GT500 weighs 3900 lbs, for the coupe!
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 29, 2004
Posts: 2,358
Likes: 1
Originally posted by 65to05@December 14, 2005, 6:56 PM
Ok, I'm new here, so feel free to flame away...(actually, I've watched the Boards for a couple of years, but this is my first post).
I just wanted to weigh in with my thoughts on the GT 500, but first, a little background. I am in my mid 30s and have always dreamed of driving a Mustang...my dad bought one new in 64 and drove it the rest of his life and that is what I have always planned on doing. Problem is, I am real, real bad about waiting for the NEXT BIG THING, which is what has stopped me in the past from buying a 99 Cobra, 03 Terminator, 05 GT so far. So when the concept Shelby GT 500 was first shown earlier this year, I told myself that this was it, I was going to bite the bullet and finally buy my dream car.
I am still planning on doing that.
Yep, I am as upset as everyone else about the diluting of the concept that has occured (I really, really liked the leather interior treatment and the original hood). But in the end, it comes down to the fact that this is still a darn fine value.
First off, as much as we want it to be, since we are mostly Ford fans and the Mustang is Ford's main performance car (sorry GT fans, it is in an altogether different class)--the Mustang has never and will never be a Corvette competitor. I absolutely love Vettes, and think the C6 is an incredible vehicle, but I have to have a back seat.
So lets compare other cars that have 4 seats, RWD (that is a must for me if you are talking true performance car, not a nimble track vehicle) and 300 hp.
Shelby GT 500--3855 lbs, RWD, 450 hp--$40,000
GTO—3725 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$32,995
Audi RS4 Quattro—3637 lbs, AWD 420 hp--$70-80,000
2006 Audi S4—3825 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$47,120
BMW 650i—3814 lbs, RWD 360 hp--$72,000
Mercedes C55 AMG—3588 lbs, RWD 362 hp--$55,500
Charger SRT8—4180 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$35,320
Charger Hemi—4031 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$31,000
Chrysler 300SRT8—4160 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$39,999
Chrysler 300C--4251 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$36,000
Lexus IS 350—3527 lbs, RWD 306 hp--$36.050 base, $39,500 with Sport package
Infiniti G35 coupe—3524 lbs, RWD 298 hp—$33,650 base, $35,900 with Premium package
Current BMW M3—3394 lbs, RWD 333 hp--$45,000
Coming BMW M3—TBA, RWD 400+ est--$51,000
Cadillac CTSv—3833 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$51,399
Mustang GT—3483 lbs, RWD 300 hp--$24,999
I'm sure I missed several that should be on the list, but I tried to stay within reasonable price range. First thing that pops to mind is that the GT 500 will be the cheapest way to get 450 hp in a 4 seater. Will it be the fastest between $35 and $45? In a straight line, probably...in the curves, it might have a hard time with the GTO, but I doubt it...a current M3 might keep up, and of course, a C6 I think will outdrive it.
Ok, I'm new here, so feel free to flame away...(actually, I've watched the Boards for a couple of years, but this is my first post).
I just wanted to weigh in with my thoughts on the GT 500, but first, a little background. I am in my mid 30s and have always dreamed of driving a Mustang...my dad bought one new in 64 and drove it the rest of his life and that is what I have always planned on doing. Problem is, I am real, real bad about waiting for the NEXT BIG THING, which is what has stopped me in the past from buying a 99 Cobra, 03 Terminator, 05 GT so far. So when the concept Shelby GT 500 was first shown earlier this year, I told myself that this was it, I was going to bite the bullet and finally buy my dream car.
I am still planning on doing that.
Yep, I am as upset as everyone else about the diluting of the concept that has occured (I really, really liked the leather interior treatment and the original hood). But in the end, it comes down to the fact that this is still a darn fine value.
First off, as much as we want it to be, since we are mostly Ford fans and the Mustang is Ford's main performance car (sorry GT fans, it is in an altogether different class)--the Mustang has never and will never be a Corvette competitor. I absolutely love Vettes, and think the C6 is an incredible vehicle, but I have to have a back seat.
So lets compare other cars that have 4 seats, RWD (that is a must for me if you are talking true performance car, not a nimble track vehicle) and 300 hp.
