I saw it, I sat in it, I reved the snot out of it
5/26/04, 08:12 PM
#1
Shelby GT350 Member
Thread Starter
I was up at Rodman Ford and met Dustin there. Both of us spent a lot of time talking to the Ford engineering manager for the 05 Mustang Exterior and Structure.
This interview is a composite of Dustin's and my questions to the Ford manager. This is NOT BS, this is for real, Dustin can confirm it!
Sit down and put your seatbelt on, you better be strapped in when you read some of this as I belive there is confirmation of some rumors and info never heard before.
I don't know if I should identify the Ford manager, I have his name, but in this I'm just using the tag "MW" for his responses to the questions.
This interview is a composite of Dustin's and my questions to the Ford manager. This is NOT BS, this is for real, Dustin can confirm it!
Sit down and put your seatbelt on, you better be strapped in when you read some of this as I belive there is confirmation of some rumors and info never heard before.
I don't know if I should identify the Ford manager, I have his name, but in this I'm just using the tag "MW" for his responses to the questions.
How much does it weigh?
WM "A lot"
How much is "a lot"
WM - sigh - " I can't say, it is a bigger platform, it's longer"
"I heard 3475"
WM - startled, pauses, sort of gives a nod.
How much HP does it really have?
WM - "I can't tell you."
Is it under rated?
WM - Let me just say that it is a VERY robust 300 HP
How does it compare to the Mach 1 engine?
WM - "It's better, in some ways a lot better" Let me tell you this thing has power. I'm not a racer, but to me this thing has more power than anyone in their right mind needs for driving on the street.
Does it use the Mach 1 Aluminum block?
WM - No, it's all new. Most of the engine is new, it does not share much of anything with the older 4.6's.
That shift lever feels like rubber. Is that the final choice? (manual trannie)
WM - Oh no, this is an early car. We've been working on the shifting, I think we've gone through 5 iterations since this car was built. We've also been working hard on the automatic shift calibration and let me tell you it is great. It's really responsive, they've worked hard on it. An average guy like me will go faster in the automatic than the manual. When I drive this car I have to be very careful, its unbelievably easy to find yourself going 90 MPH and not realize it. Let me tell you the handling and ride are incredible compared to the old SN-95. Well, it should be, since that car is really 20 years old the NVH (Noise vibration and harshess) are horrible on the SN-95 compared to the 05.
I heard the tooling for the SN-95 was completely worn out, that Ford could barely build SN-95s.
WM - A horrified look, Yes it was getting to be tough going at Dearborn. AAI is completely different, all new tooling and we're using the Mazda assembly method. Build quality will be excellent on the new Mustang. Just look how good this car looks and this is an early build prototype.
How does it sound?
WM - Here's the keys, go start it up and give it some revs.
(grinning from ear to ear) I always do what I am told, it sounds great, similar to a 03/04 Mach 1.
WM - What you just heard is nothing, you're reving it without any load on the engine. Wait until you hear it running through the gears on the street.
Let's go for a ride
WM - Sorry, we can't.
What happened to the 18" tires?
WM - sigh - SVT took them away from us.
You mean the GT won't ever have 18" tires?
WM - Probably not, SVT has a lot of power, they want their models to be special, so they got first dibs on the 18" wheels. You may see them on a Special Edition, but you won't see them on the regular GT.
What about IRS on the GT?
WM -There will not be IRS on the GT, as I said, SVT gets to make their models unique. Same with the hood scoop. SVT gets the scoops and air dams. There might be a SE with IRS though in addition to the Cobra.
When will see a SE?
WM - March
You're kidding me, that soon?
WM - Yes they're in the works.
What will the SE be called.
WM - We work in code names. It's up to the marketing department to give them a real name.
I heard that the SVT Cobra will not be out until the 2007 model year. Is that true?
WM - That's the plan.
How much HP?
WM - Well, everyone thinks that the Cobra has to have more than 400 HP.
So will it have >400 HP?
WM - I don't think they will be able to get 400 HP out of a 4.6.
Well that's easy to do, The present Cobra has that much now.
WM - But is has a supercharger.
You mean you're shooting for 400HP normally aspirated?
WM - That's what they'd like.
I've seen spy photos that show the lower air intake on the GT blacked out.
WM - Oh, they should have put one on this car.
One what?
WM - The grille insert. There is a black grille insert that goes in the GT bumper cover. It has the same pattern as the upper grill. It looks real sharp. I'll have to make a note to get lower grille inserts sent out to the show cars, it really sharpens it up.
What's the feedback on the GT foglamps?
