TJ06

Mike's turbo 399RWHP@441TQ best run 11.81 posted time slip on this forum 10/31/05. Scrming eyeballed under his car said it looked more than a simple mod so we know it’s modded to hook up.

Lido's GT headers ,methanol before it blew I believe his best time is 11:30's@475RWHP. Scrming could you post his TQ at the 475RWHP?

11.30 475RWHP
11.81 399RWHP@441 TQ

We see what it takes to run in the 11.30 & 11.81 with a V6 & V8

I would really like to know (numbers RWHP & TQ] more about the setup on the SSM stroker Mustang to see what it takes to run 10.65.

rygenstormlocke

Thank you John for ruining my day. I spent like $400+ bucks for that upgrade on my car. I really appreciate this. :bang:

Excepcion13

No bubble burst, I use that back seat to hold my school books! PLEATHER it is, then!!!

But the front seat... that's just WRONG!

rygenstormlocke

I know he's got a 8.8 rear end, drag radials and probably LCA's but not 100% sure on those.

MSP

Also dont forget to include an 8.8 rear-end, along with 3.55 gears on the Powerhouse Mustang...

Most of these numbers allthough significant only help to motivate.. In the case of the Powerhouse car, we can hope to come close... But these are our daily drivers, so alittle more respect for the attempt must be given..

In the case of the SSM car, the 3.8L block can handle upwards of 550+ HP... I blieve this would also go to include all the stock internals as well..

Now it could be that the SOHC 4.0 could possibly achieve this, but since its my daily driver I wont be the first to find out that it cant..

So with those things in mind, I suggest we first try and beat Scrming.. For the normal guys, who dont own a shop he is the current king!!! All hail Scrming and his 13.4!! A very good accomplishment!

Also, Scrming is @ 13.4 because it is hard for him to hook up with all that power he currently has.. So we know that based on his research we will all expect to have some type of problem somewhere around the power level of 13.4... So the cars indeed need to be setup to hookup..

All we can do is take it a step at a time.. The Powerhouse Mustang V6, and the SSM Mustang V6 are both cars which are not considered Daily-Drivers... Owned by guys who do this stuff for a living.. None of us can really compete head-on with them... We can teaz, and pretend that we can, but in the end, its just all in good fun...

TJ06

I forgot to include Lido's infor above for the 11.30 time slot


Mike's turbo 399RWHP@441TQ best run 11.81 posted time slip on this forum 10/31/05. Scrming eyeballed under his car said it looked more than a simple mod so we know it’s modded to hook up.

Lido's GT S/C headers ,methanol before it blew I believe his best time is 11:30's@475RWHP. Scrming could you post his TQ at the 475RWHP?

11.30 475RWHP
11.81 399RWHP@441 TQ

We see what it takes to run in the 11.80 & 11.30 with a V6 & V8

I would really like to know (numbers RWHP & TQ] more about the setup on the SSM stroker Mustang to see what it takes to run 10.65.

TJ06

@ MSP

I am not planing on running this fast I just want to understand what it takes setup, RWHP, and TQ to hit 10.65 in SSM's V6 Mustang.

I looked at the SSM site and checked the spec's but it does not provide the RWHP & TQ.

Thomas S

I believe the SSM car is MUCH lighter than our cars. So it's going to take more power to get the same times. Like I said, I'm pretty sure the SSM V6 has a completely gutted interior. Also, Lidio blew his motor? What exactly happened? This is a surprise, especially since he's so careful with his tunes.

rygenstormlocke

Lideo's car was in the latest edition of MMFF magazine, it showed this information, and mentioned that he blew the engine on the run, but didn't say exactly what went wrong.

MSP

I'm sure scrming will inform us as soon as he finds out what went wrong...

But all it means is Lidio was pushing the envelope.. Perhaps past the limit of the 4.6L... They say the 4.6L motor is safest when its at 400RWHP... This means 471HP @ the crank... Most guys push way past this while they are at the track...


This is bad news for GT owners... This means Lidio will no longer be working from a stock longblock standpoint.. He will most likley go all out on the 4.6L now in his car..

Its pretty much already established though that the 4.6L is best at no more than 400RWHP...

In an interesting twist of fate, it will be something to ponder if it turns out the 4.0 can also be run safe at this power level.. Although I intend to set it at 400HP at the crank to be safe for awhile...

TJ06

@Jimp




Jimp I took in consideration of it being gutted I mentioned in post #22

rygenstormlocke

You bring up a very crucial point MSP.

One of which I have been thinking about. I have read on numerous posts that 400 RWHP is the safety zone for the GT as well, and breaking the 500 RWHP barriers is very difficult to do on this 4.6. If we got our 6's safely to 400 RWHP safely, then the differentiator just suddenly became greyer. Don’t get me wrong, the V8 is a better platform to make power, but in our case, we are not building race cars, we are building daily drivers that we can take to the track. I will be happy with anything between 300-400RWHP. After that, all of my mod focus will be on getting the car to hook, DR’s, LCA’s, etc.

Someday I will build a track car, but not anytime soon. This is a dream of mine, and this stroking thread has proved valuable of evaluating what is possible when I have a dedicated track car.

