looks of the V6 and love the GT, a prime example of why you don't buy a vehicle when they are first introduced
At first i thought the V6 was better looking, but now i hate the looks of the V6 and love the GT, a prime example of why you don't buy a vehicle when they are first introduced
7/26/05, 04:57 PM
#32
After all these years,
My C/T still sucks!
My C/T still sucks!
Join Date: May 5, 2004
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Thats why they make both kinds...... 
I adore my Eleanor, and wouldn't trade her for anything......She is mine.I wish I had two of em!
I adore my Eleanor, and wouldn't trade her for anything......She is mine.I wish I had two of em!
7/26/05, 08:45 PM
#33
AKA 1 BULLITT------------ Legacy TMS Member
Originally posted by Fordracing200@July 26, 2005, 1:03 PM
Hahaha, i dont have to worry about that as i will never have a husband
Hahaha, i dont have to worry about that as i will never have a husband
Just make sure you don't make an unplanned visit to the territorial prison.
7/26/05, 08:50 PM
#34
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Originally posted by 1 BULLITT@July 26, 2005, 9:48 PM
Just make sure you don't make an unplanned visit to the territorial prison.
Just make sure you don't make an unplanned visit to the territorial prison.
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