WM - These are real fog lamps, they are functional and they meet the NHSTA definition of a fog lamp. If you read the brocures on other vehicles closely you'll note that a lot of them no longer can say that they have fog lamps, because they're not. They're calling them courtesy lamps or something like that because they really don't do anything in the fog. You should see the way this thing looks with all the lights on when we're doing our night shoots. It looks like a 747 is about to land.
How about HID, did you consider that.
WM - Yes, we considered HID and a lot of other things, complex reflector, projector.
You didn't do HID because of cost?
WM - Not so much that, these lamps, fog and headlamp are easy to work on and easy to modify. We did a lot of things that make it easy for the customer to work on and modify. The tail lamps too, you can easily change them and modify them.
Have you been working with aftermarket companies?
WM - Yes, but more importantly we've designed in a lot of things to be friendly to the aftermarket. See here ( pointing under the hood) there's your hood scoop cutout. You won't have to buy a SVT if you want a scoop, there will be plenty of aftermarket scoops for you to put on yourself.
When will we see the Convertible?
WM - Your dealer will have them on their lots by March.
That's earlyier than planned, isn't it?
WM - Well, we would have liked to have the convertible at launch, but that wasn't possible. Most verts are coupes with the tops cut off. We didn't do this. The vert has been designed from the ground up to be a vert. It's really a different body shell.
When do they go into production?
WM - January, maybe even early January. As I said your dealer will have them by March, maybe February.
Why didn't you use a hidden antenna on it?
MW - We couldn't get good enough (radio) reception.
Your kidding me, it wasn't because of the convertible?
MW - No
It wasn't because of cost?
MW - No, we just couldn't get good reception.
Lots of other cars have hidden antennas, you really couldn't get it to work?
MW - I don't know the reason(s) why, but we tried hidden antennas and the AM reception was horrible, customers would not be happy.
You're putting me on. No one listens to AM anymore.
MW - Around Detroit they do. AM is very important for traffic and sports around Detroit. We have to have good AM detection. FM is better with the whip antenna too. FM was OK with the hidden antenna, but it's better with the whip.
I've heard that you will be building only 180,000 Mustangs a year, don't you think that you will sell a lot more.
WM - In this segmented market? It will be hard, this isn't like 10 years ago, The Focus is a volume car and what do we sell, 280,000? The market is very segmented.
What if you do sell a lot more? Customers are already in line at their dealers ordering 05's.
WM - The plan is for up to 195,000 / a year. That would be two 10 hour shifts.
Can you go to 3 shifts?
WM - No the plant requires 4 hours of maintenance per day. That's it, 195,000 we can't build more we're flat out at that point. Even if we could expand the plant you can't just ramp up production beyond 200,000. A lot of parts come from outside vendors and their tooling may only allow 200,000 / year.
How many Verts will you build?
WM - I'm not sure exactly, about 40,000, that's just approximate.
So when will we really see the 05's at the dealer.
WM - We will be building the first "Saleable" cars in 2 or 3 weeks. We've just finished training 1,300 workers to built the 05 Mustang.
You mean before September?
WM - These will be pilot run cars, but they will be build exactly like regular production. All the parts will be production. If they go together without any problems, then we can sell them.
They we may see 05's before September?
WM - Can't say, but it's possible.
WM "A lot"
How much is "a lot"
WM - sigh - " I can't say, it is a bigger platform, it's longer"
"I heard 3475"
WM - startled, pauses, sort of gives a nod.
How much HP does it really have?
WM - "I can't tell you."
Is it under rated?
WM - Let me just say that it is a VERY robust 300 HP
How does it compare to the Mach 1 engine?
WM - "It's better, in some ways a lot better" Let me tell you this thing has power. I'm not a racer, but to me this thing has more power than anyone in their right mind needs for driving on the street.
Does it use the Mach 1 Aluminum block?
WM - No, it's all new. Most of the engine is new, it does not share much of anything with the older 4.6's.
That shift lever feels like rubber. Is that the final choice? (manual trannie)
WM - Oh no, this is an early car. We've been working on the shifting, I think we've gone through 5 iterations since this car was built. We've also been working hard on the automatic shift calibration and let me tell you it is great. It's really responsive, they've worked hard on it. An average guy like me will go faster in the automatic than the manual. When I drive this car I have to be very careful, its unbelievably easy to find yourself going 90 MPH and not realize it. Let me tell you the handling and ride are incredible compared to the old SN-95. Well, it should be, since that car is really 20 years old the NVH (Noise vibration and harshess) are horrible on the SN-95 compared to the 05.
I heard the tooling for the SN-95 was completely worn out, that Ford could barely build SN-95s.
