I either have the worst luck in the world or Ford just makes crappy cars
9/20/10, 07:59 AM
#61
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This man nailed it.
For all of you guys saying that I should just wait and have ford replace all the parts is absurd. If you are willing to bend over like that, take it, and smile...you're better than I am.
I been through this once before with my 2006. A week after I bought it, it started having drive-train problems. After they tried to fix that, I started having transmission problems and shifting. After that, it started leaking water. As stated, in 4 years I was in the shop 15 times and over 60 days or so. Finally sued Ford for damages for selling crap. You'd be surprised how many owners had issues with water leaks, even the GT500 guys. You invest so much money into a stupid car, lose so much on depreciation and take a 80% haircut to residual value because of these problems? Who would buy a car when you have 100 pages of paperwork in 4 years?
Anyway, I STILL went with ford, got a mustang I wanted. As far as the mileage on the car, it had 60 miles on it when my dealer exchange driver went to get it. Driving back, it was a 200 mile trip. It was the car I wanted, so the extra mileage shouldn't matter. Obviously the moment I drove off, 3 lights down I tried to shift and it wouldn't. The mechanic stated he has to tear the tranny go into it see why gears aren't working, blah blah blah. Same crapola. I want a NEW CAR so I don't have to worry about this. Why is this hard concept to grasp?
Anyway, the dealership is dicking me around now since they're saying they don't have right allocations to order a new Mustang from Ford blah blah blah. I'm just about to walk out of this deal and take my money back. They have until the end of today and I'm just going to buy an Audi A5 if they don't want to make this right. I gave them the build specifications and they started bsing me. They also said that once they replace all the parts in the current 5.0 that they will just put it back in inventory and sell it to another poor soul.
I even told them to send it back to Ford since it's factory defect and they simply said that ford could care less about that. I'm seriously about to just blow up over this. Seconds away.
For all of you guys saying that I should just wait and have ford replace all the parts is absurd. If you are willing to bend over like that, take it, and smile...you're better than I am.
I been through this once before with my 2006. A week after I bought it, it started having drive-train problems. After they tried to fix that, I started having transmission problems and shifting. After that, it started leaking water. As stated, in 4 years I was in the shop 15 times and over 60 days or so. Finally sued Ford for damages for selling crap. You'd be surprised how many owners had issues with water leaks, even the GT500 guys. You invest so much money into a stupid car, lose so much on depreciation and take a 80% haircut to residual value because of these problems? Who would buy a car when you have 100 pages of paperwork in 4 years?
Anyway, I STILL went with ford, got a mustang I wanted. As far as the mileage on the car, it had 60 miles on it when my dealer exchange driver went to get it. Driving back, it was a 200 mile trip. It was the car I wanted, so the extra mileage shouldn't matter. Obviously the moment I drove off, 3 lights down I tried to shift and it wouldn't. The mechanic stated he has to tear the tranny go into it see why gears aren't working, blah blah blah. Same crapola. I want a NEW CAR so I don't have to worry about this. Why is this hard concept to grasp?
Anyway, the dealership is dicking me around now since they're saying they don't have right allocations to order a new Mustang from Ford blah blah blah. I'm just about to walk out of this deal and take my money back. They have until the end of today and I'm just going to buy an Audi A5 if they don't want to make this right. I gave them the build specifications and they started bsing me. They also said that once they replace all the parts in the current 5.0 that they will just put it back in inventory and sell it to another poor soul.
I even told them to send it back to Ford since it's factory defect and they simply said that ford could care less about that. I'm seriously about to just blow up over this. Seconds away.
Well if you guys think Ford delivering a brand new car that has a major drivetrain component failure at well under 500 miles is acceptable, and something the new owner who just plopped down in excess of an entire average annual wage on should have to subsidize, (yes, subsidize by not having the use of the brand new car they paid/are paying for, for an extended period of time, and when the get it back it is "repaired" with "replacement" parts, not factory original as it rolled off the showroom floor, and has uncompensated diminished value) I think you are mistaken.
