I did, and yet....nevermind. You are right and are always going to be right. I hope that you enjoy the rest of your life pointing out that you are right and anyone that disagrees w/ you is FOS. Good day.

 

You contradict yourself. You state the interviews mean nothing until it happens yet you lump all these facts together and draw a conclusion from them that SVT is in trouble. IMO, an interview with a high level Ford exec has much more credibility than your conclusions. One other point: why would Ford take one of its rising stars (Hau Thai-Tang) in charge of SVT and then kill it?

 

I did, and yet....nevermind. You are right and are always going to be right. I hope that you enjoy the rest of your life pointing out that you are right and anyone that disagrees w/ you is FOS. Good day.
[/b][/quote]

Well, you never stated any sources, I did, I am just the middle man, conveying information that is in print. If you can state a source saying it won't be a Shelby Mustang Cobra then maybe I will change my mind, come to think of it, has there been a Shelby Mustang produced that didn't have a snake somewhere on the car? Just a little food for thought:

 

Well, you never stated any sources, I did, I am just the middle man, conveying information that is in print. If you can state a source saying it won't be a Shelby Mustang Cobra then maybe I will change my mind, come to think of it, has there been a Shelby Mustang produced that didn't have a snake somewhere on the car? Just a little food for thought:



[/b][/quote]


Yes, I think we are all aware of what the Shelby logo is and that is does have a cobra. But, just because thats the emblem, does that mean that every Shelby is a "Cobra"? Is it a "Shelby 'cobra' GT350"

BTW, Motor Trend has NEVER, EVER reported anything wrong or had their facts mistaken.

 

Geez...calm down just a bit. I never said that Motor Trend is always right, I just said that according to them, they said Shelby Mustang Cobra, that's what this thread was originally based on, the article by Motor Trend.

<!--QuoteBegin-slavehand@January 27, 2005, 8:40 AM
The Shelby Mustang has nothing "Cobra" about it.
[/quote]

The reason I posted the pics is due to the fact that you said that the Shelby Mustang has nothing Cobra about it.

 

Other than Shelby's logo (and FORD supplied engines), yes, there is NOTHING. The Shelby Mustangs were that, Shelby Mustangs. Totally different from a Shelby Cobra. Totally different platform. Totally different cars. Both by Shelby.

 

You contradict yourself. You state the interviews mean nothing until it happens yet you lump all these facts together and draw a conclusion from them that SVT is in trouble. IMO, an interview with a high level Ford exec has much more credibility than your conclusions. One other point: why would Ford take one of its rising stars (Hau Thai-Tang) in charge of SVT and then kill it?
[/b][/quote]
Again, I am taking what I know (ie. SVT's that have made it to the chopping block) and all the supposed BS reporting out there (which doesn't count until actually acted upon) and drawing MY OWN CONCLUSION that SVT is in trouble. Period. Nothing more, nothing less.

From what you have read AND experienced, what are your thoughts on what is going to happen with SVT?

On your point of rising stars and killing SVT .... poo happens in the business world. Things change over night. Tang could be gone tomorrow for all we know. I remember Scarpello talking in Detroit at the 100th b-day party. According to him, he wasn't going anywhere .... SVT was vibrant ... Cobra, Lightning, Focus ..heck they were even showing a protoype Ranger truck with a Lightning engine in it. Would I ever believe that SVT is were it is now --- No Cobra, No Lightning, No Focus .... heck no ..... Again, IMHO
Draw your own conclusions.

 

They have had two cobra's several times, the Cobra and Cobra R are two different Cobra cars, two different engines, makes sense to name the Cobra R a Shelby. I think the Shelby Cobra is the one that is going to be unveiled in March since I have not seen anything saying that SVT is unveiling anything.

On another note, from what I read in Motor Trend, it looks like the Ford GT will not be produced past the 2006 MY and to be replaced by the Ford Shelby GR-1 rated at 600 hp.
[/b][/quote]
Good point ... I was thinking cars in the thousands, not just 100's.

 

I said it before and I'll say it again...It's my guess that SVT will soon stand for (Shelby Vehicle Team) Ford would not pay all that money to get the Shelby name for ONE car. I believe they will use the Shelby badge for other performance models (ie. Shelby Focus, Shelby Mustang, Shelby F-150, etc) It may also be that they are going to use the Cobra name for the GR-1 and not use it for the Mustang. And if all you care about is the name, then waaaaah. All I care about is performance

 

If it has 500+ HP and is affordable, Ford can name it the pinto for all I care.

I look forward to learning new credible information as it comes in.

 

Here's my opinion: there's no doubt that Ford's financial situation has affected SVT. So what? Name a part of Ford that hasn't been affected in some way. I think SVT is going through a period of flux where resources are scarce and they need to pick and choose very carefully where they dedicate those resources. I believe the Lightning fell by the wayside because they lacked the necessary resources to develop both in parallel (plus I'm sure SVT has a hand in the Shelby GR-1 as well). I believe SVT will be around for awhile and we'll start to see new products coming to market over the next few years (including a new Lightning). Just because they decide to tack the Shelby name onto the Cobra means little to me. It could very well be callled the SVT Shelby Cobra or it could be a completely separate model from what we know as the SVT Cobra. There's no doubt that Ford wants to cash in on the Shelby name again, especially with the new Mustang. Given the high-peformance heritage of the Shelby name, it doesn't surprise me that SVT would be involved in the development of a Shelby Mustang either. After-all, SVT was involved in both the GT(40) and Marauder and neither carried the SVT label.

