Just read the the sticky on how to properly lower an S197. I want to confirm what components I would need to start off with in order to lower my car without affecting the ride and/or my tires in any negative way.

I have the FRPP springs that lower the car 1.5" all around. Therefore, I think I will need the following as a minimum to start off with:

1. FRPP springs
2. Adjustable panhard bar
3. Camber bolts

Note: I am lowering the car primarily for looks and street driving. Not taking it to the track. Thus I included camber bolts as part of the essential package.

Any feedback here would be much appreciated

 

05 model GT, how many miles? If still on original stock shocks, you'll need to replace them, Koni STR would be best, but there's alot of others available. Stock shocks suck in the first place, but when lowered wear out even faster. And might as well swap the struts/shocks while you're doing the springs.

The panhard isn't an absolute must have, some people have very little offset after lowering -- technically you could wait til it's done, and if the rear end isn't centered, get the adjustable PHB then.

 

I have 10k on FRPP springs and an alignment. Everything else stock; no problems at all.

 

Strut mounts. The factory ones then to break after you remove the springs and install the new ones. I got the HD Steeda ones, and have 0 complaints! There's adjustability in the steeda, the OEM gives you no adjustability.

 

My 05 only has about 12K miles on it.....just drive it on nice days in the summer. It is basically street driven and taken to car shows.

I am running 275/35/20' in the back......so I am thinking especially with the wider tires, the panhard bar would be a must after lowering??

 

Which FRPP springs do you have? The ones that lower the car 1 inch or the ones that drop it 1.5 inches? What size tires you running?

 

The 1.5" drop; the same ones that come w/the FRPP suspension package. Wheels are Steeda Pentars w/275/40x18 on all corners.

 

All I did was eiback prokit, steeda shocks and struts, and BMR lower control arms. This setup has been on for about 2 years now, I am very happy with the ride quality and I have had no problems.

 

So the rear end is not off centered with the 1.5 inch drop and wider tires? Thats great if you were able to lower it without doing anything else other than a wheel alignment.

There is just so much information out there on suspension and what you should get or not get. I am looking at doing the minimum right now without ruining my tires or damaging anything else until I can save up more $$$.

Has anyone else lowered their car 1.5 inches and just gotten a wheel alignment only?

 

I've replaced my whole suspension except the front control arms. Here's my opinion of everything besides the springs:

--Struts: You'll definitely need struts because the stock ones aren't matched for springs that stiff. Your ride will be bouncy.

--Adjustable panhard bar

-- maybe camber bolts

Optionals:
-- Steeda HD strut mounts. Stock mounts are plastic and a lot of people hear them "pop" when going over speed bumps, etc. If you get these, skip on the Camber bolts. you won't need 'em because the mounts are adjustable. $300 though. Ouch.

-- Adjustable upper control arm to correct rear diff pinion angle. 95% chance you won't need it if you have a stock driveshaft because of the center joint. If you have a 1-peice then you'll have to check the angles and see. Bonus is it really cuts down on wheel hop.

-- Anti-roll bars. They make a big difference.

You can definitely go crazier with parts, and I think you probably will. Once you start putting on suspension mods, you'll see how much of a difference it really makes and you'll be hooked. I started with a rear anti-roll bar, adjustable panhard rod and lateral support. Then when I saw how much that made a difference on how the rear bit the pavement, I moved to the hard stuff. I've got over $2500 invested in mine and if I had the choice, I'd do it all over again.

 

It seems like the general consensus is to get the adjustable panhard bar, preferably one that can be adjusted in the middle. I hear the BMR one is a good one to get. Any others to consider?

Would you put the springs in and then see how it sits first in the back end and then put in the panhard bar if necessary? Or would you do a wheel alignment first and then put in the panhard bar if needed? Where in the process would one consider the camber bolts?

 

I personally would get the PHB regardless, but some people have gotten away with lowering their cars and not needing it, so you could wait on it if you feel lucky. I hear BMR is quality (I have the steeda one and I had to grind down...er "customize" a wrench to be able to adjust it), but there are others out there.

