Confirmed: 2013's have different pistons and no oil squirters
3/14/12, 09:55 AM
#21
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3/14/12, 10:16 AM
#22
Originally Posted by mycroft
I'm still here. That piston does not add 8HP.
The point is, the piston change was only a portion of things that allowed them to safely increase power output without harming durability.
I would guess the pistons aren't forged, but phosphate coated. Something else interesting, the 2013 GT and Boss have vents on their hood...coincidental? I think not.
3/14/12, 11:03 AM
#23
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Originally Posted by 99mstng
I think heat and piston design combined lead to the issues we saw. The #8 tends to run the hottest so if one piston is going to go that is usually the first.
It will be interesting to see what if any issues the 2013's will have and how well they will react to a tune/boost vs. the 11-12's.
3/14/12, 08:45 PM
#24
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3/14/12, 10:00 PM
#25
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If the piston design was bad we would hear of random piston failures. Piston 8 failures (from what I understand) was from bad tuning due to knock sensors being disabled causing detonation. The random engine failures I hear of that are always "very" vague are probably just manufacturing defects which always happen.
No question is stupid. I actually think its very cool to see how engineering progresses and improves through each revision.
No question is stupid. I actually think its very cool to see how engineering progresses and improves through each revision.
It's great to see a Mustang forum were the members are level headed and informative, I also like to see engineering improvements.
The 5.0 is one bad *** engine
MARZ,
That's some funny shiz
3/15/12, 10:46 AM
#26
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I dont complain much, car runs great, no mt82 issues, and I've put about 6k miles on the car since 08/2010. I've ran the car very hard almost weekly on sunny days. On the piston issue....Realistically they could have just said it was 8 more HP without changes but the new piston design is an area of concern with me. I'm an engineer but not a expert on engines but at the same time I deal with manufacturing and they have made very obvious engineering changes. Hard to say if it was cost cutting, fixing a real issue, or a combination of both. It wouldn't hurt for some of us to write Ford on this, carbon copies to local dealers, and MMFF/5.0 magazines. I want to know why. I don't expect anything but an answer and at this point I'm going to buy a new short lock to have ready for my blower. I'm more worried about my clutch going out at this point in time...drag racing starts soon.
3/16/12, 09:21 PM
#27
Legacy TMS Member
So...somebody help me with my ignorance - what the heck is an oil squirter and what are the advantages/disadvantages of using those in a motor?
3/16/12, 10:53 PM
#28
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Squirting oil under the pistons helps cool the pistons, which in turn helps reduce detonation. The Coyote V8 runs a very high 11:1 compression given that it can use 87 octane gas, so controlling detonation is important.
3/16/12, 11:03 PM
#29
Legacy TMS Member
Originally Posted by Five Oh Brian
Squirting oil under the pistons helps cool the pistons, which in turn helps reduce detonation. The Coyote V8 runs a very high 11:1 compression given that it can use 87 octane gas, so controlling detonation is important.
3/17/12, 06:45 AM
#32
Shelby GT350 Member
Originally Posted by Overboost
Something else interesting, the 2013 GT and Boss have vents on their hood...coincidental? I think not.
3/17/12, 10:22 AM
#33
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3/19/12, 10:40 AM
#34
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The 5.0 in the 11-12 mustang has already proven it makes more than 412hp at the crank. Its underrated from the factory. Maybe ford bumped the claimed hp up to 420 to make it sound like they made an improvement...help sell more vehicles.
It will be interesting to see a stock 11-12 on a dyno the same day as a 13. I bet there is less than 8hp difference.
It will be interesting to see a stock 11-12 on a dyno the same day as a 13. I bet there is less than 8hp difference.
3/19/12, 01:44 PM
#35
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Nice to see you again. So, was the 8 HP gain purely hype?
The point is, the piston change was only a portion of things that allowed them to safely increase power output without harming durability.
I would guess the pistons aren't forged, but phosphate coated. Something else interesting, the 2013 GT and Boss have vents on their hood...coincidental? I think not.
The point is, the piston change was only a portion of things that allowed them to safely increase power output without harming durability.
I would guess the pistons aren't forged, but phosphate coated. Something else interesting, the 2013 GT and Boss have vents on their hood...coincidental? I think not.
All 5.0's.....2011-13 have same rated power,402 hp on regular fuel....extra 8 hp is with premium fuel only....
Internal friction reductions wouldnt result in this...
3/19/12, 02:26 PM
#36
Currently a Corvette Owner!
If already posted, sorry, but here's two quotes published today, may shed some light, or may lead to more confusion!
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3/19/2012 - Car and Driver, "Ford has found eight more ponies in the 5.0-liter V-8, achieved by applying Boss 302 piston coatings and discontinuing the oil squirts formerly cooling the undersides of the pistons, a function the engineers now believe to be unnecessary based on experience with the 5.0".
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3/19/2012 - Motor Trend, "Let's start with those eight extra horses, which nobody was clamoring for, but are welcome just the same. They were found in Boss 302-inspired calibration changes like making the spark retard a bit less conservative and deleting the oil-squirters that cooled the pistons but were deemed superfluous and a source of windage losses".
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3/19/2012 - Car and Driver, "Ford has found eight more ponies in the 5.0-liter V-8, achieved by applying Boss 302 piston coatings and discontinuing the oil squirts formerly cooling the undersides of the pistons, a function the engineers now believe to be unnecessary based on experience with the 5.0".
-------------------
3/19/2012 - Motor Trend, "Let's start with those eight extra horses, which nobody was clamoring for, but are welcome just the same. They were found in Boss 302-inspired calibration changes like making the spark retard a bit less conservative and deleting the oil-squirters that cooled the pistons but were deemed superfluous and a source of windage losses".
-------------------
3/19/12, 02:54 PM
#37
Originally Posted by kws6000
Numbers on ford.com website ,for mustang specs, reads to me that power increase is from tuning changes.....
All 5.0's.....2011-13 have same rated power,402 hp on regular fuel....extra 8 hp is with premium fuel only....
Internal friction reductions wouldnt result in this...
3/22/12, 04:14 PM
#38
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Nice to see you again. So, was the 8 HP gain purely hype?
The point is, the piston change was only a portion of things that allowed them to safely increase power output without harming durability.
I would guess the pistons aren't forged, but phosphate coated. Something else interesting, the 2013 GT and Boss have vents on their hood...coincidental? I think not.
The point is, the piston change was only a portion of things that allowed them to safely increase power output without harming durability.
I would guess the pistons aren't forged, but phosphate coated. Something else interesting, the 2013 GT and Boss have vents on their hood...coincidental? I think not.
Something I noted and so did my friends when I first got my 5.0. The heat that poured from under the car was incredible. I noticed it and it was commented on by anyone we stood near the car while it was idling. That played a big part in me deciding on the Steeda hood when I put a new hood on my car. It is designed to vent that heat out. It really helped. I don't notice the heat bellowing out from underneath any longer. You can look over the hood now while idling and see the heat waves coming from the vent.
3/23/12, 04:05 PM
#39
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I just did a search on ford parts.com. I compared the piston they called out for my 2012 GT 1/12 build date) to the 2013 piston. They are both calling for the same part number, 6108. Not sure if this helps clear anything up, but maybe it can point us in a direction.
