Ok, first off, I'm almost a complete newb, so feel free to correct me if I say something that is completely wrong.

Second off, everyone I talk to about building a fast car says I need to have a goal first. So lets just pick something arbitrary...umm, streetable 900 hp.

So lets start with an MMR shortblock that is rated to handle 900 hp and a big hiney turbo (kit).

What else do I need? Will the stock heads and intake manifold handle 900 hp or should those be upgraded to match the strength of the shortblock?

I know I'll need a new clutch, but anything else in the transmission need replacing? What else in the entire drivetrain? Driveshaft maybe?

I've been looking around at prices and stuff, and this may be because I'm a complete newb and don't know anything, but it seems like one can turn an 05 into a 900 hp car for under $10,000.

Btw, the MMR 4.6 Street Mod 900 hp shortblock only cost $2800...isn't that tons cheaper than other cast iron, forged internal shortblocks on the market? Why?

Thanks for the help and info.

 

900hp streetable, you going to use it to race at the track too? Other wise 900 is a whole lot of overkill, IMHO.

 

It's one thing for the block to handle 900 hp and another to actually have 900hp. I'm having my shortblock built right now to handle 1000 hp, but I definately won't be putting down 1000. By the way, Al Pappito-Boss 330 is building my longblock.
When you get above 600 hp, you'll be changing everthing. You'll need a special tranny, a different driveshaft, built rearend and you'll definately need a different intake, ported heads, better valves/springs, dry sump oil pump, fuel system, brakes in order to stop that beast. The motor will have to breath in order to put down those numbers. I'm no expert, but just from what I'm doing, I'm having to change the tranny which changes the driveshaft automatically. Also having to port the heads, change the valves/springs and a few other things.
What else I've learned, it's a whole lot easier having a target or game plan. You need to know what exactly you're going to do with the car. If you are going to run it in NMRA races, you need to know what class you're going to run. Different rules for different classes. You can't run a C4 in certain classes and you can only have a certain size turbo (if you're going turbo). You can't have coatings in certain classes. If it's specifically going to be a street car, everthing just needs to be street legal. At the same time, if you have inspections/emissions, it'll need to pass the test. You also would want it to be streetable, not a pain to drive. I've heard of a lot of guys that have extremely high powered street cars, but hate driving them after the novelty wears off.
When you go to a motor builder, they want to know what your intentions are. Most reputable builders get tired of the flip-flopping of the direction people are going. Have a game plan, and build from there.

 

Wow, crap...that's a lot of stuff, thanks for the reply, David.

Rich, I said 900 hp cuz I know a guy who has a 860 hp (at the crank) streetable Supra. It doesn't seem like he did *that* much to it to get it that powerful, although his website about it is fairly large and I might not have read everything.

Check it out:
http://www.lilviv.com/motoring/cars/supra/index.html
Scroll to the bottom and click on "Speed performance modifications."

As far as I can tell, he just swapped out the twin turbo for a large turbo, upgraded brakes, upgraded clutch, did some suspension work. I think he's using the stock block and internals and stock transmission...but like I said, his website about it is big and kinda spread out, I might have missed something.

 

I think that getting 860hp at the crank out of a Supra motor from JUST changing the turbo (haven't looked at the site) is a bit unobtainable. I know this from shopping for short blocks recently, just 'cause it is cheap doesn't make it a good buy. I like MMR but I have heard that there are better engine builders. Al Pappito will be building my short block as well, even though he is in south Florida and I am in southwest Missouri. When you make that much horsepower there is little room for lack of precision. You can get 900hp pretty cheap but it won't last.

 

I'm sure you could bolt 900 hp onto an 05 stock block. It'll last about 1 time on a dyno or down the street/strip. The main question is...what are your intentions? 900 hp is a sheet load of power. Even if you COULD get it to hook up at the track, you then get into aerodynamic issues. 700 hp can get you into the mid-low 9's. If you're comparing to that Supra, you better shed some serious weight off your car.
Put it this way. IF you had a bone stock 05, you could install a nitrous system. You could take it to the track and make a few runs. 1. You're not going to hook up too good. 2. Without tuning, you'll have some real issues. My point is...you could put anything on any car. Whether it lasts or not is another question. If your buddy with the supra changes out the turbos, there will be other things to change...or he'll find the things that will need to be changed as he breaks them.

