SpectreH

Butt dyno is VERY impressed. The car pulls strong. Even with the advancetrac/traction control on, it lights the tires up when it shifts around 90 mph. Drivability is good. Idle is now set to 750 to compensate for the drag from the blower. Sometimes when you first put it in gear it wants to surge as it hunts for the proper idle point. That seems to be getting better as I drive it.

If I put it in Touring mode, you are basically back to stock. Max boost there is maybe 0.5 psi. I got 23.5 MPG at 80 mph in touring mode - which is what I had in stock form.

Sport mode acts like a normal centrifigal blower, while competition mode uses the CVT to spool up boost off the line.

So far I'm enjoying it. You know how when a car is accelerating hard and the rear squats down and the front is up just a bit? It still has that stance at 120 mph.

Stage_3

I know, I know, thread from the dead. lol
So David, how is the Procharger treating you? I've been reading about them lately and found them very interesting. Kinda like running a turbo with a belt. LOL
They definitely don't run as hot as the "pd" superchargers. I assume yours is an air-to-air intercooled? If I buy a S550, the Procharger Stage 2 tuned by Lund or Bjonnes will be one of the options I would be looking at. Puts out stupid power at low boost, on pump gas. Not to mention, keeping it all cool, with the air-to-air. And that idle whine is screaming. SCREAMING! lol I would definitely get the Red bypass valve too, which is optional.
Thanks!

SpectreH

I have about 9000 miles on the ProCharger now and have really enjoyed it. Plenty of power and still a great daily driver. The idle whine is really nice if I put it in competition mode.

Stage_3

Awesome. Good to hear.
Thanks!

crjackson

I was really decided on a VMP kit, but your thread has me thinking hard on the procharger. Those selectable modes are really appealing. Recent concerns about blowby have me reconsidering my options. What, if any, blowby issues/prevention are you dealing with? Also, can this be cranked up to 10 psi if wanted?

5LHO

If there are issues with blowby, there is an issue with the engine, not the supercharger. SC doesn't create blowby but it can make it a lot worse if the engine condition makes it possible. I would not make a decision based upon this.

Back when I used to rebuild turbos for fun I'd get turbos in that were "shot" and I'd pull them apart and find sometimes, they were full of oil because the engine they were attached to was a leaker. Heck, clean the turbo up and it was as good as new.

crjackson

I was referring to another member who is having issues since the VMP install, not my own, but I do like the apparent controllability of the programmable procharger. I'll wait a while and see how it all pans out. I'm in no great rush.

m05fastbackGT

Respectfully I must disagree, as adding a supercharger, turbo ect does indeed increase blowby.. They do so by increasing cylinder/crankcase pressure that pushes more oil past the rings and valve seals which is exactly the reason why air/oil separators and breather tanks were designed for in the first place..

Therefore what you posted concerning issues with blowby being caused by the engine and not the supercharger, is not accurate.. As all engines create a certain degree of blowby which is normal..

The issue however is excessive blowby, for which once again is caused by increased crankcase/cylinder pressure from running forced induction applications and not from issues with the engine as you posted !

5LHO

It'll only increase it if the ring seal isn't all that hot to begin with or you are pushing A LOT of boost through it. As I said, an issue with the engine, not the blower. typical stock ring packs are pretty light tension so, if the motor isn't really broken in well, you have damage, or you are pushing alot of hot boost through it, yes, you can have issues.

You'll want to stiffen up the oil weight a bit under boost as well, like 5W50.

m05fastbackGT

What you just posted about cylinder pressure only increasing if the ring seal isn't that hot to begin with, doesn't make any logical sense whatsoever..

The ring seals have nothing to do with increasing cylinder pressure, the seals are designed to prevent crankcase oil from getting past the rings..

Why do you think Ford designed the factory PCV system in the first place ? It was designed to ventilate the crankcase when under pressure that produces blowby which then gets sucked into the upper intake manifold under vacuum to be burned off rather than allowing for the gases to escape back into the atmosphere..

Just as mentioned previously, all engines produce a certain degree of blowby which is considered normal.. It's excessive blowby that's the real issue and is once again caused by increasing the pressurization of the crankcase..

Therefore if what you said about forced induction applications as not being a contributing factor for increasing crankcase/cylinder pressure is concerned.. Then explain why Ford performance parts and practically every tuning expert in the performance industry all recommend installing an air/oil separator or a breather tank for those who are running forced induction applications ? Because their purpose is designed to relieve crankcase pressure that's caused from running a FI application and not from some engine issue as you claim..

Even Ford performance parts now offer they're own air/oil separators designed for the 2015-16 Mustang GT and GT350.. So why would Ford even bother to design such a product, if they felt it was neither necessary or beneficial


Just for the record, my car has been running a supercharger for 10 years that has no valve seal/engine issues whatsoever.. As I'm certain there's many others on this site and also from other forums as well who have no issues with blowby being related to the engine !

crjackson

I've asked this question before on other forums/threads about super chargers but no one ever answered. I'll ask here and see what happens...

How does Chevy, Ford, & Dodge handle this issue on their HP factory SC vehicles? Do they come with factory installed oil catch cans, or some other mechanism?

m05fastbackGT

Very excellent question indeed ! Unfortunately the domestic 3 do not include factory installed oil catch cans for their factory supercharged vehicles, but they most certainly should though, being as Ford performance group/parts does recommend them..

However I can answer your question by saying that Ford performance group now offers they're own brand of oil separator/catch can designed for the 2015-16 Mustang GT and 2016 Shelby GT350..