WM - A horrified look, Yes it was getting to be tough going at Dearborn. AAI is completely different, all new tooling and we're using the Mazda assembly method. Build quality will be excellent on the new Mustang. Just look how good this car looks and this is an early build prototype.
How does it sound?
WM - Here's the keys, go start it up and give it some revs.
(grinning from ear to ear) I always do what I am told, it sounds great, similar to a 03/04 Mach 1.
WM - What you just heard is nothing, you're reving it without any load on the engine. Wait until you hear it running through the gears on the street.
Let's go for a ride
WM - Sorry, we can't.
What happened to the 18" tires?
WM - sigh - SVT took them away from us.
You mean the GT won't ever have 18" tires?
WM - Probably not, SVT has a lot of power, they want their models to be special, so they got first dibs on the 18" wheels. You may see them on a Special Edition, but you won't see them on the regular GT.
What about IRS on the GT?
WM -There will not be IRS on the GT, as I said, SVT gets to make their models unique. Same with the hood scoop. SVT gets the scoops and air dams. There might be a SE with IRS though in addition to the Cobra.
When will see a SE?
WM - March
You're kidding me, that soon?
WM - Yes they're in the works.
What will the SE be called.
WM - We work in code names. It's up to the marketing department to give them a real name.
I heard that the SVT Cobra will not be out until the 2007 model year. Is that true?
WM - That's the plan.
How much HP?
WM - Well, everyone thinks that the Cobra has to have more than 400 HP.
So will it have >400 HP?
WM - I don't think they will be able to get 400 HP out of a 4.6.
Well that's easy to do, The present Cobra has that much now.
WM - But is has a supercharger.
You mean you're shooting for 400HP normally aspirated?
WM - That's what they'd like.
I've seen spy photos that show the lower air intake on the GT blacked out.
WM - Oh, they should have put one on this car.
One what?
WM - The grille insert. There is a black grille insert that goes in the GT bumper cover. It has the same pattern as the upper grill. It looks real sharp. I'll have to make a note to get lower grille inserts sent out to the show cars, it really sharpens it up.
What's the feedback on the GT foglamps?
WM - These are real fog lamps, they are functional and they meet the NHSTA definition of a fog lamp. If you read the brocures on other vehicles closely you'll note that a lot of them no longer can say that they have fog lamps, because they're not. They're calling them courtesy lamps or something like that because they really don't do anything in the fog. You should see the way this thing looks with all the lights on when we're doing our night shoots. It looks like a 747 is about to land.
How about HID, did you consider that.
WM - Yes, we considered HID and a lot of other things, complex reflector, projector.
You didn't do HID because of cost?
WM - Not so much that, these lamps, fog and headlamp are easy to work on and easy to modify. We did a lot of things that make it easy for the customer to work on and modify. The tail lamps too, you can easily change them and modify them.
Have you been working with aftermarket companies?
WM - Yes, but more importantly we've designed in a lot of things to be friendly to the aftermarket. See here ( pointing under the hood) there's your hood scoop cutout. You won't have to buy a SVT if you want a scoop, there will be plenty of aftermarket scoops for you to put on yourself.
When will we see the Convertible?
WM - Your dealer will have them on their lots by March.
That's earlyier than planned, isn't it?
WM - Well, we would have liked to have the convertible at launch, but that wasn't possible. Most verts are coupes with the tops cut off. We didn't do this. The vert has been designed from the ground up to be a vert. It's really a different body shell.
When do they go into production?
WM - January, maybe even early January. As I said your dealer will have them by March, maybe February.
Why didn't you use a hidden antenna on it?
MW - We couldn't get good enough (radio) reception.
Your kidding me, it wasn't because of the convertible?
MW - No
It wasn't because of cost?
MW - No, we just couldn't get good reception.
Lots of other cars have hidden antennas, you really couldn't get it to work?
MW - I don't know the reason(s) why, but we tried hidden antennas and the AM reception was horrible, customers would not be happy.
You're putting me on. No one listens to AM anymore.
MW - Around Detroit they do. AM is very important for traffic and sports around Detroit. We have to have good AM detection. FM is better with the whip antenna too. FM was OK with the hidden antenna, but it's better with the whip.
I've heard that you will be building only 180,000 Mustangs a year, don't you think that you will sell a lot more.
WM - In this segmented market? It will be hard, this isn't like 10 years ago, The Focus is a volume car and what do we sell, 280,000? The market is very segmented.
What if you do sell a lot more? Customers are already in line at their dealers ordering 05's.
WM - The plan is for up to 195,000 / a year. That would be two 10 hour shifts.
