typesredline

I haven't experienced wheel hop on mine either. I've read about people having the issue. But I guess you just need to know how to properly launch. On my fwd RSX however, wheel hop is nuts. I've got 75A and billet motor mounts to LESSEN it. Lol.

Stevedotmil

So I have read this whole thread so far and this debate can sidetrack the point of a thread like when you were looking for your Chuck Taylor you threw into the curtains only to realize that your hot next door neighbor left her curtains open while she was headed for the shower and you suddenly forgot everything you know.

So I have plenty of friends that own tracked European sedans and coupes, all of which have an IRS. That being said they all understand just how difficult it is to harness all the torque using the SRA set up after riding with me. I'm a mediocre driver on a good day and still managed to squeeze a ton of performance out of my 13' Track Pack on the Green Hell as I could muster. It's all about what's important to you. I like a challenge and it just so happened that I saved myself roughly 20K in the process. Here's my data courtesy of Harry's Lap Timer.





























And I used less fuel having just as much fun.

White2010

If solid rear axle was good enough for Steve McQueen its good enough for the rest of you candy a**es. Debate over. lol

Jazzman442

Most people will not be able to get there cars to the maximum of what they are capable of. Hell They wont get 50% of what they are. Most of the time the best mod for your car is Driving school. I will take a solid axle any day. Most drivers on the street race stop light to stop light. Solid axle has the advantage. I have never heard any one complain about there mustangs axle. " I wish I had IRS I could go faster" LOL

rhumb

Sound argument as to why everyone should drive a base econobeater, with bias ply tires, drum brakes and all of 100hp.

AWmustang

Quite honestly it doesn't matter if IRS is better or not. The market says that a car of the Mustang's intended purpose and price point should have it, so Ford has no choice. And that's debate over! LOL.

typesredline

Um, not really. Not at all actually. His argument is that advantages of irs over, and lets make sure we specify, the current iteration of the LRA would only be seen while pushing the car to its limits which not many owners actually do. Also he argued that a LRA is more ideal for the common street race. Therefore, having irs isn't something alone to envy.

This has zero to do with econocars with 100 hp.

IndustryLeech

There are other perceived improvements that should affect handling. This is the most balanced Mustang ever if recent articles are to be believed. I think the number I saw for the Ecoboost is 52/48 weight distribution. How much will that help? I would assume this is something drivers of all skill levels will feel.

typesredline

Ok....not talking about other improvements to the structure or balance. Talking about irs. So sure, overall handling will improve. That's a given. But not much of it will be directly from the irs unless at its limits.

rhumb

I would argue that many of an IRS's benefits are realized well under 100% driving and under a lot of conditions that the average owner/driver could feel and appreciate. Those benefits might include a more resilient ride yet more controlled ride, greater stability and safety over rougher roads, greater control over rougher roads, etc. Most Stang drivers likely don't street race (I presume you narrowly mean stoplight racing on smooth, straight roads), but rather, drive and appreciate the performance of their car on a wide range of roads, conditions and speeds.

In the end though, it's going to take wheel time to resolve the debate. Given what Ford's done with their smaller ST siblings, I have high hopes for what Ford can wring from a fully modern RWD performance suspension.

Joeywhat

Forget racing, where the road surface is generally very good with no potholes and bumps and ridges...I want IRS for driving around town so I don't feel like I'm driving a horse drawn cart on the poor Michigan roads. My previous RWD vehicle (a Mercury Cougar) was MUCH better behaved on poor road surfaces, and it's suspension was just about shot.

Jazzman442

Bottom line in all of this is. IRS is much better around a corner. Has better driving dynamics. Not to say LRA can not ride that way. If you want to road race, Auto Cross go IRS. If you race in a straight line or a big oval you will want a LRA.

Ford even knows this:


Read this:
http://www.roadandtrack.com/go/news/...or-new-mustang

wonger

To be fair, your Bullitt is down over 100hp than the current GT yet alone Boss or Shelby. I've had plenty of S197 cars and love the Bullitt, but dude you are incorrect. I've seen your comments for what feel like forever but are probably only four years or so and you've got to get off of the Bullitt is perfect and has no inherent issues. The brakes and suspension are sorely lacking on your car for a HPDE yet alone any real track work. It's a fine street car and driven reasonably you won't reach it's limitations and can thoroughly enjoy it. Your driving hard sounds like my reasonably. Full throttle just about each drive, just not banging off the limiter is what I'm talking about. You don't answer anyone's questions and only pick out quotes and laugh or make fun. I find it very tiresome threads get reduced by your contributions at such a high rate of your postings. Please contribute or stay quiet on the topics.

cdynaco

I appreciate your opinion. I presume you own and/or have put Bullitt through its paces?