Shelby GT 500--3855 lbs, RWD, 450 hp--$40,000
GTO—3725 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$32,995
Audi RS4 Quattro—3637 lbs, AWD 420 hp--$70-80,000
2006 Audi S4—3825 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$47,120
BMW 650i—3814 lbs, RWD 360 hp--$72,000
Mercedes C55 AMG—3588 lbs, RWD 362 hp--$55,500
Charger SRT8—4180 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$35,320
Charger Hemi—4031 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$31,000
Chrysler 300SRT8—4160 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$39,999
Chrysler 300C--4251 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$36,000
Lexus IS 350—3527 lbs, RWD 306 hp--$36.050 base, $39,500 with Sport package
Infiniti G35 coupe—3524 lbs, RWD 298 hp—$33,650 base, $35,900 with Premium package
Current BMW M3—3394 lbs, RWD 333 hp--$45,000
Coming BMW M3—TBA, RWD 400+ est--$51,000
Cadillac CTSv—3833 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$51,399
Mustang GT—3483 lbs, RWD 300 hp--$24,999
I'm sure I missed several that should be on the list, but I tried to stay within reasonable price range. First thing that pops to mind is that the GT 500 will be the cheapest way to get 450 hp in a 4 seater. Will it be the fastest between $35 and $45? In a straight line, probably...in the curves, it might have a hard time with the GTO, but I doubt it...a current M3 might keep up, and of course, a C6 I think will outdrive it.
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 2,478
Likes: 1
From: Indiana
No need to flame 65to05. You make perfect sense. You and I are in the same camp on all counts. Except I am late 30s and have owned 2 previous Mustangs.
Buy the GT500. There will always be improvements. There is no sense in waiting forever. Enjoy it now. And enjoy it you will. There is something special about owning them.
Buy the GT500. There will always be improvements. There is no sense in waiting forever. Enjoy it now. And enjoy it you will. There is something special about owning them.
Shelby GT500 Member
Joined: September 2, 2004
Posts: 2,594
Likes: 0
From: Chicago
Originally posted by jsaylor+December 14, 2005, 5:41 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jsaylor @ December 14, 2005, 5:41 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Possibly because it costs 20k dollars more than a C6? Give me a break. Wow, you mean the Z06 comes with a different motor and tires than a C6? Really? Wish the GT500 came with those. Are you serious? Yeah, the Z06 comes with all of that, GT500 has bigger brakes, a different motor, and larger tires as well...at least last I heard. Your point is?
A base GT500 is 40k and you are sure there will be options, stop the presses. Please note that the list of options on a 04 Cobra more or less consisted of wheels and mysticrhome paint. Woo hoo. The GT500 is going to come one way, fully loaded, and you would absolutely have to buy a 30k Mustang GT to get anywhere near the same stereo, interior package, etc. A Mustang GT premium starts at just over 27k. Adding the IUP, side airbags, and anti-theft system that the GT500 is likely going to have better versions of takes you to $28,175. Adding the $1,200 Mach-1000 system that the GT500 will also no doubt meet or beat as well takes you to nearly 29.5k. I haven't even considered adding ICAP or 18" wheels which would be fully appropriate considering how both the std C6, Z06, and Mustang come standard. What were you saying again? [/b]
A base GT500 is 40k and you are sure there will be options, stop the presses. Please note that the list of options on a 04 Cobra more or less consisted of wheels and mysticrhome paint. Woo hoo. The GT500 is going to come one way, fully loaded, and you would absolutely have to buy a 30k Mustang GT to get anywhere near the same stereo, interior package, etc. A Mustang GT premium starts at just over 27k. Adding the IUP, side airbags, and anti-theft system that the GT500 is likely going to have better versions of takes you to $28,175. Adding the $1,200 Mach-1000 system that the GT500 will also no doubt meet or beat as well takes you to nearly 29.5k. I haven't even considered adding ICAP or 18" wheels which would be fully appropriate considering how both the std C6, Z06, and Mustang come standard. What were you saying again? [/b]
My point is that Chevy can add all those features for rpughly 15K(20K according to you)over a comparably equiped C6. The GT500 comes with a far less advanced(yes I know it's a pushrod) engine, same T56 tranny, cheaper brakes, no IRS, HIDs, CF body panels, shall I go on? Oh yea, was the GT500 extensively engineered at the Nurburgring? Not that I have heard. I think you need to go to Chevy.com and research the Z06. You aren't giving it enough credit.
Originally posted by jsaylor@December 14, 2005, 5:41 PM
As for Z06-like options, what Z06 like options? If you are somehow insinuating that a base Z06 is loaded, stop. If you want to get really picky, the base 1LZ Z06 is outfitted almost exactly like a mid-level 2LT C6, in fact the only real difference is that ridulous HUD the Z06 comes with.
2LT C6 price: $46,485.
