WTF is up with 3rd gear on 08 GTs?
2/27/08, 10:40 AM
#21
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Is the grind you are talking about something you actually hear, or just feel through the shift lever??
When it's really cold out and the trans. is cold I'll get kind of a "nip" when I shift from 2nd to 3rd but its something I feel, not hear. After a few cycles of shifting it goes away. Now when pushing through the gears hard, I've had trouble actually trying to get it to shift into 3rd from second...almost like it's locked out. Seems like the higher the RPM, the more difficult it is to make it engage. The downshift from 4th to 3rd is smooth as silk though
When it's really cold out and the trans. is cold I'll get kind of a "nip" when I shift from 2nd to 3rd but its something I feel, not hear. After a few cycles of shifting it goes away. Now when pushing through the gears hard, I've had trouble actually trying to get it to shift into 3rd from second...almost like it's locked out. Seems like the higher the RPM, the more difficult it is to make it engage. The downshift from 4th to 3rd is smooth as silk though
2/27/08, 10:45 AM
#22
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Ow, sorry to hear it's infected the transmissions on the Bullitts too. I was hoping this was a limited problem, but I think in about a year the dealerships are going to be very used to these.
In fact the dealership I brought mine to didn't even ask any questions. Left it overnight so it would be cold for them in the morning and when I heard back from them they said they were going to need the car for a few days. Later I found out more about it, but absolutely no questions about it so far.
In the googling I've done on "TR-3650", this issue seems to be a hallmark of the 3650. I'm beginning to worry a rebuild won't solve the problem permanently. Would saving up for a T-56 and F/I make sense now?
GTMark052: The grind was very much felt & heard, it felt like I was holding a gigantic dentist's drill and was high speed drilling into a tooth - the noise and feel just kind of shot straight up my arm and chilled me. brrr.
In fact the dealership I brought mine to didn't even ask any questions. Left it overnight so it would be cold for them in the morning and when I heard back from them they said they were going to need the car for a few days. Later I found out more about it, but absolutely no questions about it so far.
In the googling I've done on "TR-3650", this issue seems to be a hallmark of the 3650. I'm beginning to worry a rebuild won't solve the problem permanently. Would saving up for a T-56 and F/I make sense now?
GTMark052: The grind was very much felt & heard, it felt like I was holding a gigantic dentist's drill and was high speed drilling into a tooth - the noise and feel just kind of shot straight up my arm and chilled me. brrr.
2/27/08, 11:20 AM
#23
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Yeah, I hear it and feel it. It's actually alot louder outside - I didn't notice how loud it really was until I ground with my windows down once. (usually have windows up because it's cold)
2/27/08, 12:12 PM
#24
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I went to the dealer today and one of the items on my list was the grind issue. They were not able to replicate it because it was not cold enough. however they did pull a sample of my tranny fluid.
For an 08 with almost 10k miles on it it had quite a bit of metal shavings in the fluid, they believe me but they still have not heard it. I am going to leave my car overnight at the dealership later this week or early next week when it gets cold again ( we have a 4-5 day break of 40-60 degree weather!) so they can replicate it and fix it.
I assume they are going to have to keep it a few days and get into the tranny. Im thinking of telling them to replace the fluid with full synthetic.
For an 08 with almost 10k miles on it it had quite a bit of metal shavings in the fluid, they believe me but they still have not heard it. I am going to leave my car overnight at the dealership later this week or early next week when it gets cold again ( we have a 4-5 day break of 40-60 degree weather!) so they can replicate it and fix it.
I assume they are going to have to keep it a few days and get into the tranny. Im thinking of telling them to replace the fluid with full synthetic.
2/27/08, 02:48 PM
#25
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Ow, sorry to hear it's infected the transmissions on the Bullitts too. I was hoping this was a limited problem, but I think in about a year the dealerships are going to be very used to these.
In fact the dealership I brought mine to didn't even ask any questions. Left it overnight so it would be cold for them in the morning and when I heard back from them they said they were going to need the car for a few days. Later I found out more about it, but absolutely no questions about it so far.
In the googling I've done on "TR-3650", this issue seems to be a hallmark of the 3650. I'm beginning to worry a rebuild won't solve the problem permanently. Would saving up for a T-56 and F/I make sense now?
GTMark052: The grind was very much felt & heard, it felt like I was holding a gigantic dentist's drill and was high speed drilling into a tooth - the noise and feel just kind of shot straight up my arm and chilled me. brrr.