I guess we'll find out for sure in a couple months.

 

SVT did put a lot of resources towards the GT, most likely we are seeing the fallout from that. But I have heard rumors of a SVT Fusion coming down the pipe sometime in upcoming years. Wouldn't be surprised to see the Lightning back with the same s/c 5.4L V8 at 550 hp, can't let the Ram win the fast truck category.

 

Tom, can't argue with anythign you have said .. I just hope they have a good press release at the NY show ... Lot of unanswered questions ....

Keep your fingers crossed ...

 

I don't think this car will be $100k. By 2007, Ford's new supercar the Shelby GR-1 should be ready for production. Yes, it's stil a concept right now, but from what I've read on AOL's coverage of the auto show, it IS slated to overtake the GT40 as Ford's new supercar with 600HP and speeds topping well over 200 MPH.
Here's a link to some cool pics of the Shelby GR-1, along with Carroll Shelby posing with the car.

Shelby GR-1

It wouldn't make any sense for the Shelby Mustang to cost $100k... why would Ford have TWO supercars!? :scratch: They're not an exotic car production company. I'm betting the Shelby Mustang will cost more than the SVT Cobra (if there is one), say around $55,000 - $65,000.

 

I agree and have posted such in other threads. I can't see any Mustang at 100k. 55-65k for the Cobra R replacement is probable. That leaves a large gap for the regular Cobra to fit.

 

Also, one more thing I wanted to clear up. Let's get the names straight.
Being that my father owned and I now own a 1967 Shelby GT 500, and I belong to SAAC (Shelby American Automobile Club - Carroll Shelby is on the board of this pretigious club), I have a copy of the latest registry book for Shelby owners. This book is about as official as it gets. Pretty expensive too, lol.

Anyway, nowhere in this book is a Shelby of any era called a "Shelby Mustang". This car does not exist (unless they build one titled as such in 2007). For instance, my car is called a 1967 Shelby GT (Grand Touring) 500. Same goes for the GT 350. All Shelby GTs were built by hand in California at Shelby Co.

There was, however, a Shelby Cobra, which is of course the two-seater roadster, and its extremely rare counterpart the Shelby Daytona Coupe. There was also a Shelby Trans-AM Racer.

I also happen to have a pic of the original badge on the back of my Shelby. It reads 1967 Shelby GT 500. Yes, it has the Cobra emblem between Shelby and GT but it is only an EMBLEM and nothing more. It is NOT a Cobra.

Here's the pic:



I suppose I could also scan the table of contents from the Shelby American World Registry onto my comp if anyone needs more convincing, lol.

 

That makes me wonder of there won't be a Shelby GT-500 slotted in above the SVT Cobra in the Mustang line-up. They could both be developed by SVT and have similar powertrains with the GT-500 having more HP (and a higher price tag). You could have a SVT Cobra with an S/C 5.4 making 450P and a GT-500 with more boost making 500HP.

 

I found this on Edmunds.com about SVT in general.

Hey! Just when we thought Ford's Special Vehicle Team was dormant for 2005 — gone, after all, is the SVT Mustang Cobra, SVT Lightning F-150 and SVT Focus — we learn SVT has indeed been working on a product, and it's already on the market.

The 2005 SVT Power & Performance Calendar is yours for $12.95, plus $5.95 shipping and handling. The calendar, SVT says, "makes each month a little SVT history lesson."

That's telling, because right now, we aren't sure what the future holds for SVT. Last October, word leaked that SVT had shelved the next-generation Lightning pickup truck, which was expected in a year or so.

For now, Ford is putting all of SVT's eggs into one basket — the SVT Cobra Mustang, due in 2006 as a 2007 model. ''It's a business decision,'' said Alan Hall, SVT spokesman. The official line is the Lightning is ''postponed,'' but if it is revived, it will be 2008 or later before we see one.

This means SVT has gone from three vehicles in the 2004 model year — the Lightning, Cobra Mustang and SVT Focus — to none in 2005, with little prospect of anything until 2006, except perhaps more calendars.

This is especially embarrassing for Ford, as it had already shown a concept version of the next-generation Lightning in 2003. The concept had a supercharged V8 engine with more than 500 horsepower, in answer to the Dodge Ram SRT-10 and its Viper-derived V10 engine.

SVT's history dates back to 1991, when Bob Rewey, group vice president for Ford marketing and sales, and Neil Ressler, chief technical officer, thought the company would benefit from an in-house skunkworks that would look at existing and future products, and see if they might respond to some officially sanctioned hot-rodding. The products thus identified and appropriately massaged could be sold at select dealers operating under the Ford umbrella — sort of how the M-models at BMW, and the AMG models at Mercedes-Benz are marketed.