1LZ Z06 price: $65,800
As for Z06-like options, what Z06 like options? If you are somehow insinuating that a base Z06 is loaded, stop. If you want to get really picky, the base 1LZ Z06 is outfitted almost exactly like a mid-level 2LT C6, in fact the only real difference is that ridulous HUD the Z06 comes with.
2LT C6 price: $46,485.
1LZ Z06 price: $65,800
Originally posted by jsaylor@December 14, 2005, 5:41 PM
Alright, it isn't exactly 20k, it's more like 19 and change
If you want a Z06 that compares to the 50k 3LT C6 you refer to then you have to step up to the 2LZ package which runs $68,700...still roughly 19k difference. As for C5R development getting used on the Z06, I can only assume you consider this somehow different than Grand Am Cup experience being used to develop the GT500's suspension. Oh, I see, the Grand Am Cup car is literally a stripped and tweaked production Mustang where the C5R has been radically altered in comparison, I see how that makes the Vette' situation better. ROFLMAO
The AMG is under-rated, your kidding? Glad SVT has never done the same because, as well all know, neither the 03-04 Cobra or GT is under-rated. Earth to max, anyone home? As for my mistake with 4 or 5 speed auto, please look at essentially everything you said about the Z06 and SVT pricing, because none of it was correct. That aside, the E55 packs a 5.4L supercharged V-8 and makes around a rated (pointing that out again for you benefit) 469hp and just over 510ft-lb of torque. The GT500 packs a 5.4L SC V-8 and makes at least 475hp and 475 ft-lbs torque according to ratings. I can see how those two engines are night and day.
Alright, it isn't exactly 20k, it's more like 19 and change
If you want a Z06 that compares to the 50k 3LT C6 you refer to then you have to step up to the 2LZ package which runs $68,700...still roughly 19k difference. As for C5R development getting used on the Z06, I can only assume you consider this somehow different than Grand Am Cup experience being used to develop the GT500's suspension. Oh, I see, the Grand Am Cup car is literally a stripped and tweaked production Mustang where the C5R has been radically altered in comparison, I see how that makes the Vette' situation better. ROFLMAOThe AMG is under-rated, your kidding? Glad SVT has never done the same because, as well all know, neither the 03-04 Cobra or GT is under-rated. Earth to max, anyone home? As for my mistake with 4 or 5 speed auto, please look at essentially everything you said about the Z06 and SVT pricing, because none of it was correct. That aside, the E55 packs a 5.4L supercharged V-8 and makes around a rated (pointing that out again for you benefit) 469hp and just over 510ft-lb of torque. The GT500 packs a 5.4L SC V-8 and makes at least 475hp and 475 ft-lbs torque according to ratings. I can see how those two engines are night and day.
As for underrating, I am aware that SVT has done this. I also know that they have OVER-RATED cars before. Remember the 1999 Cobra? Again, your lack of research is apparrent. The E55 engine is making around 500 crank hp. AMG undderated the engine. I won't even bother wasting my time with your night and day comment; again research my friend. http://www.mercedes-amg.com . They share the same displacement and both are supercharged, that's about all they share in common.
<!--QuoteBegin-jsaylor@December 14, 2005, 5:41 PM
As for the modern technology comment, huh? As for the AMG being a luxury sedan. I wouls think that is obvious but have no idea what your point is since, with the MB being larger, heavier, and ill balanced compared to the GT500 this should lend an advantage to the GT500.
Do you read what you type?
[/quote]
My point was and still is...Comparing the two is retarded. You are comparing a full blown luxury car(larger) with advanced technology to a 40K GT Coupe with outdated technology. It's amazing that a large luxury sedan is the roughly the same weight(3990 lbs) as a performance coupe. That's with an automatic 5 speed transmission, air bags all over the place, multipower, Airmatic suspension, 10 way power seats etc. I listed all those features because obviously Luxury content adds weight. Now look at the GT500 and you can see why a 3900 lbs+ GT500 is pathetic.
Bullitt Member
Joined: October 12, 2004
Posts: 450
Likes: 0
Originally posted by max2000jp@December 14, 2005, 7:37 PM
Now look at the GT500 and you can see why a 3900 lbs+ GT500 is pathetic.
Now look at the GT500 and you can see why a 3900 lbs+ GT500 is pathetic.
PS - jsaylor - You hit a dozen good points right on the nose. I can't wait until MM&FF takes a stock GT500 down the strip and nails a 12.0 run or better.