 

Hmm, I think yall are misunderstand my questions. I understand that if you jack up your hp, you're going to have to replace a lot of stuff or else things will break. I do not dispute that, I'm asking WHAT needs to be replaced to hit those high hp numbers that those built shortblocks are rated to withstand.

Second, I'm also curious as to why it takes relatively little to get the Supra to handle 860 hp, but it would take us a TON of mods to be able to support that power.

Btw, that Supra has been putting down that much power since 2003 without incident.

Please don't take this as an anti Mustang, pro Supra post. I love my Mustang more than any other material possesion I have right now. I don't want to go out and buy a Supra. I'm new to high performance and drag racing and I'm simply comparing my car to other cars for learning purposes.

That streetable 900 hp goal was just arbitrary because of that Supra and because the shortblock I saw was rated to sustain 900 hp. I guess more realistic would be 600 to the wheels?

 

I would then expect to "have to" replace the following items for street driving: Clutch, and most likely transmission (Tremec 3650 has pretty much a 600hp limit at the flywheel), a power adder is a definite (there are not so far any claims of N/A above 385hp). With the power adder comes the required mods: fuel injectors, fuel system pump booster or larger pump, a new MAF or MAF extender, long tubes, shorties if turbo. Better save $500.00 or so for dyno/tuning time. That should be a good start.

 

Ouch, the stock Tremec is only rated at 600 hp? Hehe, that's gunna cost some of you guys a pretty penny...

600 hp at the rear wheels will definitely require a built shortblock right? What about heads and cams all the stuff on top or can you get away with using the stock stuff?

Sorry if these are dumb questions.

 

That's something that only experience will give us as more people start venturing into the 600+ WHP numbers with a S197 with 281 3V.

The highest Supra WHP number is around 700-800 WHP on a stock motor (not stock turbo, drivetrain, etc.). That is running some extremely high octane gas too. Not to mention these guys don't have any daily-useable power. Not too great on low-mid end, you get the kick on the high-end.

I would say you would need...
Twin or triple plate clutch (i'm going carbon)
Rolling shortblock (crank, sleeves (not sure on this?), pistons, rods, arp main studs)
Upgrade heads (F/I cams, valvetrain upgrades, stronger head studs, maybe p&p)
Probably a new driveshaft, not sure what this one will last up to, but I doubt Ford engineered it to last up to 600+ WHP.
Oil cooler, oil pan (with better baffling and cooling)
Radiator
Low-temp t-stat


This is just broad for quite a bit of cars (though I will be applying this to my own S197), parts that are more resistant to a higher level of load and parts to help keep the engine cooler.

 

Add some extreme amount of chassis stiffening as in a full roll cage, bye bye interior.

Some things you'll need to go with that "streetable motor"... Built Transmission w/ high end clutch or high stall converter and bullet proof bellhousing, Built Rear End and 1 piece driveshaft, completely modified front and rear suspension (a 3 link probably isnt the best for that power level so you should look into a 4 link).

Wider and stickier tires, big brakes, over the top fuel management system and delivery, front mounted engine plate... you're looking at about $40000+ for something streetable and race ready IMO.

I've built a 351 cleveland stroked to 385 with ported 2v heads that was supposed to make 500+ easy without the use of the 300 shot it was built for.

If you are going to do this, there is plenty of stuff you'll need to basically throw away but you'll have an 8 second car on your hands.

I think I'll be happy with a bit more than 500 to the tires but thats a few years away I think. I wont have to sink that much money into it either when compared to your 700+rwhp project.

-Dan

 

no such thing as a 900hp streetable car in the sence that it will no require constant work to keep it alive... 900 hp is the kinda power that tends to brake things you least expect and rebrake things you though were bullit proof.
A 9" rear end and full engione to support 900 hp will blow your $10k right away, then get the tranny, suspention, chasis stiffening, driveshaft, etc. and expect to go through at least another $10k, and these numbers are if you do the work

check out www.turbochargedpower.com Richard Holdner from MM&FF worked with them and made a 03 cobra that made 990hp on the stock internals and block, but using very high octaine gas.

 

Man Dave, this is getting very common w/ you and I. I agree you totally here. If you are going to add any power adder than you must have a plan on what you intend to do w/ the car and the $$$ to back it up it case something goes wrong which it usually does. I have known Dave for a only short while but he knew what direction he was going w/ the car and had a plan for it. Most people I have come across think "just add the blower, go and race it, and all will be fine." They have no clue what direction they want to go and most do not have the finances to make the necessary corrections.