This is a Ford Mustang, not micro$oft Windows for crying out loud. The rigorous R&D, testing and inspecting and generally outstanding craftsmanship that go into rolling a brand new Mustang off the line and into customers hands generally works very very well! When it does not, Ford should step up to the plate and do the right thing.
No matter what your particular quirks with the computer industry, which really does not compare with the automotive industry in anyway, there is a reason a "branded title car" has half the value or less (if you can find a buyer) of an original unrepaired car. You do not have to like it or agree with it, the fact is when Ford has a major system failure on a brand spanking new car like that and repairs it there is real diminished value involved that apparently Ford, you and other posters believe the original poster ssimaniac should just eat.
This repaired diminished value doesn't even touch on things like half-assed work being done when the dealerships guys "repair" the thing. For another thread, but I had the driveshaft come loose on one of my trucks shortly after Ford paid for a dealerships "technicians" to replace an engine, and they didn't put it back together properly. That same truck lost two over $700 (total repair bill each occurrence) electric cooling fans and associated fixtures too because they broke some of the retainers for the plugs/wires and it never got reinstalled properly until the third time after my truck overheated pulling a 40 foot trailer over 800 miles from home...
How do you put a value on having to fight with the dealership to get them to pay for repairing things their own shoddy workmanship caused after the original repair???
You really believe Ford should be able to repair it, toss the owner into a cheap rental, taking however long (in my case over a month, not counting the three additional repairs to fix the shoddy workmanship from the original repair) to "maybe" (keep your fingers crossed) repair this brand new Mustang back to hopefully original condition.
All the while the owner does not have use of his formally brand new car, and once he gets it back and now has a "repaired" not "as new" original car, and worse will forever wonder what did not get put back together properly and what/when it will fail next.
This has absolutely nothing to do with houses, hamburgers or computers, your analogies miss the mark.
You guys think that is OK? You are mistaken.
I think Ford Motor Company should eat it. Take the car back and replace it with a different NEW Mustang, they can sell the used "repaired" Mustang for what they can get for it. We all know that will be a diminished value.
If as some of you seem to believe there is no diminished value, Ford looses nothing, and has a happy customer for life.
This is a Ford Mustang, not micro$oft Windows for crying out loud. The rigorous R&D, testing and inspecting and generally outstanding craftsmanship that go into rolling a brand new Mustang off the line and into customers hands generally works very very well! When it does not, Ford should step up to the plate and do the right thing.
No matter what your particular quirks with the computer industry, which really does not compare with the automotive industry in anyway, there is a reason a "branded title car" has half the value or less (if you can find a buyer) of an original unrepaired car. You do not have to like it or agree with it, the fact is when Ford has a major system failure on a brand spanking new car like that and repairs it there is real diminished value involved that apparently Ford, you and other posters believe the original poster ssimaniac should just eat.
This repaired diminished value doesn't even touch on things like half-assed work being done when the dealerships guys "repair" the thing. For another thread, but I had the driveshaft come loose on one of my trucks shortly after Ford paid for a dealerships "technicians" to replace an engine, and they didn't put it back together properly. That same truck lost two over $700 (total repair bill each occurrence) electric cooling fans and associated fixtures too because they broke some of the retainers for the plugs/wires and it never got reinstalled properly until the third time after my truck overheated pulling a 40 foot trailer over 800 miles from home...
How do you put a value on having to fight with the dealership to get them to pay for repairing things their own shoddy workmanship caused after the original repair???
You really believe Ford should be able to repair it, toss the owner into a cheap rental, taking however long (in my case over a month, not counting the three additional repairs to fix the shoddy workmanship from the original repair) to "maybe" (keep your fingers crossed) repair this brand new Mustang back to hopefully original condition.
All the while the owner does not have use of his formally brand new car, and once he gets it back and now has a "repaired" not "as new" original car, and worse will forever wonder what did not get put back together properly and what/when it will fail next.
