Is tuning REALLY necessary?
12/28/11, 01:09 PM
#22
Legacy TMS Member
As others have said, it depends on the change. Have you driven an '11 or '12 GT to see what you really want changed? Are you going to daily drive the car? Drag race it? Autocross it?
12/28/11, 01:09 PM
#23
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Hey guys,
I'm new to posting to this forum, but I've been doing a lot of reading and I have a question that I've seen mentioned by some, but not fully addressed.
Is it really necessary to have your car tuned after relatively minor performance mods - cai, exhaust, headers, etc.?
I understand that you'll see better hp and tq gains by also loading a tune, and some of the cai's come with "required" tunes, but I've never understood why it was deemed "required."
I'm ordering a 2013 Mustang GT Premium in the next couple weeks (once prices are released), and I plan on doing headers and full exhaust and maybe a cai, but I don't want to go away from the stock tune. Eventually I'm going to supercharge it, at which point I'll have it dyno tuned, but what's the point before then?
I hope this hasn't been answered before, but I haven't been able to find the answer.
I'm new to posting to this forum, but I've been doing a lot of reading and I have a question that I've seen mentioned by some, but not fully addressed.
Is it really necessary to have your car tuned after relatively minor performance mods - cai, exhaust, headers, etc.?
I understand that you'll see better hp and tq gains by also loading a tune, and some of the cai's come with "required" tunes, but I've never understood why it was deemed "required."
I'm ordering a 2013 Mustang GT Premium in the next couple weeks (once prices are released), and I plan on doing headers and full exhaust and maybe a cai, but I don't want to go away from the stock tune. Eventually I'm going to supercharge it, at which point I'll have it dyno tuned, but what's the point before then?
I hope this hasn't been answered before, but I haven't been able to find the answer.
Hey, Mikey!
Not all parts require a tune. Long-tubes and mid-pipes can be installed and run without a tune. However, for best performance with the long-tubes a tune is highly recommended. As for the mid-pipe needing a tune, the only thing that's changed in a mid-pipe tune is turning the o2 sensors off if there are not cats. If there are cats, the o2 sensors don't even need to be turned off. You will lose some low-end with the headers, but than can easily be compensated for with a better gear (I would recommend starting with a 3.73 car) in the back.
Some cold-air intake kits will require a tune and some come with a venturi-tube that will allow them to be run with or without a tune. All cold-air intakes will benefit from a proper tune, whether or not they require one. The Airaid intake is a great choice to start with because it can be run with or without a tune and with a tune (and the venturi-tube removed) it makes some of the best power of any intake available for the Coyote motors.
While many of the tuning companies out there will get you running okay, only our Tuning Specialists can tune your Mustang with the confidence and backing of a warranty. That's right, we're the only company offering an aftermarket warranty for our tunes. This should help set your mind at ease while at the same time putting a smile on your face. If you'd like to read more about it, please check out the full-warranty form here:
http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/musta...222011warranty
If you purchase a tuner from us, you'll also receive free tunes for life to keep receiving upgrades as you continue to mod and most importantly, the backing and support of AM's customer service. It's a win-win situation. You get the comfort of knowing you've got the best tunes on the market and you get the service/dedication of the AM/Bama Teams together in one great package!
I hope this helps! Please don't hesitate to contact me directly if you have any questions in the future!
12/28/11, 01:15 PM
#24
Cobra Member
Chris,
quick question for you?
Some people running long tubes and exhaust with high flow cats and no tune are having CEL's come on because of the amount of air the cats flow.
Is there a full engine to bumper exhaust, with cats, that does not throw a CEL?
quick question for you?
Some people running long tubes and exhaust with high flow cats and no tune are having CEL's come on because of the amount of air the cats flow.
Is there a full engine to bumper exhaust, with cats, that does not throw a CEL?
12/28/11, 01:22 PM
#25
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I'm just thinking headers/full exhaust for the first year or two... then supercharger after that... I think I'm going to have my dealer install the headers/exhaust and see about resetting the CEL so if anything else is going on I'll know before it's too late... Salesman warned me about low end torque loss with headers though, so who knows... I've got a few months til it gets delivered...
Last edited by PTRocks; 12/28/11 at 01:29 PM.
12/28/11, 01:28 PM
#26
A Man Just Needs Some....
Not sure about that but this is the deal. If you're running long tubes, might as well go with no cats. The ECM will never be able to control the emission system with long tubes. The cats are designed to work with stock flow. Long tubes will run a bit cooler temps and cats will not operate efficiently.
If you are doing simple bolt on low horsepower adding mods, a mail order tune or a data log tune may be safe enough. If you really plan on running the car hard or occasionally racing, get it dyno tuned by a reputable pro.
If you are concerned about warranty issues: 1. Don't mod the car.
