I voted "Close but no Cigar".I like it but I wish it had a vented hood and side louver or at least the option.

 

Well, I guess we are both entitled to our own views. I don't think there would be anyway to disguise the major weight gain we are talking about here without some serious upgrades to the suspension and brakes, certainly way more than the upgrades you mentioned for 08. The Mustang is already one of the weaker handling vehicles amongst its competitors, and this engine change, without some major upgrades like those seen on the GT500, would lead to more understeer and other such ill-handling traits.

Some may go for that and be ok with the increased power and reduced handling, no doubt.

 

Maybe some education in statistics may be in order for you? Because without it, you simply brush over the stupidly small sample size we have to work with here.

And while I agree that most people who buy this car fit your description, people who post here are certainly much more enthusiastic about mustangs than the average person in that group and much more interested in the topic. As well, they have more background on the product than the average person in that group. This is called a bias and that is what makes this poll NOT representative of anything other than the opinion of those who posted.

If you don't understand that, well, I am not going to bother arguing with you further.

 

Regardless of additional weight gain a higher performance engine would have brought to the '08 BULLITT, upgraded brakes would have been a benefit it could have used. That was one of my items of interest I was disappointed on.

 

Nah, I'm pretty well versed in statistics, but thanks for caring.

As to the "stupidly small sample size" on TMS, have a look at some of the other sites: IMBOC, StangsUnleashed, etc. The opinions being reflected here seem to be echoed on those sites as well. I think that indicates an overriding enthusiast opinion about the new Bullitt, a niche SE Stang targeted primarily at Mustang enthusiasts.

More enthusiastic than what "group"? We are the group, are we not?

I think my point about the niche response to Mustang SE variants was completely lost on you.

It is you who do not understand. As to not arguing with me further, well, that may be wise as you're apparently not grasping my point.

 

Your point is lost on anyone who has taken even a basic level statistics course. The sample size (important to determing the statistical relevancy to the population) is too small to tell anything. This is something that almost any entry level class/literature stresses as being paramount to a statistical inference made about a population (in this case those that might be interested in buying the car) from a sample.

The sample on which this poll is based on is biased. Stop being presumptious in what you know here, because this is a critical point that I am trying to make and judging by your responses thus far you don't show much comprehension of the subject. If you don't know what a statistical bias is, look it up, seriously. The wikipedia article I posted the link to should provide a good explanation.

Mustang enthusiasts are not the only car enthusiasts that would consider purchasing this car, so your whole point about the other websites (the mustang centered ones that you mentioned) has absolutely no significance. Furthermore, your presumption that only mustang enthusiasts will buy or make up the vast majority of buyers of this vehicle is based on nothing more than your own speculation. Go to www.carspin.net and go to the sports car forum and read up on the responses to this car. Most on that board (which BTW has been very anti-mustang at times) like the car, so if I were to use your twisted logic, I might say that because of that the general public opinion is quite positive towards the car. Of course, that would be flying in the face of all the education I have had towards statistics (which is by no means a lot), so I wouldn't do that.

Essentially, this sample has a disproportionate number of mustang enthusiasts represented. There are plenty of people that are interested in this car that do not visit mustang based websites and those people are not represented here. These people in this group may be less overly critical of some things than people here. For example, nobody in that group is going to say that they are disappointed because some vented hood was not put into production because they would not know that it was ever an option. Thus, the bias caused by this overrepresentaion of mustang enthusiasts makes the inference you are making (that the opinion generated by this poll represents the overall market reaction to this car) irrelavant and incorrect. You gotta remember, the % of car enthusiasts (mustang or not) that take the time to participate in online forums represent a very small % of that total population. There is a reason car companies don't datamine public opinion from enthusiast forums....

Now, if you wanted to say that this poll represents public opinion of MUSTANG enthusiasts who participate in online forums, I might be more inclined to agree with you.
And here I was saying that I wasn't going to argue anymore . I guess it is too hard to resist the propagation of such blasphemy.