This has absolutely nothing to do with houses, hamburgers or computers, your analogies miss the mark.
You guys think that is OK? You are mistaken.
I think Ford Motor Company should eat it. Take the car back and replace it with a different NEW Mustang, they can sell the used "repaired" Mustang for what they can get for it. We all know that will be a diminished value.
If as some of you seem to believe there is no diminished value, Ford looses nothing, and has a happy customer for life.
9/20/10, 09:55 AM
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I'm glad Ford is stepping up and taking care of you as a customer relations issue because they certainly have no obligation to do so no matter how much you rant and rave about it. There is nothing in the limited warranty or in any consumer laws that would require them to replace a car - regardless of mileage - because of a repairable problem. You should consider yourself lucky that they are in fact going beyond what is strictly necessary to try to make you a happy customer.
For those of you screaming "it only has 300 miles" (or 60 miles or whatever), where do you draw the line? If the transmission failed at 1000 miles? or 2000? or 15000? The legal line is drawn at the point where the new owner takes possession. Any failures after that are warranty issues where the remedies are clearly spelled out in the warranty documentation.
Oh, and check the contract you signed very carefully. It's quite possible (even likely) that it has an arbitration clause - so you can't sue. That means you can't rely on some sympathetic jury ignoring the law and awarding damages. An arbitrator would look at whether Ford was meeting the terms of their own warranty and you would get only that.
I'm not arguing that this isn't the right thing to do or that Ford shouldn't replace your car. I think they are looking at the individual circumstances and trying to make it right. I'm just saying that this outraged sense of being owed something beyond what's in the warranty may be misplaced.
For those of you screaming "it only has 300 miles" (or 60 miles or whatever), where do you draw the line? If the transmission failed at 1000 miles? or 2000? or 15000? The legal line is drawn at the point where the new owner takes possession. Any failures after that are warranty issues where the remedies are clearly spelled out in the warranty documentation.
Oh, and check the contract you signed very carefully. It's quite possible (even likely) that it has an arbitration clause - so you can't sue. That means you can't rely on some sympathetic jury ignoring the law and awarding damages. An arbitrator would look at whether Ford was meeting the terms of their own warranty and you would get only that.
I'm not arguing that this isn't the right thing to do or that Ford shouldn't replace your car. I think they are looking at the individual circumstances and trying to make it right. I'm just saying that this outraged sense of being owed something beyond what's in the warranty may be misplaced.
9/20/10, 10:06 AM
#63
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"I'm glad Ford is stepping up and taking care of you as a customer relations issue because they certainly have no obligation to do so no matter how much you rant and rave about it. There is nothing in the limited warranty or in any consumer laws that would require them to replace a car - regardless of mileage - because of a repairable problem. You should consider yourself lucky that they are in fact going beyond what is strictly necessary to try to make you a happy customer."
What?
So it's okay to put a defective product into general public? I could have easily gotten into an accident and caused more damage, and Ford wouldn't be held liable? Look at Toyota.... Ford has EVERY obligation to immediately pull that vehicle and immediately replace it.
However, stupid dealership is messing with me and they don't even want to place a call to Ford to up my obligation or to even order a new car. I'm stuck driving a rental car.
And just to show you how it was a safety issue; I was in a hill, and a light turned green. I put it in first, let go of the clutch and pressed the gas pedal. However, the gear popped out, smacked my hand and started rolling backwards. Luckily, I stomped on the breaks in order to avoid the car behind me. I'm sure you never experienced something like this and how it would make you panic. The noise of the gears grinding, with the smack to the hand and rolling backwards sure justifies a 40k investment.
What?
So it's okay to put a defective product into general public? I could have easily gotten into an accident and caused more damage, and Ford wouldn't be held liable? Look at Toyota.... Ford has EVERY obligation to immediately pull that vehicle and immediately replace it.
However, stupid dealership is messing with me and they don't even want to place a call to Ford to up my obligation or to even order a new car. I'm stuck driving a rental car.