Therefore if Ford performance is now offering an oil separator/catch can designed and engineered for the 2015-16 Mustang GT and 2016 Shelby GT350 which btw are both naturally aspirated vehicles..

Then obviously they were designed for a very good reason, otherwise FPG wouldn't had bothered wasting their time to begin with if there was nothing to be gained from them nor considered as beneficial..

Just to add.. Ford performance group does include it's own version of the Peterson oil breather/catch can installed on it's 2016 Cobra Jet Mustang..

Here's the link http://www.hotrod.com/features/1511-...a-jet-mustang/

crjackson

Finally the information I was looking for. I was aware of the new Ford separator but I was wondering about the GT500's, LS-1's and others. Now I know... They simply ignore the oil...

Well this thread has really opened my eyes/mind regarding S/C technology and availability. I'm pretty sure that when the time comes, I'm going with a programmable Procharger. I'm looking for a system that can boost at 10psi when wanted, and toned down easily for normal use. I realize the standard kit is a 7.5psi boost system, but I'm looking for just a bit more. Even 9psi might be a better choice. Once my headers are installed, I'll contact Procharger to get some professional guidance regarding my purchase. I believe they have an upgraded heat-exchanger, quieter gears, pully sizes, etc... I'll plan on 1-2 catch-cans during the install. Probably the Bobs cans.

Thanks for all the great information, this has been an excellent thread for me.

m05fastbackGT

You can pretty much thank the bean counters when it concerns ignoring the oil separators.. As they're only concern is turning as much profit as they possibly can and could care less when it comes to those select few of us who are actual car enthusiasts..

They're all about doing whatever it takes for cutting production costs and it's therefore left up to the consumer as to whether or not they want to purchase additional parts for their vehicles, despite the fact those parts are designed to extend their vehicle's engine life..


As for your choice in catch cans are concerned.. You really can't go wrong with the Bob's cans, as I've had mine for almost a year now and it really does it job well by not only capturing crankcase vapor oil, but it also prevents it from getting past the PCV barb connectors at the upper intake as well..

Anyway here's a couple of images of my Bob's can..

crjackson

It's all about the mighty dollar. I'm leaning hard (very hard) towards the Procharger (vs. the VMP). I like the fact that I don't have to worry about coolent, and the programmability is the most awesome. I haven't called Procharger yet but if I can get the configuration I want (9psi-10psi) I see no negatives other than the suction cup programmable display on the windshield ( not really crazy about that).

The BOB's can is a no-brainier here it seems. So I'lll be doing a catch-can either way. I see this to be beneficial even on an N/A machine.

The marketing material for Procharger is excellent and that is a convencing tool. I plan to get my headers, discuss with my local speed-shop guru, and then call and speak to both Procharger and VMP for Pros/Cons before the final purchase. Right now I'm leaning heavily towards the Procharger. If the marketing material and the 9 PSI on demand (competition mode) proves out, it's likely I'll go with the Procharger.

My only question mark at this point is using the stock manifold and throttl-body vs. the custom intake manifold and larger throttle body performance. This will be a discussion I'll take up with my installer and vendors I suppose.

The plan is this...

Headers and updated tune... Pay it off in a month or two, then make tthe S/C purchase. My only complaint is that no matter what I do, my local speed shop has a 3 month waiting period for everything. They're that booked in advance. It sucks but it gives me time to ponder.

Well, things are gonna happen quick I think. My only hesitation is the worry of inspection regulations. I currently have two homes and register in the state that has no inspections, but that could change. This is a street car so I do have concerns. I so hate the EPA and it's regulations.

Stage_3

Just be careful with the headers and the emissions if you live in an emissions complaint state. Make sure you get "green" cats to help. The tune will help as well, but I've heard that sometimes it can cause issues with emissions.
Good luck and keep us posted!

m05fastbackGT

Have you by any chance looked into D.O.B ? If not, they offer S/C kits for those on a budget.. They're pretty much the same whipple blowers on the factory 07-14 Shelby GT500 that are made adaptable for the 4.6L 3 valves..

You can either purchase the entire kit or build as you go by piecing together the kit individually.. They also offer excellent quality heat exchangers and intercoolers for keeping temps down as well..

Anyway if your interested, I've provided a link for the D.O.B website..

http://departmentofboost.com/product...t450_index.htm

crjackson

I have, and I'd love one, but the problem is getting it installed locally. There is a very reputable Mustang shop locally and he installs nearly everything but the D.O.B. kit and doesn't want to make the jump. He's also a ProCharger, VMP, Roush dealer and has done several hundred of these installs.

I haven't made my final decision, it just that I'm loving the programability of the Procharger. If I get said shop to do the install, it'll be either the Procharger or the VMP stage 2.

crjackson

The guy that's going to do the header/SC/Tune assures me that it will pass emissions testing (going with the catted H as mentioned). He said the rear O2's will be active and working, and it will pass both OBD2 and sniff testing when done. Given his local following / reputation, I have no reason to doubt him.

m05fastbackGT

Tony ! As much as I really hate to say this.. If the state in question requires emissions the vehicle can also fail the state's visual inspection as well for removing the OEM catted mid-pipe, as it's illegal to remove any portion of the factory catalyst equipment/exhaust under federal and state law..

Here in PA there are only 2 ways for getting around this.. If you put 5000 miles or less per year on your vehicle, you are eligible for meeting the state's emission exemption requirements or if your vehicle is registered in a county that doesn't require emission inspections at all..

The only other option, is to re-install the factory OEM catted mid-pipe every year prior to emissions inspection..



-Rocky