t69r00p69

Your best argument is just like beating a dead horse. I've heard countless of bench racers say "If I put this on my car it would beat you", then the other tool reply "Well I'll just put some mods too and you're right where you started...slower than me." It's a pointless argument. Mind you I'm no bully, as I said on my first post I believed they were NICE runs considering the fact that they could've been the '99 or '01 cobras. But, I saw OTHER peoples replies to it possibly being an '03 you were messing with and I just had to voice my

HairyCanary

My reasoning is simple -- mod both, or leave them both stock. By definition if they are equal, they are equal. Can you make the suspension on the SN95 equal or better than the S197? Yes. Can you make the chassis of the SN95 as stiff as the S197? Yes.

And if you want to talk about money, then how about this. I bought my Cobra for just under $24k. The price I would have paid for a 2005 GT (slightly below MSRP after negotiation) was $27k. Right there I have $3k to use for mods to make the suspension of the Cobra better. Can I make it better than S197 with $3k? Oh yes. And then I would have to blow $1k (actually a little more, but I'll round down) on seats for the GT, because the stock ones just don't cut it. That is something I did not have to do for the Cobra. So I'll take that $1k and invest it in power mods for the Cobra (filter, 2.76 pulley, idler, & tune).

So at this point I've invested the same amount of cash. What I have is a car that will out-corner and out-accelerate the 05 for the same or less money. And for me that is the right choice, because I didn't get into Mustangs for comfy rattle-free daily drivers, I'm all about bang for the buck and outright performance. If I wanted a comfy semi-quick daily-driver I would have bought an Acura or Lexus.

Dave

max2000jp

You didn't think that one through. Or maybe you did...

Put some mods on the GT. Now it handles better than the Cobra. Alright, lets be fair, put some mods on the Cobra -- coilovers & subframes. Now the Cobra handles better than the GT again.

And put the whipple on the GT. That should give it about 400 rwhp with a good tune, which means it should be a good race with a stock Cobra. But again, lets be fair, put some mods on the Cobra -- filter, 2.76 pulley, idler, and a tune. Now the Cobra is 475 rwhp and 500 rwtq. Cobra wins again.

Any car can be made to corner very well, or accelerate very fast. It's all about how deep your pockets are. As good as the new GT is, it simply cannot be made the equal of an 03/04 Cobra without investing a lot more money than the difference between the cost of the two cars. Ford has the benefit of economy of scale, and its impossible to keep up when you pay aftermarket prices.

So drive what you want, because you have no control of what other people drive and you will always find someone faster. Maybe even a Honda Civic .

Dave [/b][/quote]
The GT handles better than an 03 Cobra per every review I have read. The new GT benefits greatly from a stiff, modern chassis. The 03 Cobra will need substanial bracing to get close to the stiffness of the 05. This adds weight, which doesn't help handling. The 05 has better weight distribution and a better front suspension setup. The 03 Cobra does have an IRS, but it's not a really great design. Ford had to make comprimises because the SN95 wasn't designed for an IRS suspension. Also, the 03 cobra comes with wider performance tires vs the 05s 235/55/17 A/S's. Put some real performance tires on the 05 and the gap will increase even more between the 2. My friend was an instructor at that IRP event and told me to join SVTOA in order to be eligible for track events. I am going to do this when I get my car, so next spring I will report back how well the 05 hangs with Cobras.

Stangfriik

Oh yea? Well my dad can beat up your dad

max2000jp

I hate that arguement....People buy cars because they like them. The coulda, woulda, shoulda arguement is weak. Any 05 owner with any mechanical knowledge could have bought a Fox Body and caged it, modified the suspension, BBK, and put a built motor in it. That scenario would produce a faster car than both the Cobra and 05 at a fraction of the price. The 03-04 Cobra is a great bang for the buck, but so is the 05. You get a ton of improvements that the SN95 needed.

PONY XPRESS

t69

Again if you read my original post closely I comment how nice the blower sounded when he went buy. I made it very clear it was a late model car in my first sentences.

Hairy

I am glad you got a Cobra cheap, not sure if it was new or used, either way your argument is not logical. New Cobra at MSRP & New 05' at MSRP. Put the difference into the 05' to match the Cobra & 05' wins. As others plus myself have said the SN95 is a flexible flyer. The chassis is like the foundation of a house. Build on sand, your in trouble, build on rock your good to go.

snkbtn99

No ...the '05 was brought down from Michigan for this event along with the GT supercar ... It was being driven by one of the SVTOA instructors.

I was running on Pole positions S03 ---- street tires .... The only mods done to my car are HR springs and Bilstein dampers and a strut tower brace for handling and full exhaust. Nothing major ....

The '05 ran VERY well for a live axle on the ORC, but I do believe the IRS made up for the difference in the twisties .....

Could have been the driver had bigger cahonies also

In any race it comes down to driver .... I don't care what anyone says .... I consider myself to be a pretty darn good driver. I was running by '03/'04 Cobras, Lightnings, etc .....

My car was dynoed the previous nite at Kenny Browns at 288 hp at rear wheels .... Remeber again ...mine is a '99 non FI Cobra

1 COBRA

Perhaps a 0 to 60, a 1/4 mile, a slalom, and a few laps on a track might clear up some of the doubts. There are too many intangibles on the street for a solid conclusion to be reached. The real test is on a track with two compatible drivers. It's good being enthusiastic and optimistic. My money would go on being realistic.

fioresvt

yes i will be definitely hitting up some winter sundays at atco, especially while i am working on my tune after i get the blower ported. hopin for some 125-126 mph trap speeds and 10.9s. especially in the winter air, it may trap even higher. what mods you got planned for the GT?