And just to show you how it was a safety issue; I was in a hill, and a light turned green. I put it in first, let go of the clutch and pressed the gas pedal. However, the gear popped out, smacked my hand and started rolling backwards. Luckily, I stomped on the breaks in order to avoid the car behind me. I'm sure you never experienced something like this and how it would make you panic. The noise of the gears grinding, with the smack to the hand and rolling backwards sure justifies a 40k investment.
9/20/10, 10:25 AM
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Safety issue or not (almost any mechanical issue can be spun as a safety issue one way or another) makes no difference. Toyota DID NOT replace vehicles with the so-called sudden acceleration problem... they repaired them.
You can get indignant all you want but the fact of the matter is you don't have a leg to stand on. Repairing the vehicle is ALL Ford is obligated to do. The fact that they are offering to replace the car indicates that they are going above and beyond to keep a customer happy.
You can get indignant all you want but the fact of the matter is you don't have a leg to stand on. Repairing the vehicle is ALL Ford is obligated to do. The fact that they are offering to replace the car indicates that they are going above and beyond to keep a customer happy.
Last edited by WhiteBird00; 9/20/10 at 10:28 AM.
9/20/10, 10:40 AM
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I think all he's saying is that Ford isn't legally obligated to replace the car, regardless of if there is a moral obligation to do it. It's just rare that you find a big company like that willing to go the extra mile, rather than taking the legal minimum. Like I was saying though, go with the brand new car option. Gives you a clean slate, and no worries about black marks on titles or anything. There really hasn't been any serious defects in the cars as a whole. I really do think this one was just a fluke.
9/20/10, 10:50 AM
#66
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I'd kinda like to see what the courts would say. He may have signed a purchase contract, but if the problem happened on his way home I think it would be a very safe bet that the vehicle was never officially titled/transferred to him. Whose car is it between the time you sign and the paperwork is all complete/registered/etc.? f the dealer calls in three days and says, "We have a financing issue", you can bet your *** they think the car is still theirs. Or at least they want you to THINK it's still theirs.
9/20/10, 10:59 AM
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I think all he's saying is that Ford isn't legally obligated to replace the car, regardless of if there is a moral obligation to do it. It's just rare that you find a big company like that willing to go the extra mile, rather than taking the legal minimum. Like I was saying though, go with the brand new car option. Gives you a clean slate, and no worries about black marks on titles or anything. There really hasn't been any serious defects in the cars as a whole. I really do think this one was just a fluke.
9/20/10, 11:01 AM
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Technically with financing the car isn't entirely yours until you pay it off, at least as far as I can tell from the experience. I had the title to my 2004 Mustang, but I don't have it for my 2011. As far as I know, the bank has it, since the 2011 Mustang is collateral for the loan.
9/20/10, 11:39 AM
#69
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Considering the outcome of my last lawsuit, Ford is liable. For EVERYTHING.
Just depends what you sue them for. Considering I already have 1 lawsuit complete against them, they're willing to go the extra mile.
However, now it's the dealership sticking it to me. They're not calling Ford to place an order and they're just avoiding me.
Just depends what you sue them for. Considering I already have 1 lawsuit complete against them, they're willing to go the extra mile.
However, now it's the dealership sticking it to me. They're not calling Ford to place an order and they're just avoiding me.
9/20/10, 11:42 AM
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But it's registered in your name, with a lien to the finance company. My point is that it until the dealer gets that paperwork filed, it's still theirs. Technically.
9/20/10, 11:52 AM
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Considering the outcome of my last lawsuit, Ford is liable. For EVERYTHING.
Just depends what you sue them for. Considering I already have 1 lawsuit complete against them, they're willing to go the extra mile.
However, now it's the dealership sticking it to me. They're not calling Ford to place an order and they're just avoiding me.
Just depends what you sue them for. Considering I already have 1 lawsuit complete against them, they're willing to go the extra mile.
However, now it's the dealership sticking it to me. They're not calling Ford to place an order and they're just avoiding me.
