S197 = ultimate "having cake, eating it too" car?
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Shelby GT350 Member
Joined: May 18, 2010
Posts: 2,318
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From: CT
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: January 6, 2006
Posts: 14,053
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From: Bay Area, CA
S197 = ultimate "having cake, eating it too" car?
Originally Posted by FromZto5
The 15 Challengers, esp Hellcat version, are currently available in manual????????????????????????
Thread Starter
Shelby GT350 Member
Joined: May 18, 2010
Posts: 2,318
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From: CT
Oddly, the T6060 manual was a cost-added option until 2011.
It's still not as spectacular of an all-around car as the S197 Mustang.
I Have No Life
Joined: September 24, 2011
Posts: 10,141
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"all around" car? hmmmm maybe you have a point there.
Thread Starter
Shelby GT350 Member
Joined: May 18, 2010
Posts: 2,318
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From: CT
They're much more dialed-in than you would think from looking at the stats. The R/T suspension (2011 and up models) is surprisingly firm and responsive for a 2-ton roadwhale...but nowhere near as agile as a Mustang of any trim level...The shift action is better than the MT-82 IMO.
The 5.7L Hemi is a gem of an engine...it's just not athletic enough for a huge car like the Challenger. The SRT/Scatpack 480/480 (hp/torque) 6.4L motor is only slightly more potent than the Coyote in the S197 when motivating the Challenger. Close enough to be a driver's race.
Personally, when I look at a base/6spd Scatpack Challenger for $38k..I'd be hard pressed to pick an S550 GT over it for the same money. The S550 is still a much better all-around car but I suppose that subjective measures start to play a role at some point.
Bullitt Member
Joined: August 13, 2013
Posts: 261
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From: Burlington
In other words, you can disguise it to hide the sports car underneath. (A style of subterfuge perfected by the BMW 3 and 5 series).
I prefer to be straight out with it. I want my sports car to look like a sports car.
Mach 1 Member
Joined: July 22, 2005
Posts: 800
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I have had an S197 in my life for over six years now (between two GTs) and I can't get over what a package these things are.
I tend to treat my GT as a "toy" (where my old XJ Cherokee does the brunt of the commuting and all of the bad weather duty)...but simply cannot get over how versatile these cars are, GT and V6 alike.
It's basically as quick as anything on four wheels that you'll come across on a normal day...and vastly cheaper than anything notably quicker
Extremely comfortable for long drives
Generous cargo area
Respectable fuel economy (especially the V6 models)
Reliable (not too many Mustang people get stranded)
Easily attainable parts and relatively affordable maintenance costs
I think the Mustang is rivaled only by the WRX as being quick, cheap to buy, cheap to own and practical. The WRX is way better in slippery conditions but it's also not as quick in the good weather.
You could probably make a similar case for Camaro and Challenger but each is less versatile as an every day car...Mustang is quicker/cheaper model for model. It's also way easier to park than either one.
I think the trend continues with the S550 Mustangs but they seem somehow more complex and the are also incrementially more expensive, of course. Also the back seat supposedly is even less usable than the one in the S197 (thanks to less head room).
I tend to treat my GT as a "toy" (where my old XJ Cherokee does the brunt of the commuting and all of the bad weather duty)...but simply cannot get over how versatile these cars are, GT and V6 alike.
It's basically as quick as anything on four wheels that you'll come across on a normal day...and vastly cheaper than anything notably quicker
Extremely comfortable for long drives
Generous cargo area
Respectable fuel economy (especially the V6 models)
Reliable (not too many Mustang people get stranded)
Easily attainable parts and relatively affordable maintenance costs
I think the Mustang is rivaled only by the WRX as being quick, cheap to buy, cheap to own and practical. The WRX is way better in slippery conditions but it's also not as quick in the good weather.
You could probably make a similar case for Camaro and Challenger but each is less versatile as an every day car...Mustang is quicker/cheaper model for model. It's also way easier to park than either one.
I think the trend continues with the S550 Mustangs but they seem somehow more complex and the are also incrementially more expensive, of course. Also the back seat supposedly is even less usable than the one in the S197 (thanks to less head room).
Handles very well (Kenny Brown Track Suspension)
Comfortable on trips (Many trips to run the Dragon!)
Good size trunk (bigger than my BMW Z4)
Faster than most cars on the street (Thanks to Vortech SC)
Reliable (I just change the oil every 5000mi)
Respectable Fuel Economy (never got under 22mpg except on track days and it gets 26-27 highway)
I think Mustangs have always been very good bang for your buck (In their time) My 85 GT was great and it was capable of 30mpg!
I know it is a 2010-2014 thread...can't help posting a pic!
Last edited by tacbear; Aug 18, 2015 at 01:43 PM.
Shelby GT350 Member
Joined: May 31, 2013
Posts: 2,144
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From: Indianapolis
Isn't the Scat Pack not all that much faster than a base Mustang GT in the 1/4 mile? I think it runs about 12.6 according to the automotive journals. The 13-14 Mustangs can do as good as 12.7. A car with 65 more hp should be quicker than that...that's where the Challenger's weight really comes in. Why pay all that money for a Scat Pack when you could get a base GT with Brembos and maybe 3.55's or 3.73's instead? Use the money you saved towards a supercharger and blow the Scat Pack out of the water!!