PONY XPRESS

Michael, we will have to try to meet at ATCO after the holidays. Would love to see that 10 second run.

Will be doing cold air, just did a test with my "Poor Mans Version" see tech section.

Doing mufflers delete (Tuesday, will post pics) & most likely a flash. Come spring 18X9's. I use my car daily & put about 40K a year on it. If I can see high 12's I would be real happy for a daily driver. Then maybe pickup the new Cobra for a toy.

fioresvt

nice, all these 05s need is a drop and some nice 18,19" rims. wow lookin for 12s with just CAI and muffler delete, that would be impressive. catch you around, will keep my eye out for you on 287.

Grey03

I am not sure about that. A stock 05 GT puts about 260 to the rear wheels. Add a supercharger that gives around 100 hp and you have 360 to the wheels. Most stock 03/04 Cobras have between 360 to 380 Hp. Now add a filter and catback and the cobra is at around 400. Add a pulley and tune and 450-500. My 03 made 448 hp and 475 tq (at the rear wheels) with just a pulley, tune, filter, and catback. Also take into account that the 05 weighs just about as much as my Cobra 3575 for the 05 and 3600 for the Cobra. (I weighed my car on a truck scale) and it seems that you would have to spend a lot of money to get an 05 to run with a Cobra.

Now that being said the 05 is head and shoulders above the Cobra in quality and I would love to have the rear end setup instead of the POS IRS. With that setup 05 drivers could be able to get Cobra like 1/4 mile times because of traction, but they will never have the mph.

MindControl3

I wouldn't doubt that the '05 has better handling than an '03 or '04 cobra. The platform itself is a more solid, rigid platform. When it comes to performance though, the cobra could pass and '05 with ease I would think. Maybe the cobra driver wanted to get a good look at the '05, which is why it didn't pass until the end.

snkbtn99

[/b][/quote]
I still laugh out loud when I see someone call the IRS on the Cobras a POS. The COBRA was NOT built specifically to be a 1/4'er. Have you ever taken you car onto a ORC? If you did, I bet you wouldn't call your IRS a POS.

The '05 is a great car and I will be adding one to my stable very soon, but I blew it's doors off at IRP with a driving instructor driving it. It ran well, but my fairly bone stock slow POS '99 with fix and all left it. Granted, this is 1 application, but it happened throughout the day with many different drivers behind the '05. I think I have a pretty good baseline on how it performs in the twisties.

In different applications these cars ('05s) could possiblt outshine the Cobra. Put it on a 1/4 mile and yes, it may be a close race. It may not be. Put it on the twisties and it is all over. Sorry. This is my REAL WORLD experience with the vehicle. The IRS is worth it weight when it comes down to ORC and you throw some curves into the equation. Period.

Yes, you could say a nerve was struck this morning ....

angcobra

No flame here just perspective of 2 sides to a story.
I have 01 & 03 Cobra and have driven 05 GT. 1 thing for sure, sometimes we only hear 1 side of the race. I read a post recently where a guy talked about staying with an 03 Cobra from the light until 3rd gear before the 03 could pass..... turns out, I was the 03, I did not even know the guy was going, I was in 3rd gear. I only turned 1st and 2nd to about 3500 rpm. When I knew he was going, I stepped in it and passed him within a second. Sounded like a good story for him but, he did not know the other side. When you are at the track, at least eveyone knows he is racing.

MindControl3

I love how this site brings together so many mustang fans. This story now has two sides to it. Two other people met each other for the first time in years on this forum. It's awesome B)

bullittman68

GO TO THE TRACK!!
good story, angcobra
If you want to race, make it even and race at a safe track, not on the street.
The exception is if you only go 20-25 over the speed limit on a clear road.
Any more, and its way too dangerous.

1 COBRA

THAT'S IT!!! I've had enough. I can't take this embarrassment any longer.
I AM GETTING THE '05!

Is the one way ticket to Fantasy Island included in the '05's $5K over MSRP or is it another dealer add on?

If it is, I won't be able to afford the stripes.

da75

For those still missing his point, I think Pony has already agreed that a stock cobra will dust a 05 GT in a straightline. I dont ~think~ hes necessarily even saying for certain that a stock 05 will beat a 03 cobra through the turns.
What I think he is saying is that the 05 is a superb platform to the cobra for the money that it is, and for 'just' being a GT. And that with some modding it will beat a stock cobra (which is impressive and somthing to be proud of). He could be entirely right since the GT mods are a variable and nothing that we know for sure yet.

On the other hand, remember no one said 'the new GT will beat the new Cobra'. Right now its sort of apples to oranges bc there is no new body style cobra out yet for 05. And when there is, .. well thats a whole new GT vs. Cobra thread. So this is sort of a "if I mod my GT it will beat an X years old Cobra." Thats just owner pride to me, and whats wrong with that? Obviously hes a good driver and was just posting a fun 'hey i hung with an 03 for whatever reason' post.

Just my $.02 since this thread has sort of seemed to go downhill.

SurfnSoCal

Sweet...then me going 95mph (70mph speed limit) on the I-10 in San Bernadino is kosher.


I wish someone would have told that motor cop.......