Shelby GT500 Member
Joined: September 2, 2004
Posts: 2,594
Likes: 0
From: Chicago
Originally posted by 68notch@December 14, 2005, 8:09 PM
Seriously, dude. Go buy yourself some gold chains, a silk shirt and get yourself a Vette. You don't belong here.
Seriously, dude. Go buy yourself some gold chains, a silk shirt and get yourself a Vette. You don't belong here.
You guys are suckers for Ford's marketing. See below: What modern sports car has a SRA?:notnice: “The all-new 2005 Ford Mustang is one of the hottest cars in many years,†says Phil Martens, Ford group vice president, Product Creation. “It was engineered from the beginning to be the basis of a high-performance, world-class sports car from SVT, and the Shelby Cobra GT500 is it.â€
"Ford's Special Vehicle Team (SVT) is engineering the GT500 as a standard for balanced driving dynamics – great straight-line performance, precise handling and a comfortable ride – just as vintage Shelbys set the bar in their time. "
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 2,478
Likes: 1
From: Indiana
How do you know it doesn't have precise handling and comfortable ride?
Take your IRS blinders off long enough to give the car a chance. After they are released and proven inferior, then come on here and make a big deal out of no IRS. Until you have the car and/or the performance numbers in your possession, you are only assuming the handling is inferior.
As I have said in several posts, don't hang SVT, HTT or Ford until you can prove the crime.
Take your IRS blinders off long enough to give the car a chance. After they are released and proven inferior, then come on here and make a big deal out of no IRS. Until you have the car and/or the performance numbers in your possession, you are only assuming the handling is inferior.
As I have said in several posts, don't hang SVT, HTT or Ford until you can prove the crime.
Shelby GT500 Member
Joined: September 2, 2004
Posts: 2,594
Likes: 0
From: Chicago
Originally posted by crazyhorse@December 14, 2005, 9:05 PM
How do you know it doesn't have precise handling and comfortable ride?
Take your IRS blinders off long enough to give the car a chance. After they are released and proven inferior, then come on here and make a big deal out of no IRS. Until you have the car and/or the performance numbers in your possession, you are only assuming the handling is inferior.
As I have said in several posts, don't hang SVT, HTT or Ford until you can prove the crime.
How do you know it doesn't have precise handling and comfortable ride?
Take your IRS blinders off long enough to give the car a chance. After they are released and proven inferior, then come on here and make a big deal out of no IRS. Until you have the car and/or the performance numbers in your possession, you are only assuming the handling is inferior.
As I have said in several posts, don't hang SVT, HTT or Ford until you can prove the crime.
Discussion like this is good. At least we can voice our opinions and get along. My opinions are a little harsh since I would really like to see a track worthy Mustang. I've had my GT out at my local road course more often than my local drag strip.
My personal opinion of an ideal SVT S197 would go like this:
-High revving Aluminum 5.4L 425hp N/A
-T56 5 speed
-13" 4 Piston front brakes(The 14" Brembos are overkill for a street car IMO)
-Carbon Fiber Drive shaft, aluminum K-member, and other minor weight savings to achieve a target weight of ~3400 lbs.
-Optional Competition Package (IRS, Stiffer Suspension tuning, Quicker steering ratio larger sways, more agressive pad compound, and rear seat delete) ~4-5K price tag.
-Concept Styling Cues
Base Coupe Price: $40,000
With Competition Package near $45K
A couple of optional features that would be nice:
Bi-Xenon HIDs
Heated Seats for us that live in colder climates
Navigation
Thread Starter
Mach 1 Member
Joined: May 5, 2005
Posts: 640
Likes: 0
Originally posted by max2000jp@December 14, 2005, 11:48 PM
While I don't have the actual test numbers, I can deduce opinions from information provided. 3900 Lbs and an SRA usually doesn't lead to a nimble handling car. I will be the first to admit that handling is more than numbers sometimes. The feel of the car is something that you have to be comfortable with. Why do you think BMW and Porsche are always top rated amongst their class? They have an amazing feel to them and provide a feeling of confidence to their driver. I haven't driven a Ford that does that, so hence I am skeptical.
Discussion like this is good. At least we can voice our opinions and get along. My opinions are a little harsh since I would really like to see a track worthy Mustang. I've had my GT out at my local road course more often than my local drag strip.
My personal opinion of an ideal SVT S197 would go like this:
-High revving Aluminum 5.4L 425hp N/A
-T56 5 speed
-13" 4 Piston front brakes(The 14" Brembos are overkill for a street car IMO)
-Carbon Fiber Drive shaft, aluminum K-member, and other minor weight savings to achieve a target weight of ~3400 lbs.