In 1992, the first SVT Cobra Mustang and SVT Lightning F-150 were introduced as '93 models. Shortly thereafter, the company built 107 race-ready Cobra R Mustangs.

Suddenly, SVT becomes the place to work at Ford. Every engineer faced with a future of designing steering knuckles for the Tempo applies. Few are selected. General Motors and Chrysler are very, very interested in what is going on at SVT, but can it make money?

It can, and typically has. Not a lot, but enough to support itself, even without factoring in the halo effect for other Ford products, the technology the SVT team helped develop that found its way to other mainstream products and the publicity SVT generated in the buff books. The second-generation Lightning was the first pickup truck ever to dominate the cover of Car and Driver magazine — I know, because I put it on there. SVT customers have typically been treated like valued insiders, and they are among the most loyal devotees of any manufacturer.

Seemingly, SVT rocked along, with a few stumbles. One of them was a batch of Cobra engines that did not pump out the advertised horsepower, but SVT did the right thing by admitting the problem, and reached out to customers who had bought them. And the SVT Contour may not have been a big hit, but that's mostly because the Contour itself was not a big hit. Yet one of the best used car values on the market now is an SVT Contour, if you can find one that hasn't been abused.

Some of the SVT staff was temporarily consumed with the development of the Ford GT — which probably wouldn't have had a suitable, cost-effective engine had it not been for the work SVT had been doing on the power plant — but once the GT was ready, we figured it was back to business as usual for SVT.

We were wrong. The SVT Focus was dropped ostensibly because the new Mazda-shared 2.3-liter four-cylinder generated horsepower close enough to the SVT's 2.0-liter as to make the SVT model superfluous. Well, maybe. Then the Lightning and Mustang were necessarily suspended due to the fact that both were moving to all-new platforms. Fine. It has happened before.

But then came word that Tom Scarpello, marketing and sales manager for SVT, was quietly dispatched to Jaguar. Scarpello shared responsibility for future product planning and strategy with John Coletti, director of SVT programs, a little bulldog of an engineer who was, more than anyone else, identified with fast Fords. In December, it was announced that Coletti, 55, was retiring after 11 years at SVT, 33 years at Ford.

Also retiring: Chris Theodore, Ford's vice president of advanced product creation, and a staunch SVT champion. Ford immediately named Hau Thai-Tang, chief engineer of the 2005 Ford Mustang, as Theodore's successor, and he is also taking over SVT. Thai-Tang, however, does not get Theodore's vice president rank, even though it appears he has at least as much responsibility. Does that suggest a reduction in importance of SVT? Not according to Thai-Tang, who has the enthusiasm, credentials (he spent a year with the Newman/Hass CART team, and knows racing) and fresh outlook to make a difference. Eventually.

Either way, SVT fans and owners — and, I imagine, dealers — are apoplectic. One SVT dealer has turned to Roush to fill the performance Mustang slot that SVT once had. Dodge, which formed SRT (Street and Racing Technology) in the image of SVT — its image aided by the presence of public relations director Todd Goyer, who held the same position at SVT — stands to pick up some business from disconsolate Ford fans.

The man most identified with these changes is Phil Martens, group vice president for product creation. Martens is a smart car guy with good instincts. He's understandably defensive when asked about SVT, saying essentially, but politely, that there were internal problems that are none of my business. Other sources suggest that the SVT team was so overtaxed with the GT project — think about how little time they had to produce a world-class sports car, and think about how they succeeded — that other SVT projects fell behind. By the time a new Lightning would be ready, I was told, there would only be a year or so of life left in that platform.

Martens says to expect SVT to take another long look at the Focus, and the Fusion may also be an SVT candidate. Fine. But I wish SVT would expand its outlook. Who says SVT has to be about horsepower? How hard would it be to take a four-wheel-drive F-150 and turn it into an exceptionally competent off-roader, and call that an SVT F-150?

It's a shame the company has botched its handling of a viable department like SVT, which — let's face it — at times has been the only thing Ford has had to brag about these last 12 years. We'll get a look at the SVT Cobra Mustang at the New York show, but I don't expect to hear a lot from them afterwards until next year. By then, I hope it's not too late.

Meanwhile, enjoy your calendars.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Colum...eline.promo.2.*

 

Excellent find! The bit about the GT project overtaxing SVT echoes what Holderca1 said earlier. I am curious about those internal problems though... :scratch:

 

Great find ... Kind of what I was trying to say ... Something aint right at SVT. Too much coincidence going on for my taste. Only time will tell.

Some will ask, why does it matter if it says SVT or not ? As long as it performs well, who cares ? ... I honestly cannot answer why it means so much to me, but I will try. I guess I have always felt that as long as Ford had SVT, we could always count on great performing vehicles, SVT or otherwise (halo effect) ... Without SVT to guide Ford, and make Ford known for great performance products, I feel Ford may lose the way if you will.
I just don't want Ford to think that adding Shelby's name to it will bring back the days of the 60's. SVT today is the Shelby of yester year .... That is important.
Hopefully that makes sense to all ...