Day at Brenspeeds and Comp cam install
2/21/08, 06:55 AM
#41
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in the photo posted for your Feb, 15 dyno pull you had your 17 by 8 235's on, is this correct?
2/21/08, 07:46 AM
#42
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You are correct. And I asked Brent what he thought the different would be and his response was maybe 5 hp different. But it is really hard to say what the 18's cost.
2/21/08, 01:12 PM
#43
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Oct,27 pull was minus long tubes, deletes and cam's but you had the larger Steeda wheels HP pull was 277 and change! by Brents estimate add the five you lost with the larger wheels! with the stock Flat rocks then you should have been around 282 or 283 hp! Feb,15 dyno pull , long tubes ,delete plates and the cams but the smaller lighter 17's on! Saying the tubes only got you 5 hp and the deletes only got 5 hp theres 10 of your gain! then subtract 5 hp from the 315 hp figure you had because you pulled with the smaller lighter wheels! see where I'm going bro!
2/21/08, 02:54 PM
#44
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My only thought was I remember some posts of tom281 where I believe he said the larger wheels could cost as much as 20 hp I realize everything being relative that the 20 hp figure could be at much higher hp ranges! My thought is trying to figure out where your hp gains really are!
Oct,27 pull was minus long tubes, deletes and cam's but you had the larger Steeda wheels HP pull was 277 and change! by Brents estimate add the five you lost with the larger wheels! with the stock Flat rocks then you should have been around 282 or 283 hp! Feb,15 dyno pull , long tubes ,delete plates and the cams but the smaller lighter 17's on! Saying the tubes only got you 5 hp and the deletes only got 5 hp theres 10 of your gain! then subtract 5 hp from the 315 hp figure you had because you pulled with the smaller lighter wheels! see where I'm going bro!
Oct,27 pull was minus long tubes, deletes and cam's but you had the larger Steeda wheels HP pull was 277 and change! by Brents estimate add the five you lost with the larger wheels! with the stock Flat rocks then you should have been around 282 or 283 hp! Feb,15 dyno pull , long tubes ,delete plates and the cams but the smaller lighter 17's on! Saying the tubes only got you 5 hp and the deletes only got 5 hp theres 10 of your gain! then subtract 5 hp from the 315 hp figure you had because you pulled with the smaller lighter wheels! see where I'm going bro!
Yeah I see...the numbers are what they are. Ben's before and after N/A numbers were with the same wheels and tires. I really don't believe the longtubes are worth much after you have been off road. I believe I got a solid 20-25 hp gain from just the cams. There is a big difference in the way the car felt on the way up to Brenspeeds and on the way home after the cams. So I like what I feel. Next to the cams...the best bang for the buck is the driveshaft upgrade. For $500 bucks you can really feel it in the ole butt-o-meter!! You know none of the gains that the manufacturers claim are really true. Don't you? There is an old saying..."spend your money and take your chances" That's what any of us do with these mods.
Scott
2/21/08, 03:15 PM
#45
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I stand by my statements on larger wheel/tire combos. Not to say Scott's numbers are inflated because of that, but I could argue the point that they're costing/adding more than just 5hp.
2/21/08, 03:55 PM
#46
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Yeah I see...the numbers are what they are. Ben's before and after N/A numbers were with the same wheels and tires. I really don't believe the longtubes are worth much after you have been off road. I believe I got a solid 20-25 hp gain from just the cams. There is a big difference in the way the car felt on the way up to Brenspeeds and on the way home after the cams. So I like what I feel. Next to the cams...the best bang for the buck is the driveshaft upgrade. For $500 bucks you can really feel it in the ole butt-o-meter!! You know none of the gains that the manufacturers claim are really true. Don't you? There is an old saying..."spend your money and take your chances" That's what any of us do with these mods.
Scott
Scott
that have been playing the mod game a long time and thats why we should hold their feet to the fire and make them be as truthful as possible!..as I feel you have..
I don't care what your wife say's.. your still sexy
2/21/08, 07:08 PM
#47
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Only way to find out for sure is to dyno the car at Brenspeeds in the spring at the next dyno day with the larger wheels and tires. I know the larger tires cost you almost 20 on the dyno but I am not sure what they would cost me at my level. Something for sure and the only way I know to find out is in the spring. And I will find out!!
2/22/08, 05:19 PM
#50
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Refering to the power it takes to turn the extra mass? It would be pretty easy to quantify if two people could get together and swap wheels on one dyno car (would be easier to just swap cars, but using the same car would be the control). Unfortunately as far as I know, you cant get the same brand-type tires for the 17 and 18" wheels. Differing brands and tires will have different rolling resistances which would also effect the outcome. I can say that going from a 235/50R18 BFG KDWS to a 255/45R18 KDW II has cost me about 1 to 2 mpg.
2/22/08, 05:23 PM
#51
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Sorry
Manuals here,I have been on the fence with the NSR cams...I don't know if a 1 piece shaft would make more of an improvement???I have about a G for my mod cash and should save a little more for a F/I unit, but I to run N/A a while longer.Don't want to skimp on the F/I unit.