2. Buy another ECM and program that one instead of the original. Swap back to original if you blow up.
If you are doing simple bolt on low horsepower adding mods, a mail order tune or a data log tune may be safe enough. If you really plan on running the car hard or occasionally racing, get it dyno tuned by a reputable pro.
If you are concerned about warranty issues: 1. Don't mod the car.
2. Buy another ECM and program that one instead of the original. Swap back to original if you blow up.
12/28/11, 01:30 PM
#27
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I would ask Kendall about that. I didn't see an answer to that question in the other thread.
12/28/11, 01:49 PM
#28
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Originally Posted by LEwis26
Yes tunes are required for some mods.
CAI's require tunes because they put more air into the engine, and the MAF is programmed for the stock amount of air, so it will not run correctly without a tune. Some CAI have inserts that can be used without tunes though.
Exhausts can be put on without tunes, but headers will usually require a tune because of the cat delete or high flow cats.
CAI's require tunes because they put more air into the engine, and the MAF is programmed for the stock amount of air, so it will not run correctly without a tune. Some CAI have inserts that can be used without tunes though.
Exhausts can be put on without tunes, but headers will usually require a tune because of the cat delete or high flow cats.
Originally Posted by Flagstang
The CAI is pretty much the only thing that you have to have a tune for and the car will NOT run with out it. It will go into limp mode and need towing. The CAI+tune is worth 30hp and I wouldnt really call that minor.
You will not need a tune for full exhaust or a cai with the stock maf. You will not have any drivability problems. O2 sensors control the a/f ratio. As long as you dont take them out your fine.
There is a cheating method of using spark plug foul protectors to keep the rear o2s from thowing a catalyst efficienctly codes. Pm me for any questions you may have.
12/28/11, 01:50 PM
#29
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This dyno test a Boss, once with stock exhaust, the other with Kooks LT's with cats. No tune in either case. Read the linked thread for more notes and details.
I'm assuming the GT doesn't have the same capability?
12/28/11, 01:54 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by Mikey
Yeah, I've driven an '11 GT and for now I think I'm just going to do headers/exhaust. I plan on driving the car on nice days between the spring and fall each year. I have a truck and another car I might keep, instead of trading it in.
I actually read this yesterday I think. The one thing I found interesting about Kendall's comments was the thing about the A/F basically staying the same between the two tests. "Somewhat surprisingly, the A/F numbers were nearly identical to the stock car. In my experience, this is unusual. I guess the wideband-equipped Boss is more adept at controlling A/F's than lesser vehicles!!"
I'm assuming the GT doesn't have the same capability?
12/28/11, 01:58 PM
#31
A Man Just Needs Some....
Originally Posted by texastboneking
Every obd2 vehicle ford makes/made from 1996 and up can control thier a/f ratios just fine.
12/28/11, 02:00 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by AlsCobra
No way man. The boss has a supercomputer. Ain't no base model ECM for the Boss.
I read so much bs on the internet... So many ppl that don't understand how the computer system operates on these cars...
Last edited by texastboneking; 12/28/11 at 02:01 PM.
12/28/11, 02:02 PM
#33
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Cai only require a tune when they come equipped with a larger maf. So your comment is false.
false again.
You will not need a tune for full exhaust or a cai with the stock maf. You will not have any drivability problems. O2 sensors control the a/f ratio. As long as you dont take them out your fine.
There is a cheating method of using spark plug foul protectors to keep the rear o2s from thowing a catalyst efficienctly codes. Pm me for any questions you may have.
false again.
You will not need a tune for full exhaust or a cai with the stock maf. You will not have any drivability problems. O2 sensors control the a/f ratio. As long as you dont take them out your fine.
There is a cheating method of using spark plug foul protectors to keep the rear o2s from thowing a catalyst efficienctly codes. Pm me for any questions you may have.
12/28/11, 02:03 PM
#34
A Man Just Needs Some....
Originally Posted by texastboneking
I read so much bs on the internet... So many ppl that don't understand how the computer system operates on these cars...
12/28/11, 02:06 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by AlsCobra
Technically a second ECM should work though right? Leave the original alone and program the second.
12/28/11, 02:07 PM
#36
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Originally Posted by Mikey
Thanks texastboneking, these are the kinds of answers I'm looking for...
12/28/11, 02:08 PM
#37
A Man Just Needs Some....
Originally Posted by texastboneking
Idk. You referring to trying to keep the warranty? I haven't heard of anyone trying that yet.
12/28/11, 02:10 PM
#38
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Originally Posted by AlsCobra
Blown motor. Original one flash tune install on original ECM. Can you prove an aftermarket tune?
12/28/11, 02:12 PM
#39
A Man Just Needs Some....
Originally Posted by texastboneking
No. That's on the other thread about tuning the 5.0
12/28/11, 02:15 PM
#40
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Originally Posted by AlsCobra
Doesn't matter to me but I'm sure it will work. I'm close with my local dealer's owner, manager, and warranty clerk. Won't be a problem for me.