TJ06

Yes I agree I even posted in Jimps thread on info the new V6 and other threads I have thought for a long now after 450HP you are pushing the 4.6 from what I have read in the GT forums.

You run into the same problem of a hitting a wall quick even in the 4.6. A S/C and a couple mods and your done no cushion to build up.
I don't like the 4.6 for that reason and makes me feel kind of good I went with the V6 in a way.
Saleen S/C are not supposed and/or they don't recommend to put out more than 400RWHP, there charger's typically put out about 360- 380RWHP on a 4.6 if I remember correctly.

IMO the 4.6 is a weak engine to build.

What do you think about Lidio's answer to why the motor went??? If you know what I mean.

rygenstormlocke

I don't think it's a weak engine, because the same can be said of the 4.0. When you hit the limit, you have to change out pistons, heads, etc. The power curve on it is very good. It just is what it is. Just like for us to break 400RWHP, we have to make preparations.

I mean, that is what the Cobra is for, and I guess now the GT500. Just my opinion, you are more technical on engines than me, but this is the lines I am thinking along.

But it does make me feel good I bought a V6. Though I feel good my car is a stang period.

MSP

So what does this mean RaginStormlocke? This means that we must figure out what it takes, besides running 12PSi on a daily basis to run reliable @ 400RWHP... Part of this equation will relate to the need to install headers... Cams, heads?

Or could it be, that we can just simply run about 12psi everyday..? Now granted the only problem is the use of 104 octane race fuel Mike used... We cant run that everyday.. However, I feel with atleast headers and cams, we can safely run pretty close to 400rwhp on a daily basis...

So much still to learn about our lil 4.0's.. LOL!! I guess it is going to be important that I get the headers soon... Most seem to like the JBA.. They are the street legal version... I guess the part which is important is that I must use only CA legal parts... Afterall, a GT can run 400RWHP and still remain legal... Very interesting swing in the debate for us...

Getting to 400RWHP legally, and running reliably... This shall be my new focus.. Can it be done?

rygenstormlocke

On a daily driver, running at 400RWHP isn't going to put stress on your car. Heck, most of us can get to work fine with a 130HP LOL. I think at that power level based on what you and others have said, we will need to put in other components if we go to the track often and doing hard launches at high rpms.

For the autos, its like writing a different version of this story. But at that power level, and asuming you are doing 20-30 passes at the track like scrming, would you be confident in the pistions ane heads? Also, what about the axles and we still need to find the limit of the spider gears in the ford tlok. LOL.

Also, this thread has covered one interesting point, are we talking HP or track times. Personally I'm talking track times. Both are highly related but theres enough of a difference that we must aware of which one we are oriented towards. For me it's track times, so what happens on a 9PSI system and my Zex kit? Will that yeild the same results as a 400HP plus monster? This is something I would like to find out. I intend to double my zex up with a SC/TC and find the answer to this question.

So much to cover, this years track season will bring a lot of infor for all of us, especially we are all taking slightly different approaches.

rygenstormlocke

So my opinion MSP, is with your goals in mind, you will need headers, cams, heads and pistons. I don't see how you will be able to avoid it in the long run.

Dont forget the pistons. Even with the cooling options Vortech is offering, I still wouldn't risk it. Besides, with the new pistions and everything else, you can always get some Zex to give you that added little edge at the track.

TJ06

Rygn the V6 is not an V8 and was designed for SUV not a performace car. The reason I have to disagree with you here is V8's in generally are stronger built motors especially when automakers put them in their performance cars at least with Chevy's. I do not know Ford but look at the Ford 03 Cobra engine my understanding that is supposed to be a very strong engine. The 5.4 which I am not familiar but would tend to believe with would think that is stronger than the 4.6 both of which I believe would handle more than 400RWHP or 450+ safely in stock trim esp the cobra engine. These IMO are the kind of motors that should have been installed in a GT and if not the exact 03 Cobra motor but one very similar.

rygenstormlocke

Actually I agree with you, I was sying I think the 4.6 V8 is a strong engine. But, I'm not saying it's as strong as the 5.4. In fact, many have wondered why the 5.4 wasn't in the GT. I am also aware that our V6's, the 4.0 version of the engine started thier lives in Explorers and Rangers. Utility vechicles, potential for a lot of TQ I assume, but not designed to generate huge amounts of HP.

MSP

The current 4.6L 3V found in the GT was built using rods which were designed for no more than 400RWHP safely..

This was a calculated move on Fords part mostly to save money possibly..

The 4.6L as an engine is very strong.. But its only as strong as its weakest component, which just happens to be the rods..

This is the only reason the current GT engine is rated safe at 400RWHP.. Thats it.. If someone were to take a new 3v 4.6L and install new rods, they could make more power safely..

Actually, the debate bothers me somewhat.. Somehow we have all confused what makes a good street car, as opposed to a track car.. Somehow, we are going to have to make a distinction between the 2.. A good track car has numerous things about it which are quite different from a street car...

A 400HP street car, is not as fast as a 400HP track car.. This should be understood by all.. The problem around here is, some guys talk about street satisfaction, then get bashed from guys who are more goal oriented with track satisfaction...

Guys we have to make a distinction, and stick to it.. We cant keep going on like this.. It makes it hard for those not in our circle to keep up.. It makes it seem like we are all screwed up... LOL!!