In fact the dealership I brought mine to didn't even ask any questions. Left it overnight so it would be cold for them in the morning and when I heard back from them they said they were going to need the car for a few days. Later I found out more about it, but absolutely no questions about it so far.
In the googling I've done on "TR-3650", this issue seems to be a hallmark of the 3650. I'm beginning to worry a rebuild won't solve the problem permanently. Would saving up for a T-56 and F/I make sense now?
GTMark052: The grind was very much felt & heard, it felt like I was holding a gigantic dentist's drill and was high speed drilling into a tooth - the noise and feel just kind of shot straight up my arm and chilled me. brrr.
2/27/08, 02:51 PM
#26
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I went to the dealer today and one of the items on my list was the grind issue. They were not able to replicate it because it was not cold enough. however they did pull a sample of my tranny fluid.
For an 08 with almost 10k miles on it it had quite a bit of metal shavings in the fluid, they believe me but they still have not heard it. I am going to leave my car overnight at the dealership later this week or early next week when it gets cold again ( we have a 4-5 day break of 40-60 degree weather!) so they can replicate it and fix it.
I assume they are going to have to keep it a few days and get into the tranny. Im thinking of telling them to replace the fluid with full synthetic.
For an 08 with almost 10k miles on it it had quite a bit of metal shavings in the fluid, they believe me but they still have not heard it. I am going to leave my car overnight at the dealership later this week or early next week when it gets cold again ( we have a 4-5 day break of 40-60 degree weather!) so they can replicate it and fix it.
I assume they are going to have to keep it a few days and get into the tranny. Im thinking of telling them to replace the fluid with full synthetic.
But if it's warranty work, ask for a loaner car. They got me a Hertz rental car on their tab. Wow is the V6 Fusion a gas hog....
2/27/08, 02:56 PM
#27
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Some threads mentioned the shift forks were weak and I've had people tell me that the syncros weren't lubricated... but Centurion96 makes an excellent point: if the transmission is filled with oil, what would lubricated syncros matter???
I'm gonna ask the service department for more detail and the broken parts. I'm not sure if they'll be happy considering Ford's picking up the tab on it, but it's worth a shot.
2/27/08, 06:58 PM
#28
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Hrmm, don't look at me, that's what the service department manager told me. Also a GT500 owner on a different board told me it was an issue on the GT500s. Different transmission model but same transmission manufacturer, probably same machine that failed to lubricate the splines.
As far as how I understand syncros to work (watch the video), there are seperate syncros for each gear, an input and an output syncro (one on each side). They help mesh the gears so the rotational speeds aren't mismatched when the gear teeth engage (crunch!!!) So if the syncros on one gear aren't working, you're going to get some fun stuff going on when you shift.
As far as how I understand syncros to work (watch the video), there are seperate syncros for each gear, an input and an output syncro (one on each side). They help mesh the gears so the rotational speeds aren't mismatched when the gear teeth engage (crunch!!!) So if the syncros on one gear aren't working, you're going to get some fun stuff going on when you shift.
From what I have read, all the S197 TREMECS seem to have a high complaint for notchy shifting, 05 - 08. My 05 still does. The 06 on the lot I drove did. Complaining to the dealers was useless. The party line from Ford management is there isn't a problem, and the dealers are sticking to that story. Some of this is caused by not 100% disengaging the clutch, the rest seems to be a characteristic of this transmission and IMO, after market shifters do not improve the shifting efficiency, all they do is tighten up the shift gate feel, but the shift gate is still inside the transmission and has no idea what kind of stick is on the outside.. Boy I love my top loader in my 69 ... no such problems.
2/27/08, 08:39 PM
#29
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Rebel73, I noticed in your original post that you said the problem is ''occasional'' and the pedal has to be all the way in for a clean shift. If your clutch begins to engage with the pedal at like 2'' or less from the floor it sounds like a possible bad slave cylinder. If it begins to engage at around 3''-4'' from the floor then I wouldn't think it's the slave.
2/28/08, 08:42 AM
#30
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Complaining to the dealers was useless. The party line from Ford management is there isn't a problem, and the dealers are sticking to that story.
2/28/08, 09:03 AM
#31
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I only experience stiffness when shifting during very cold mornings. A friend of mine recommended changing the tranny fluid to Amsoil full synthetic. He swears it cured his problem. I will probably do the same before NEXT winter.