-Optional Competition Package (IRS, Stiffer Suspension tuning, Quicker steering ratio larger sways, more agressive pad compound, and rear seat delete) ~4-5K price tag.
-Concept Styling Cues
Base Coupe Price: $40,000
With Competition Package near $45K
A couple of optional features that would be nice:
Bi-Xenon HIDs
Heated Seats for us that live in colder climates
Navigation
While I don't have the actual test numbers, I can deduce opinions from information provided. 3900 Lbs and an SRA usually doesn't lead to a nimble handling car. I will be the first to admit that handling is more than numbers sometimes. The feel of the car is something that you have to be comfortable with. Why do you think BMW and Porsche are always top rated amongst their class? They have an amazing feel to them and provide a feeling of confidence to their driver. I haven't driven a Ford that does that, so hence I am skeptical.
Discussion like this is good. At least we can voice our opinions and get along. My opinions are a little harsh since I would really like to see a track worthy Mustang. I've had my GT out at my local road course more often than my local drag strip.
My personal opinion of an ideal SVT S197 would go like this:
-High revving Aluminum 5.4L 425hp N/A
-T56 5 speed
-13" 4 Piston front brakes(The 14" Brembos are overkill for a street car IMO)
-Carbon Fiber Drive shaft, aluminum K-member, and other minor weight savings to achieve a target weight of ~3400 lbs.
-Optional Competition Package (IRS, Stiffer Suspension tuning, Quicker steering ratio larger sways, more agressive pad compound, and rear seat delete) ~4-5K price tag.
-Concept Styling Cues
Base Coupe Price: $40,000
With Competition Package near $45K
A couple of optional features that would be nice:
Bi-Xenon HIDs
Heated Seats for us that live in colder climates
Navigation
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: February 8, 2004
Posts: 3,399
Likes: 7
From: Cincinnati, OH
Originally posted by 65to05@December 14, 2005, 5:56 PM
Shelby GT 500--3855 lbs, RWD, 450 hp--$40,000
GTO—3725 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$32,995
Audi RS4 Quattro—3637 lbs, AWD 420 hp--$70-80,000
2006 Audi S4—3825 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$47,120
BMW 650i—3814 lbs, RWD 360 hp--$72,000
Mercedes C55 AMG—3588 lbs, RWD 362 hp--$55,500
Charger SRT8—4180 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$35,320
Charger Hemi—4031 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$31,000
Chrysler 300SRT8—4160 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$39,999
Chrysler 300C--4251 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$36,000
Lexus IS 350—3527 lbs, RWD 306 hp--$36.050 base, $39,500 with Sport package
Infiniti G35 coupe—3524 lbs, RWD 298 hp—$33,650 base, $35,900 with Premium package
Current BMW M3—3394 lbs, RWD 333 hp--$45,000
Coming BMW M3—TBA, RWD 400+ est--$51,000
Cadillac CTSv—3833 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$51,399
Mustang GT—3483 lbs, RWD 300 hp--$24,999
Shelby GT 500--3855 lbs, RWD, 450 hp--$40,000
GTO—3725 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$32,995
Audi RS4 Quattro—3637 lbs, AWD 420 hp--$70-80,000
2006 Audi S4—3825 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$47,120
BMW 650i—3814 lbs, RWD 360 hp--$72,000
Mercedes C55 AMG—3588 lbs, RWD 362 hp--$55,500
Charger SRT8—4180 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$35,320
Charger Hemi—4031 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$31,000
Chrysler 300SRT8—4160 lbs, RWD 425 hp--$39,999
Chrysler 300C--4251 lbs, RWD 340 hp--$36,000
Lexus IS 350—3527 lbs, RWD 306 hp--$36.050 base, $39,500 with Sport package
Infiniti G35 coupe—3524 lbs, RWD 298 hp—$33,650 base, $35,900 with Premium package
Current BMW M3—3394 lbs, RWD 333 hp--$45,000
Coming BMW M3—TBA, RWD 400+ est--$51,000
Cadillac CTSv—3833 lbs, RWD 400 hp--$51,399
Mustang GT—3483 lbs, RWD 300 hp--$24,999
Closet American
Joined: July 17, 2005
Posts: 5,851
Likes: 1
From: Vancouver, BC (Hollywood North)
Originally posted by crazyhorse@December 14, 2005, 8:05 PM
How do you know it doesn't have precise handling and comfortable ride?
Take your IRS blinders off long enough to give the car a chance. After they are released and proven inferior, then come on here and make a big deal out of no IRS. Until you have the car and/or the performance numbers in your possession, you are only assuming the handling is inferior.