Can you go to 3 shifts?
WM - No the plant requires 4 hours of maintenance per day. That's it, 195,000 we can't build more we're flat out at that point. Even if we could expand the plant you can't just ramp up production beyond 200,000. A lot of parts come from outside vendors and their tooling may only allow 200,000 / year.
How many Verts will you build?
WM - I'm not sure exactly, about 40,000, that's just approximate.
So when will we really see the 05's at the dealer.
WM - We will be building the first "Saleable" cars in 2 or 3 weeks. We've just finished training 1,300 workers to built the 05 Mustang.
You mean before September?
WM - These will be pilot run cars, but they will be build exactly like regular production. All the parts will be production. If they go together without any problems, then we can sell them.
They we may see 05's before September?
WM - Can't say, but it's possible.
5/26/04, 08:32 PM
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[QUOTE]"It's better, in some ways a lot better" Let me tell you this thing has power. I'm not a racer, but to me this thing has more power than anyone in their right mind needs for driving on the street.
I like that sentence.
I like that sentence.
5/26/04, 08:33 PM
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Originally posted by KapitanGT@May. 26th, 2004, 8:26 PM
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
5/26/04, 08:35 PM
#10
Makes sense. SVT is keeping all the cool parts from the silver concept car, show cars, and Gt-R. 400HP N/A and no 4.6L statement makes me wonder if they will go with a 5.4 or will we see the long cammer engine?
5/26/04, 08:37 PM
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Originally posted by montreal ponies+May. 26th, 2004, 8:36 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (montreal ponies @ May. 26th, 2004, 8:36 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-KapitanGT@May. 26th, 2004, 8:26 PM
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
[/b][/quote]One thing is that 18" tires are indeed on their way, SVT did not take them. I have my own info on special editions but I don't want to get anyone in trouble.
5/26/04, 08:39 PM
#13
Originally posted by KapitanGT+May. 26th, 2004, 8:40 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (KapitanGT @ May. 26th, 2004, 8:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
And may i ask what it is that you don't exactly agree on!
Originally posted by montreal ponies@May. 26th, 2004, 8:36 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-KapitanGT
<!--QuoteBegin-KapitanGT
@May. 26th, 2004, 8:26 PM
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
And may i ask what it is that you don't exactly agree on!
[/b][/quote]I don't suppose you can at least hint at when you think we will see one?
5/26/04, 08:42 PM
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No major SE till 2007 but there is a slight SE (very minor changes, nothing we have anticipated) coming out either in late 05 or early 06. I myself am hoping these are just ideas and not 100% finalized plans and that they actually release a major SE (Bullitt, Mach 1, etc.) in 2006 cause that's when I'll be buying my Mustang.
5/26/04, 08:44 PM
#15
Shelby GT350 Member
Thread Starter
Originally posted by KapitanGT@May. 26th, 2004, 8:26 PM
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
Well I have my own inside sources and ours don't exactly agree on everything (I've seen insider Mustang stuff myself). But thanks for the info!
Your info seems to agree with mine, that is there will be a SE before the SVT Cobra. He did not say that this SE it will have IRS & 18" ers, just that a future SE might, so it could be another SE as I'm sure there will be several SEs.
One more comment about the SVT engine, he did NOT say that the SVT will NOT have a S/C engine. He said the original plan was for 400 HP N/A. He sort of implied that the SVT may end up with a S/C again to get over 400 HP.
5/26/04, 09:02 PM
#17
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Originally posted by Galaxie@May. 26th, 2004, 9:01 PM
So basically this S/E would probably be a simple cosmetic package? maybe wheel + tire upgrade, etc.
If it was a bullitt... I would jump on it
So basically this S/E would probably be a simple cosmetic package? maybe wheel + tire upgrade, etc.
If it was a bullitt... I would jump on it
I don't think there will be a SE with IRS & more HP until after the next SVT appears.
5/26/04, 09:10 PM
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The SE would be phat if it was a classic Mustang from the factory with modern safety features and brakes and such.
I think the pony in the grille is larger on the classics than the '05, despite what the Ford dude said.
I think the pony in the grille is larger on the classics than the '05, despite what the Ford dude said.
5/26/04, 09:39 PM
#20
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I like the 195,000 a year and also the "saleable cars in 2-3 weeks"
Means they are going to be cranking through ... 535 cars a day ... so basically at two 10 hr shifts, thats almost 27 cars an hour. I think all the "shortage" rumors can go away now.
Means they are going to be cranking through ... 535 cars a day ... so basically at two 10 hr shifts, thats almost 27 cars an hour. I think all the "shortage" rumors can go away now.