A wheel alignment and the panhard bar are two seperate things. Because of the solid rear axle, the wheel alignment on the rear is not adjustable. Camber, caster, and toe angle are all locked in permanently from the factory. So you could get your alignment done before or after the PHB, it doesn't matter.

Camber bolts give you more range of adjustment for the alignment, they need to go in before you take it to the shop.

 

Check this out and also read my GJM comment below.

http://www.mylrs.com/blogs/lrs/archi...tallation.aspx

Seems like accurate imfo. to me,

 

When I lowered my car, I didn't realize all the dynamics involved and was lucky to a certain point (but I can't understand why every S197 wouldn't behave the same way). If I did it again, I'd do everything at once. That includes shocks, struts, LCAs PHB and sway bars.

 

Yes, thanks for the info. I think this article confirms that for cars lowered about 1 inch, you may not need the panhard bar.....whereas for a more steeper drop, a panhard bar is likely to be needed to re-center the rear end as it sounds like there is some shift. Probably even more so if one is running wider tires in the back.

 

I will get the adjustable BMR panhard bar for sure as CJ Pony Parts is having a 10% off sale right now.

What is your opinion on the GT500 strut mounts? Or are they a waste of money and I should consider the Steeda ones instead? I guess forget them for now and save up for the Steedas if I am going to do this.

I can potentially see the value in the upgraded shocks and struts. I am wondering should I save up for the adjustable Tokicos that everyone is raving about or do I get the cheaper KYB ones now?? Keep in mind my car is street driven and taken to car shows only....I do not take it to the track though I do drive fast at times I do not want to buy something that is overkill for me......likewise I do not want to cut corners either. This whole suspension thing is new to me.

I appreciate everyone's input.

 

I've got absolutely no experience with GT500 mounts. Hopefully someone else here can answer that. The Steeda units are very solid though.

I've got the Tokicos. The squeak below 40 degF and I never adjust them (except when switching between my stock wheels that have rather squishy sidewalls and my summer wheels that are very stiff). I would skip on adjustable shocks unless you race (I never do)

 

The strut mounts:
If you put your stock ones back in (not damaging them/pulling them apart when swapping the springs), you're likely (though not guaranteed) to get the popping noises referred to above. From what I know this isn't dangerous (maybe they'll wear out earlier down the road??) but is annoying. So if you are then going to replace the mounts, might as well get the stronger GT500 ones, (which are quite cheap) than stick with standard GT ones. There will be no change due to the mounts in your N/V/H (noise/vibration/harshness).

The adjustable mounts (and camber bolts) are actually designed to bring the suspension back to stock camber settings (minimal caster change available with any of them), as when lowering you'll INCREASE the NEGATIVE camber, which actually makes the car handle better, but will wear the inner shoulder of the front tires faster. So you get the plates or bolts to go back to near stock camber and get less wear (but not as good handling). The J&M plates I have allow flopping from one setting to another, basically rotating the plate 180 degrees, to allow maximum camber (about 2.5 degrees, I think) or stock setting. I track the car so want the option of swapping back and forth for the better grip the increased negative camber gives. Can swap back to more vertical for the winter, then.

So, if keeping cost down is your goal, but you don't mind having to unbolt everything several times if you're unhappy, the cheapest is to buy just the springs, install, get your alignment, see how much negative camber you have up front and if you're unhappy with that, see how much offset due to the stock PHB you have in the rear and see if you're unhappy, and see how the ride is on the stock shocks. Then replace those pieces (camber bolts/plates, PHB/brace, or upgraded shocks) that are the source of the unhappiness. You might get away with stock shocks for a while but they'll wear out quicker, so probably will replace them eventually, so most people here suggest doing at least springs/shocks at the same times, since you're disassembling all the same parts to do both. Same with the camber bolts/plates.

I adjust my shocks on/off track, so I do like the D-Specs, but the Konis are a much better adjustable shock, so get those instead if you're going adjustable (they're a bit pricier than D Specs, both much more than non-adjustables). If non-adjustable, the Bilstein, Koni STR, or the KYB, probably in that order, are fine and any are better than stock.