2/28/08, 06:21 PM
#32
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I have this exact problem, but only sometimes. I've never heard or felt any grinding. I sort of doubt the dealer will be able to replicate it, so I haven't complained yet.
2/28/08, 10:53 PM
#33
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The transmission has to be the single most evil mechanical device in the whole car...
2/29/08, 08:15 AM
#34
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If it's the same thing, then you'll have the issue when it's cold. Easiest way to ensure the dealer replicates the issue is to leave the Mustang there overnight on a cold night so the service tech can experience it in the morning. That's what my dealer recommended and they definitely replicated the issue. Depends on the severity you're experiencing though.
2/29/08, 11:18 AM
#35
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If they manage to replicate it and pull the tranny out, be prepared to be without the car for a little while. I dropped mine off Thursday night last week and they said I should have it back tomorrow or Friday. I'm not sure if I have much hope for this week though... wow I miss having my Mustang, lol.
But if it's warranty work, ask for a loaner car. They got me a Hertz rental car on their tab. Wow is the V6 Fusion a gas hog....
But if it's warranty work, ask for a loaner car. They got me a Hertz rental car on their tab. Wow is the V6 Fusion a gas hog....
I am taking it in on Monday. 08 with 10k miles and already a new tranny... here we go!
2/29/08, 01:09 PM
#36
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I left the car there last night, and I drove it this morning with the tech and replicated it. He said hey wont even mess with a rebuild, and they will just put a new tranny in it..He said he was also goint to talk to ford directly about this issue when I asked if they would put full synthetic in the new tranny.
I am taking it in on Monday. 08 with 10k miles and already a new tranny... here we go!
I am taking it in on Monday. 08 with 10k miles and already a new tranny... here we go!
Not to (continue to) thread jack, but I picked my GT up last night. I can honestly say it shifts 1,000 times better than the day after I bought it (knock on wood). The service manager seemed to take pride in letting me know I was getting a hand built transmission.
The amusing thing on the service receipt was what must be a note for the warranty payments audit department at Ford Motor:
"Please note some M time involved due to shop manual and online service publications are wrong as far as disassembly and reassembly along with clutch bleeding procedures."
Parts used:
1 ea Synchronizer Assembly - 3 (must be specific to 3rd)
1 ea *ring - 5th speed Sy (no clue what this is)
3 ea transmission fluid
They charged the warranty department 3 hrs to remove and reinstall the transmission, 3.7 hours to overhaul and 1.5 hours to bleed the hydraulic clutch system.
All in all I'm happy with the outcome now. Car's got a hundred miles on it and the transmission's great. The service people were gruff but expedient and I got a free loaner car for a week. Just wish I could have seen them rip apart the transmission, mechanical curiousity.
2/29/08, 01:49 PM
#37
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The ring is probably a blocker ring (1 for each gear). What I understand from TREMEC 1st and 2nd blockers are the same, 3rd - 5th are the same but different (carbon lining).
The synchro assy might be the slider and the hub its sits on.
The synchro assy might be the slider and the hub its sits on.
2/29/08, 02:17 PM
#38
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Wow, you guys are getting your tranny's rebuilt/replaced for the 3rd gear grind??
And all this time I thought it was just something I would have to deal with... maybe I'll wait until next winter to replace mine. And maybe have an aftermarket or replacement clutch in hand :P
Hopefully my dealership will be as nice..
And all this time I thought it was just something I would have to deal with... maybe I'll wait until next winter to replace mine. And maybe have an aftermarket or replacement clutch in hand :P
Hopefully my dealership will be as nice..
2/29/08, 02:46 PM
#39
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Wow, you guys are getting your tranny's rebuilt/replaced for the 3rd gear grind??
And all this time I thought it was just something I would have to deal with... maybe I'll wait until next winter to replace mine. And maybe have an aftermarket or replacement clutch in hand :P
Hopefully my dealership will be as nice..
And all this time I thought it was just something I would have to deal with... maybe I'll wait until next winter to replace mine. And maybe have an aftermarket or replacement clutch in hand :P
Hopefully my dealership will be as nice..
Replacement clutch would have been awesome, wish I had the cash on hand to have gone that route while they had the transmission out.
2/29/08, 04:31 PM
#40
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My car is at the dealer right now...hope it works out as well for me. All I know is, that grinding IS NOT acceptable and I will not take it back that way.