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Joined: July 9, 2015
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Isn't the Scat Pack not all that much faster than a base Mustang GT in the 1/4 mile? I think it runs about 12.6 according to the automotive journals. The 13-14 Mustangs can do as good as 12.7. A car with 65 more hp should be quicker than that...that's where the Challenger's weight really comes in. Why pay all that money for a Scat Pack when you could get a base GT with Brembos and maybe 3.55's or 3.73's instead? Use the money you saved towards a supercharger and blow the Scat Pack out of the water!!
The 15 auto scats are running 12.2's at sea level tracks with good prep stock. The are a good 1/2 second faster than new GT's. My buddy in his 15 SP auto was running 12.5's at my local track of 1500 feet elevation and 1900 DA. A stock 15 GT auto was barely running 12.9's same night. They are very nice cars, but pricey. His stickered for 50k.
A guy with 15 SP auto with custom tune and DR's just ran 12 flat @ almost 118 mph. They are not slow. With cat delete, tuning, and tire they will be in the 11.8 range. fyi...
Last edited by WhitePonyGT/CS; Aug 19, 2015 at 11:53 AM.
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Last edited by WhitePonyGT/CS; Aug 19, 2015 at 01:45 PM.
Member
Joined: July 9, 2015
Posts: 46
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His SP did have a Hellcat inlet for his airbox being only mod. Stock tires etc. My car cj intake, tb, JLT cai, and x pipe. 12.31 to his 12.53. I now have 6 to 8 degrees more timing and leaner a/f with Lund 100 octane tuning.
The sh.. gets real once the video gets posted. Lol.
The sh.. gets real once the video gets posted. Lol.
Last edited by WhitePonyGT/CS; Aug 20, 2015 at 05:57 AM.
Cobra Member
Joined: October 23, 2009
Posts: 1,312
Likes: 2
From: NW Minnesota
There is no one car that is the best for everyone, but for me my Mustang is pretty much perfect. My previous car was a 2000 Corvette, which was a lot of fun on perfectly smooth roads. But on normal roads it was stiff and on bad roads the ride was punishing. My Mustang GT (with some mods by Steeda) is just as fun as the Corvette was on a winding road, but you can drive it down a normal road without being reminded that you are in a sports car every time you drive over a crack in the street surface. It's comfortable as an all-day cruiser, and a blast when you get the chance to run it hard. I've had mine for five years now and I still regularly remark to my wife (especially if I've just wound it out to redline for a gear or two) "My God, I love this car."
GT Member
Joined: February 28, 2015
Posts: 200
Likes: 2
From: Cotati CA
I have had an S197 in my life for over six years now (between two GTs) and I can't get over what a package these things are.
I tend to treat my GT as a "toy" (where my old XJ Cherokee does the brunt of the commuting and all of the bad weather duty)...but simply cannot get over how versatile these cars are, GT and V6 alike.
It's basically as quick as anything on four wheels that you'll come across on a normal day...and vastly cheaper than anything notably quicker
Extremely comfortable for long drives
Generous cargo area
Respectable fuel economy (especially the V6 models)
Reliable (not too many Mustang people get stranded)
Easily attainable parts and relatively affordable maintenance costs
I think the Mustang is rivaled only by the WRX as being quick, cheap to buy, cheap to own and practical. The WRX is way better in slippery conditions but it's also not as quick in the good weather.
You could probably make a similar case for Camaro and Challenger but each is less versatile as an every day car...Mustang is quicker/cheaper model for model. It's also way easier to park than either one.
I think the trend continues with the S550 Mustangs but they seem somehow more complex and the are also incrementially more expensive, of course. Also the back seat supposedly is even less usable than the one in the S197 (thanks to less head room).
I tend to treat my GT as a "toy" (where my old XJ Cherokee does the brunt of the commuting and all of the bad weather duty)...but simply cannot get over how versatile these cars are, GT and V6 alike.
It's basically as quick as anything on four wheels that you'll come across on a normal day...and vastly cheaper than anything notably quicker
Extremely comfortable for long drives
Generous cargo area
Respectable fuel economy (especially the V6 models)
Reliable (not too many Mustang people get stranded)
Easily attainable parts and relatively affordable maintenance costs
I think the Mustang is rivaled only by the WRX as being quick, cheap to buy, cheap to own and practical. The WRX is way better in slippery conditions but it's also not as quick in the good weather.
You could probably make a similar case for Camaro and Challenger but each is less versatile as an every day car...Mustang is quicker/cheaper model for model. It's also way easier to park than either one.
I think the trend continues with the S550 Mustangs but they seem somehow more complex and the are also incrementially more expensive, of course. Also the back seat supposedly is even less usable than the one in the S197 (thanks to less head room).
I park next to nice cars hoping they stay longer than I. Although rare, parking far away means you are very protective of your car and might attract mean spirited people. I had an '01 Cobra and someone pushed a shopping cart to it.
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