As I have said in several posts, don't hang SVT, HTT or Ford until you can prove the crime.
How do you know it doesn't have precise handling and comfortable ride?
Take your IRS blinders off long enough to give the car a chance. After they are released and proven inferior, then come on here and make a big deal out of no IRS. Until you have the car and/or the performance numbers in your possession, you are only assuming the handling is inferior.
As I have said in several posts, don't hang SVT, HTT or Ford until you can prove the crime.
Although at some point I don't actually have to SEE over the horizon to accept the fact that the world isn't flat. Point being: it's pretty much an accepted fact by engineers the world over that IRS is vastly superior to SRA for handling dynamics in the real world. (Can you imagine if Ford had put an SRA in the GT supercar? Toyota doesn't even use SRA in a Corolla for crying out loud, nor Honda in the Civic! I mean, c'mon here folks!)
I think it's important to keep in mind that back in the late '60s, the Shelby was much more in the technological mainstream than it is today. Ford simply hasn't kept up with technology, partly due to greed & hubris, partly due to shortsightedness...and now, mainly due to the cost cutting necessary to keep them afloat. The result is that we're not getting the Shelby we SHOULD be getting, but rather the best one that Ford can AFFORD to give us right now.
Mach 1 Member
Joined: October 20, 2005
Posts: 717
Likes: 0
My personal opinion of an ideal SVT S197 would go like this:
-High revving Aluminum 5.4L 425hp N/A
-T56 5 speed
-13" 4 Piston front brakes(The 14" Brembos are overkill for a street car IMO)
-Carbon Fiber Drive shaft, aluminum K-member, and other minor weight savings to achieve a target weight of ~3400 lbs.
-Optional Competition Package (IRS, Stiffer Suspension tuning, Quicker steering ratio larger sways, more agressive pad compound, and rear seat delete) ~4-5K price tag.
-Concept Styling Cues
Base Coupe Price: $40,000
With Competition Package near $45K
A couple of optional features that would be nice:
Bi-Xenon HIDs
Heated Seats for us that live in colder climates
Navigation
-High revving Aluminum 5.4L 425hp N/A
-T56 5 speed
-13" 4 Piston front brakes(The 14" Brembos are overkill for a street car IMO)
-Carbon Fiber Drive shaft, aluminum K-member, and other minor weight savings to achieve a target weight of ~3400 lbs.
-Optional Competition Package (IRS, Stiffer Suspension tuning, Quicker steering ratio larger sways, more agressive pad compound, and rear seat delete) ~4-5K price tag.
-Concept Styling Cues
Base Coupe Price: $40,000
With Competition Package near $45K
A couple of optional features that would be nice:
Bi-Xenon HIDs
Heated Seats for us that live in colder climates
Navigation
Shelby GT500 Member
Joined: September 2, 2004
Posts: 2,594
Likes: 0
From: Chicago
Originally posted by StangFreak@December 14, 2005, 10:07 PM
I'd love to see this too but I doubt Ford would price it at $40 grand. I'm also upset over the weight of the GT500 but am still going to wait until I can see some hard performance numbers and drive the car before I make my final decision. The SRA in the GT500 has been said to handle better than the last Cobra's IRS rear. Don't get me wrong, this car will never handle as good as a C6 Vette but I don't think it's going to be as bad as some people think it will be. What we have to look at here is what we are getting, which is a 500hp monster for $40,000 that's going to kick some serious hiney when it hits the streets.
I'd love to see this too but I doubt Ford would price it at $40 grand. I'm also upset over the weight of the GT500 but am still going to wait until I can see some hard performance numbers and drive the car before I make my final decision. The SRA in the GT500 has been said to handle better than the last Cobra's IRS rear. Don't get me wrong, this car will never handle as good as a C6 Vette but I don't think it's going to be as bad as some people think it will be. What we have to look at here is what we are getting, which is a 500hp monster for $40,000 that's going to kick some serious hiney when it hits the streets.
Thread Starter
Mach 1 Member
Joined: May 5, 2005
Posts: 640
Likes: 0
Originally posted by max2000jp@December 15, 2005, 1:40 AM
I think it could happen with some creativity. As got the SN95 Cobra vs GT500, it better handle better! It is using a modern, stiffer chassis compared to one that dates back to the late 1970s. Plus the chassis wasn't designed for an IRS, it was an afterthough and not ideal.
I think it could happen with some creativity. As got the SN95 Cobra vs GT500, it better handle better! It is using a modern, stiffer chassis compared to one that dates back to the late 1970s. Plus the chassis wasn't designed for an IRS, it was an afterthough and not ideal.