 

I wasn't talking about disguising the weight gain as much as being able to live with. I will be able to sacrifice little driveability (which we usually learn to compensate for once we get used to a certain car) for the optional performance.

I don't know how the other vehicles are handling. I haven't read any reviews on them and don't have the new Dodge and Camaro to compare with yet.

I do like the handling of Mustangs; namely both the 2001 BULLITT I own and the new platform. I have no complaints with the 2 most recent models/platforms especially when I reflect back on how my 73 coupe handled back in the day compared to a BOSS 302 and a Pontiac Trans Am with RTS suspension, not to mention the Vettes.

Again ... I think Ford did enhance the chassis for 2007 so it could service the GT 500, but I could be wrong.

Again ... You might want to search some of Knight's post the past 2 weeks as he had some information on it.

Yes, I think some buyers would prefer a bigger motor over the handling issues. By the way ... I understand Ford did a totally different suspension for the 2008 BULLITT that is different from the Shelby GT and the base GT, a kind of "in the middle" suspension with the Shelby GT being considered a firmer but harsher ride.

The same off-the-shelf parts used in the Shelby GT could've been used for the 2008 BULLITT with a larger engine and possibly achieved the same results and been possibly cheaper than redsigning a whole suspension system to be used in only 7,000+ units(???)

Finally ... just to add another point ... The first thing (and best thing) I ever learned in statistics class is that "statistics can be manipulated as is necessary".

I've never forgotten that.

 

I agree with you.

 

Well, the weight gain, if not properly disguised (i.e. through correct and more thorough suspension and brake upgrades), will be unable to be lived with IMO. I mean the weight gain we are talking about here is close to 200lbs, right? Bigger engine, iron block vs. aluminum block.


I was referring more towards cars like the 350z, EVO, STi, and RX-8.

But then the brakes would need to be upgraded as well as the driveline to deal with the increased power and torque. An engine upgrade cannot be a one dimensional process. You must upgrade the rest of the car to compensate for this or you risk putting out a compromised product and that costs a lot more than the ~$3500 dollars this package is going for.

Statistics can be manipulated if the people that are being presented them do not understand how they are formed. Sometimes, usually when election season comes around, I giggle at the number of people that are so easily decieved by mindless %s that are presented on TV.

 

The "sample size" of the target market is also small, as is the number of Bullitts being produced. I reiterate: this is very much a niche vehicle. The GT500 is another example of a car primarily snapped up by hard core Mustang enthusiasts. I have not yet encountered an owner who wasn't: a) a hard core Mustang enthusiast; b) a member of at least one of the popular Mustang community websites.

As to this board being wholly unrepresentative of Mustang enthusiasts, or disproportionately biased, or a fringe percentage of the Mustang enthusiast community - that belies the very raison d'être for sites like TMS.

As evidence of TMS' growing influence among Stangers in the eyes of Ford Motor Co., why do you suppose Brad and his closest entourage have been given inside info for the past couple of years, and been invited to high profile events? By its very actions Ford clearly doesn't seem to believe that the opinions expressed on sites like this are statistically irrelevant, or I can assure you such sites wouldn't enjoy the inside access or information to which they've been made privy.

It is you who are being presumptuous, as your argument is overly dependent on conventional statistical analysis and outdated modalities.

Where is your evidence for this assessment? I have it on good authority that, in point of fact, major companies (including the auto industry) have entire teams devoted to datamining online public opinion.

"Blasphemy"? Overselling it just a tad, don't ya think?

 

Overall I think Ford did a nice job. I think the all aluminum 4.6 3V is the best engine for a mustang, its rev happy, responds well to mods and is more then enough power, not to mention it does not offset the weight near as much as the 5.4L cast iron engine. Will it be a collector car? Who knows, however at only 5,000 units they will be a hit at car shows, much like the Parnelli Jones edition mustang.