9/20/10, 11:54 AM
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Or perhaps they are more than eager this second time to stall you thru court for years with an even higher powered team of lawyers than before - and this time attack you for your 'pattern' of lawsuits against automobile manufacturers rather than allowing them to do a warranted repair like the vast majority of customers do. Maybe that's why the Dealer is acting differently because of orders from on high?
Never underestimate the devious mind of sharks.
Last edited by cdynaco; 9/20/10 at 12:17 PM.
9/20/10, 12:07 PM
#73
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I kinda have to agree with the OP. If I buy something from sears and its messed up from the get go, I usally just return it and get a new one. Why shouldn't cars be the same? At least on major items like the trans or engine. If its just a fuel pump or something simple heck fix it and move on.
9/20/10, 12:21 PM
#74
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Yeah it looks like I'm backing out of the deal guys. The manager over there is being a total dbag. He's saying it's not easy to call the regional manager, to get the allocations etc etc. Basically he almost called me and yelled at me. F that. I'm not dealing with them, no matter how good a deal it was the first time.
I was considering for a second to take the car back when they fix it but I'm very against it. FML.
I was considering for a second to take the car back when they fix it but I'm very against it. FML.
9/20/10, 12:28 PM
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This earlier law suit... get a judgment or was it settled? Companies frequently settle suits even knowing they could win in court just because it's cheaper (and there's always some risk that a sympathetic jury might ignore the legal issues and give a big award anyway).
I guess what's irking me is that you seem to think you have this entitlement (a new car) that you don't really have and it appears that no matter what Ford and the dealer do it won't be enough for you. If I had been writing this thread it would have been "My car broke down and Ford is ordering a new one for me. I have to wait a couple of months for it but they're giving me a loaner in the meantime. What a great way to resolve an unfortunate problem."
I guess what's irking me is that you seem to think you have this entitlement (a new car) that you don't really have and it appears that no matter what Ford and the dealer do it won't be enough for you. If I had been writing this thread it would have been "My car broke down and Ford is ordering a new one for me. I have to wait a couple of months for it but they're giving me a loaner in the meantime. What a great way to resolve an unfortunate problem."
9/20/10, 12:39 PM
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I kinda have to agree with the OP. If I buy something from sears and its messed up from the get go, I usally just return it and get a new one. Why shouldn't cars be the same? At least on major items like the trans or engine. If its just a fuel pump or something simple heck fix it and move on.
Besides, Sears and WalMart will take back anything... "These diapers are full of sh.., I want new ones"
9/20/10, 12:45 PM
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Yeah it looks like I'm backing out of the deal guys. The manager over there is being a total dbag. He's saying it's not easy to call the regional manager, to get the allocations etc etc. Basically he almost called me and yelled at me. F that. I'm not dealing with them, no matter how good a deal it was the first time.
I was considering for a second to take the car back when they fix it but I'm very against it. FML.
I was considering for a second to take the car back when they fix it but I'm very against it. FML.
9/20/10, 01:12 PM
#78
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I don't know how to reach the regional manager. It's fine guys. No worries.
I'm backing out. I think I'm going to buy an Audi A5 this time and try something new. Really loved the 5.0 but I have no options left.
I'm backing out. I think I'm going to buy an Audi A5 this time and try something new. Really loved the 5.0 but I have no options left.
You may have to go over his head at this point and hit up Ford or the regional manager yourself. The fact that the dealership isn't willing to go the extra five steps for you when Ford has already said they'd do it is pretty worthless, but as far as I know he's not exactly the top of the food chain.
Are you sure this story is for real Mr. SS man?? Cause on another thread there's odds you're a Camaro plant. LOL 
9/20/10, 01:44 PM
#80
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sounds like a horror story! Better luck next time man!
Remember there is a reason why Ford is now in the Top 5 Best Automakers in the world. I'm sorry you got bad lucky twice in a row, thats very rare
Remember there is a reason why Ford is now in the Top 5 Best Automakers in the world. I'm sorry you got bad lucky twice in a row, thats very rare