I understand that different Mustangs have different power and different characteristics. So what?

It is not 'down' 100 hp. It has the hp and tq that Ford's SE engineers specifically matched the suspension, tires and brakes for. How do my comments somehow put down your or others Mustang's? I am simply stating the Bullitt experience since there are so few Bullitt owners on TMS. I have never said it was the baddest bestest have I? You are extrapolating something I have not said. However, #901 has been flawless from the factory and is an awesome machine!

I do not race other people and do not go to a track. However, I push hard on favorite isolated two lane mountain twisties that I have known well for 30 yrs - one of which drops 3700' in 30 minutes with hard turns incl a few 180*. No shoulders, no run-offs, just drop off, boulders, and trees. The turns are far too tight for 'bouncing off the limiter'. However, I see redline everyday if you are presuming I'm driving at 3k, and particularly 5k up on mountain two laners for the purposes of power band and weight transfer for neutral handling. And that beautiful GT40 sound.

I have tried to get the brakes to fade on descent within my style of driving which includes double clutching/downshifting to keep the throttle at least under some acceleration or neutral at a minimum into the turn so as to keep weight transfer where handling responds. There is little understeer that way. I have a lifetime and hundreds of thousands of miles on SRA incl on snow and ice where skill = saving your life. Plus I understand how Bullitt engineers designed the suspension/weight transfer based on learning it. I know SRA and have zero need for IRS. I was not raised on my Mom's FWD like many of you IRS whiners. My brake testing was to determine if I wanted brake cooling and/or upgrade. After most of the descent, where the brakes are the hottest, there still is no fade. Naturally, climbing back up to 5k' is the most fun.

I have also had to lock up at 65 when an idiot pulled out without looking my way. I have 1000% confidence in Bullitt's upgraded brakes that were designed specifically for it.

And I repeat, I have not had any wheel hop issues off the line. I have read where Bullitt engineers addressed that and tweaked the suspension accordingly. Apparently they know more than you. Sorry if you can't accept that.

If you don't like my posts then don't read them. Or block me. I could give a rats asz. I write to please me, not to impress you.

Dave07997S

Now its fixed..

However, that M3 although it did have the ZCP package it had the inferior Continental Contisport 3 tires, not the Pirellis or the Mich. PS2s that most of them come with. During that test Randy Probst talked that the Mustang would have been in the weeds if he went through the chicane as the same speed of the M3 due to the lack of shock control.

Also, the M3 was over 4 sec. faster per lap than a PP 5.0L Mustang at Lightning Lap of America. Now the Boss 302 is another issue.

Dave

typesredline

Ok. But shocks are an easy fix. The boss is still LRA and it smokes the m3 if I remember right.

2k7gtcs

And how much did that M3 cost?

Jazzman442

This thread could go on forever. It comes down to Driver Ability, Tires, Suspension tuning for the car.

I had a Lexus pull up to me an older SC400. He started to yell crap to me and my son. They he cut us off. I followed him and he was crapping in his pants because he could not loose me. We were travailing pretty fast. Lexus has the IRS and I have the LRA.

Guess what I was not in my mustang I was in my Suburban. It has a LRA, Eibach racing suspension, Sways and Edelbrock Racing shocks, Brakes are Cross cut and drilled GM racing Pads.

You can make anything handle better if you want.

cdynaco

Shame on you. Don't you dare question the IRS know it alls and their 'god of handling' that disregards the entire package. They know because they learned on their mom's fwd with all their other effeminate friends on the way to soccer practice.
The debate is restricted to stick or hinged axle only.

Jazzman442

Before I got my 2014 GT I was wanting to build my own hot rod. I looked at the Factory Five seems to have the best one out there. I learned allot about suspensions during my years of drag racing and research on building the ultimate Hot Rod.I got caught in the IRS battle and wanted a IRS car. Well that was till I got on the Hot Rod Forums. This did it for me:


The 33 beat the Lamdo..

Guess What: it has a Mustang 3 point LA rear. HAHA Just like the 2014 has..

I think the debate just might be well in my mind OVER....Just Saying