2/22/08, 05:25 PM
#52
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Refering to the power it takes to turn the extra mass? It would be pretty easy to quantify if two people could get together and swap wheels on one dyno car (would be easier to just swap cars, but using the same car would be the control). Unfortunately as far as I know, you cant get the same brand-type tires for the 17 and 18" wheels. Differing brands and tires will have different rolling resistances which would also effect the outcome. I can say that going from a 235/50R18 BFG KDWS to a 255/45R18 KDW II has cost me about 1 to 2 mpg.
No doubt...Larger tires and wheels will cost you horsepower and torque...How much in any one pull ....put them on the dyno and find out!!!!!
2/23/08, 12:12 PM
#54
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all of my dyno numbers have been with 20's. I am a 5M and on two different dynos and with over 50,000 miles between the two runs. At Brothers Performance Warehouse in Corona I put down with 3000 miles on the car C&L Street intake, 93 C&L tune for predator, Spintech Axle back exhuast, Stock everything else made 297/315 and 60,000 miles later at Spankin Time Motorsports I put down 295/305 with the same mods. These were both dyno jet dyno's @ SAE figures. I would wonder if my car would have made more power with out the 20's on the dyno. I am also running 285 wide tires out back. I would like to do the NSR cams and would say that if I can make a straight up 25 HP gain @ 6500 RPM it would be worth it since you can use stock springs. (I like to rev a lot). Are you an auto? what was the D/A on the run before the cams and D/A on the run with the cams?
2/23/08, 02:21 PM
#55
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all of my dyno numbers have been with 20's. I am a 5M and on two different dynos and with over 50,000 miles between the two runs. At Brothers Performance Warehouse in Corona I put down with 3000 miles on the car C&L Street intake, 93 C&L tune for predator, Spintech Axle back exhuast, Stock everything else made 297/315 and 60,000 miles later at Spankin Time Motorsports I put down 295/305 with the same mods. These were both dyno jet dyno's @ SAE figures. I would wonder if my car would have made more power with out the 20's on the dyno. I am also running 285 wide tires out back. I would like to do the NSR cams and would say that if I can make a straight up 25 HP gain @ 6500 RPM it would be worth it since you can use stock springs. (I like to rev a lot). Are you an auto? what was the D/A on the run before the cams and D/A on the run with the cams?
Yes I am an auto transmission.... And to answer another question "Yes" those 20 inchers will cost you hp and torque on the dyno. Only way to know how much is to do a before and after dyno pull. But they will cost you some numbers!! But on the bright side the cams should gains you the 25 hp regardless of your wheels and tires. You will gain more if you put back on the stockers!!!!!
Scott
2/26/08, 04:01 PM
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driving impressions
Hey 70MACH1OWNER,
can we get some driving impressions. You've had the cams ~10 days. What do you think about them? How is the low end? How are they up top? Can you feel a spot in the RPM band where they really kick in? How is the around town drivability?
Maybe you haven't been out much cause of the weather.
Let us know.
Thanks!
can we get some driving impressions. You've had the cams ~10 days. What do you think about them? How is the low end? How are they up top? Can you feel a spot in the RPM band where they really kick in? How is the around town drivability?
Maybe you haven't been out much cause of the weather.
Let us know.
Thanks!
2/26/08, 04:20 PM
#57
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Hey Adam,
Well the car has been snow bound since I got back...however it is a 200 mile trip from Brenspeed's to my house and these are my best impressions todate.
Idle...Definitely a little lopey now. Not a bunch but you can hear it.
Normal acceleration... pretty much stock going up thru the gears
Cruising at 70 mph...Drives like stock...exhaust seems to have more volume to it now...gas mileage like stock... 23 mpg on the way home.
Now if you are getting frisky... From a standing start at WOT it has much more ummmp! The real power of these cams is in the higher rpms. From like 3500 rpm and up. If you look back at my dyno sheet you can see they start making power down in the lower rpm's but come on their best up high. Also the stock cams give up after about 5500 rpm. These continue to make power above 6000 rpm. While I made a couple of changes between my Oct dyno run and the one on Feb 15th I am sure these cams are worth between 25-30 rwhp as advertised. For 1K installed I don't think you will NOT find any other mod on a N/A car that will give you this much bang for the buck!!
Scott
Well the car has been snow bound since I got back...however it is a 200 mile trip from Brenspeed's to my house and these are my best impressions todate.
Idle...Definitely a little lopey now. Not a bunch but you can hear it.
Normal acceleration... pretty much stock going up thru the gears
Cruising at 70 mph...Drives like stock...exhaust seems to have more volume to it now...gas mileage like stock... 23 mpg on the way home.
Now if you are getting frisky... From a standing start at WOT it has much more ummmp! The real power of these cams is in the higher rpms. From like 3500 rpm and up. If you look back at my dyno sheet you can see they start making power down in the lower rpm's but come on their best up high. Also the stock cams give up after about 5500 rpm. These continue to make power above 6000 rpm. While I made a couple of changes between my Oct dyno run and the one on Feb 15th I am sure these cams are worth between 25-30 rwhp as advertised. For 1K installed I don't think you will NOT find any other mod on a N/A car that will give you this much bang for the buck!!
Scott
3/2/08, 12:41 PM
#59
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Absolutely...There is nothing special about these cams over even the stock cams. Anyone... including a very friendly dealer can do these cams. Most of the work in doing cams on these cars are in doing the springs. With these "NO springs required" Comp cams it is about 5 times easier and cheaper. And that is coming from Dave at Brenspeed who has installed both kinds many times!!!
Scott