What I would like to see Ford do is offer a "tuner" version of the Mustang just like Subaru is doing with the WRX TR. Ford could ditch the power windows, power locks, cruise, reduce the amount of sound deadening, add an aluminum hood and trunk lid to reduce the weight. Offer it only with a cloth interior with sport front bucket seats (Recaro), light weight 17 inch wheels (most guys get aftermarket wheels any way so why waste money on the OEMs), base stereo (the Shaker systems have issues and are a waste of money IMO) and air conditioning. Use the current motor but with forged internals instead of the hypercrap parts so it can stand up to some boost. Offer the "drag pack", handling package, and the Ford Racing Supercharger as dealer installed accessories that won't void the factory warrenty if installed by a factory certified mechanic (ie dealer).
Price it about mid way between the deluxe and premium GT. Your losing a little luxury content but gaining the performance stuff in exchange. The car would be lighter than a regular GT so even with the stock 300hp it would be faster. With the supercharger the thing would scream!!!
It might seem like this would be the same thing as the 2000 Cobra R but it's not. The difference would be that the motor (except for the forged rotating assembly), suspension, trans, and brakes would all be stock. Plus it wouldn't be a limited production car.
Of course Ford would never :nono: do this because it would take sales away from the GT500 so it's basically just a pipe dream.
Oh well..................
GT Member
Joined: October 13, 2004
Posts: 197
Likes: 0
Originally posted by BC_Shelby@December 14, 2005, 2:13 AM
Whaddya gonna do with 800 bhp on a winding mountain road? Especially with an SRA? Oh, right, you just wanna drag this thing down a straightaway. The fact remains most people are looking for a turnkey solution and don't modify their engines.
Guess it depends upon who Ford considers to be the target market for this car...and from everything we've seen, it's probably you.
Whaddya gonna do with 800 bhp on a winding mountain road? Especially with an SRA? Oh, right, you just wanna drag this thing down a straightaway. The fact remains most people are looking for a turnkey solution and don't modify their engines.
Guess it depends upon who Ford considers to be the target market for this car...and from everything we've seen, it's probably you.
I think Ford is marketing the GT500 with people that drag race, why else would they take off the IRS and put a big engine with high hp and a SRA. I gaurantee you that more GT500's will see the drag strip than be at a track course turning. Alot of people bought 03 cobra's and modified their engine, and yes they also put a modified GT SRA. Two shops near were I live (and im sure many people have heard of) have made their cobra's drag cars, they are Earls Automotive and X2C Motorsports. Earl's record is 9.94 and X2C is 8.9, both on modded 03 cobra's. http://musclemustangfastfords.com/features/0309mm_moor/ http://musclemustangfastfords.com/features...head/index.html You could read here and tell me if he didn't modd his engine.
I'm sorry to hear that ur not a target market for this car.
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 2,478
Likes: 1
From: Indiana
I doubt Ford will produce that super light, high revving, IRS car that so many want. I bet you are looking at tuners for such a car. Call Kenny Brown (kennybrown.com). I bet they will build you the chassis (for a little more than what you are expcting to pay). Sean hyland motorsports (i think it is shm.com) will build you that motor. Both of these companies have done wonders with past Mustangs. Kenny was involved in development of the '05 chassis just like Roush and Saleen (Kenny used to be Saleen's partner).
Even though there are several posters on here that want that car, I don't think there is a big enough market for it. Otherwise, Ford would capitalize on it.
Even though there are several posters on here that want that car, I don't think there is a big enough market for it. Otherwise, Ford would capitalize on it.
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 2,478
Likes: 1
From: Indiana
Kenny Brown will likely build an IRS for these cars. If not, here is another choice:
IRS Suspension
Now all you have to do is find the light weight parts and take out the stuff you don't want.
IRS Suspension
Now all you have to do is find the light weight parts and take out the stuff you don't want.
Closet American
Joined: July 17, 2005
Posts: 5,851
Likes: 1
From: Vancouver, BC (Hollywood North)
Originally posted by Svtstinger@December 15, 2005, 12:53 AM
I assure you i will never be on a winding mountain road with a 800hp car. Yes I do want to drag it out and I guarante you many other people also do. People that buy Mustangs don't get them for their handling, if you want handling car then go buy an import, no ones holding you back.