 

Just because Ford gives some privy information to TMS, doesn't mean they actually listen to what people are wanting, or desiring on here. They are simply catering to the large enthusiast following that this car has. Yes, I may have understated the importance of TMS in the eyes of Ford, but I know that in general (as told to me from some people that do this kind of work for a living, when I myself was interested in doing this for my career) these types of websites are not who they usually turn to for feedback. The situation could be substantially different with the mustang because of its somewhat cult following. The datamining of online information that you refer to is not in the form of some analysis of forums like this, I can tell you that.

Regardless, my original point stands. If you don't understand statistical analysis (which BTW, any argument of this type is going to relie on), then don't make the type of statement you made. There is nothing outdated about what I am bringing up, the bias that I noted is CLEARLY present. Certain parts of the population are sorely misrepresented in this sample. Like I said before, there is a large % of possible buyers of this car that DO NOT post on sites like this, whether mustang fans or not. That is undeniable. I know only a few on the website that I linked to you, who ever post on websites like this.

Your welcome to your opinion. Do not, however, think that any form of current statistical theory agrees with what you are saying. If you are ok with that (which it seems like you might based on your previous response), and you know that your presumptions on the validy of this pole are based solely on YOUR assumptions, then I guess we have nothing more to discuss.

 

Yeah, I've heard THAT one before.



You're wielding the "statistical analysis" argument like it's some sort of badge of honor. Its importance - in the limited way in which you seem to grasp it - is but one part of the equation I was referencing.

I stand by what I said previously. If it's not clear to you, I can't help it. Either way, I AM done with this discussion.

 

Well much of this debating/arguing is a bit pointless. The bottomline is: Do you like this car enough to buy it? And I think that is the question Ford is also asking?
Personally: I do and I have already put a deposit down.

As for the poll results....those numbers are changing. I think as the days go by more people are liking what they are seeing. The car is growing on them.

 

There are enough people out there who will like it, that I don't think Ford will have any trouble selling every one of them. But for me personally - after speculating and discussing and dissecting this car for the past two years - I am not the least bit regretting my choice to instead purchase a GT...not by a long shot. Particularly now that the CDN package price seems to be inching closer to $5K, making the performance additions less and less of a "bargain."

But you clearly like the car and should buy what makes you happy. It will be a nicely-rounded performer in a subtle aesthetic package.

Those who are dissatisfied maintain a healthy lead over those who think Ford "hit the bulls eye." I suspect this trend will continue.

 

I guess we just look at things differently- I see "close but no cigar" as: I like it but it's not a home run. I take it as a positive. So in that regard the numbers are very much in favour of this car.

 

Personally, I love the look. Dark green (love the color), no extra junk, nice seats/interior, not a car to bring attention to myself. I'm going for it as soon as my dealer gets pricing this week.

I think many people won't be happy until every mustang ford puts out has more power, suspension, braking, etc. than the last. Many had their sights set way too high for this car. To put it between the SGT and a reg GT, they went the perfect route for it.

 

Hey Wally, let me know the options you want, and I can PM you what the MSRP would be? Pricing is out now.

 

Thanks!

I'll pm you right now.

 

Remember that when Ford decided to release the new Bullitt, they had to make sure that it didn't affect present models offered in Mustang form. It's between the GT/Shelby GT and the GT500 and still leaving enough of a gap for a future Mach1 and Boss, just like they did in 2001. Can we say deja vue here? I think Ford hit the nail on the head (for the most part) with the new Bullitt by offering a balanced performer at a reasonable price that is very close to the original. Even the movie car had to be tweaked by Max from its original form and even then, it lagged behind the Charger. New owners can do the same with a host of aftermarket goodies that were never available in the movie days. And Ford themselves support this with their FRPP catalog. What a great time to buy a Mustang!
This new Bullitt is growing on me more and more. It is a very unique car meant for true Mustang enthusiasts. I may just have to buy one up and stuff it away!