I think Ford is marketing the GT500 with people that drag race, why else would they take off the IRS and put a big engine with high hp and a SRA. I gaurantee you that more GT500's will see the drag strip than be at a track course turning. Alot of people bought 03 cobra's and modified their engine, and yes they also put a modified GT SRA. Two shops near were I live (and im sure many people have heard of) have made their cobra's drag cars, they are Earls Automotive and X2C Motorsports. Earl's record is 9.94 and X2C is 8.9, both on modded 03 cobra's. http://musclemustangfastfords.com/features/0309mm_moor/ http://musclemustangfastfords.com/features...head/index.html You could read here and tell me if he didn't modd his engine.
I'm sorry to hear that ur not a target market for this car.
I assure you i will never be on a winding mountain road with a 800hp car. Yes I do want to drag it out and I guarante you many other people also do. People that buy Mustangs don't get them for their handling, if you want handling car then go buy an import, no ones holding you back.
I think Ford is marketing the GT500 with people that drag race, why else would they take off the IRS and put a big engine with high hp and a SRA. I gaurantee you that more GT500's will see the drag strip than be at a track course turning. Alot of people bought 03 cobra's and modified their engine, and yes they also put a modified GT SRA. Two shops near were I live (and im sure many people have heard of) have made their cobra's drag cars, they are Earls Automotive and X2C Motorsports. Earl's record is 9.94 and X2C is 8.9, both on modded 03 cobra's. http://musclemustangfastfords.com/features/0309mm_moor/ http://musclemustangfastfords.com/features...head/index.html You could read here and tell me if he didn't modd his engine.
I'm sorry to hear that ur not a target market for this car.
That said, I mostly agree with what you state above. The only flaw in your argument is that the original Shelby's were designed to handle well, not just go fast in a straight line. Carroll has talked about this many times. A 1968 Shelby GT500 was thus a much more advanced car for its day than the current Shelby GT500 appears to be today.
Either way, we'll know in three weeks and change.
Bullitt Member
Joined: January 27, 2005
Posts: 280
Likes: 0
Here is my thoughts and opinions...
Mustang GT = $25-$30K
The C6 cost between $45-$55K depending on options and coup/vert.
The Z06 is north of $70K ( limited supply will put it around $80K )
The Shelby due to limited supply will be well north of $50K
The Saleen coup with only a CAI, Exhaust, tune = 42K
The Saleen SC = 50k
The Saleen Extreme = ( Not listed but most likely about 65K )
Now, obviousle the Mustang GT is the best bang for the buck at the current prices. A low end C6 is probably the next one....
Now, take a premium GT for $28K and add an SC. Lets say you have it professionally installed with new MAS, Injectors, Fule System, and tuned for $7,000.00. You then add A suspension Kit that you do yourself for $2,000. Now you add a few body mods ( or stripes ) to suit your taste for $2,000.00. Finally, you add a preformance brake kit for $1500.00.
You are now up to about 40K and can out preform all but the Z06 and saleen extream...
Now lest say you splurge and have a frged bottem end put in when the SC is installed and you add another $5K....
Now you hae a 45K car that can preform as well as any of them.... ( and look better in my opinion )
Mustang GT = $25-$30K
The C6 cost between $45-$55K depending on options and coup/vert.
The Z06 is north of $70K ( limited supply will put it around $80K )
The Shelby due to limited supply will be well north of $50K
The Saleen coup with only a CAI, Exhaust, tune = 42K
The Saleen SC = 50k
The Saleen Extreme = ( Not listed but most likely about 65K )
Now, obviousle the Mustang GT is the best bang for the buck at the current prices. A low end C6 is probably the next one....
Now, take a premium GT for $28K and add an SC. Lets say you have it professionally installed with new MAS, Injectors, Fule System, and tuned for $7,000.00. You then add A suspension Kit that you do yourself for $2,000. Now you add a few body mods ( or stripes ) to suit your taste for $2,000.00. Finally, you add a preformance brake kit for $1500.00.
You are now up to about 40K and can out preform all but the Z06 and saleen extream...
Now lest say you splurge and have a frged bottem end put in when the SC is installed and you add another $5K....
Now you hae a 45K car that can preform as well as any of them.... ( and look better in my opinion )
Cobra Member
Joined: January 26, 2005
Posts: 1,194
Likes: 0
Originally posted by sranger@December 15, 2005, 7:46 AM
Now, obviousle the Mustang GT is the best bang for the buck at the current prices. A low end C6 is probably the next one....
Now, obviousle the Mustang GT is the best bang for the buck at the current prices. A low end C6 is probably the next one....
I agree 100%. Not only that, give me my spoiler delete on my GT and I think it looks just as good as all the rest. Maybe better.
