That's actually backwards from reality. Let's take your cylinder head example and play with it. Let's say you have a stock set of very restrictive heads (obviously NOT 3V heads!) on your engine. You go through the engine and upgrade EVERYTHING else besides the heads for a max effort build. Cam. Intake manifold. Throttle body. CAI. MAF. Headers. Exhaust. Etc. Every single part on that engine is the best money can buy...

What would be the result? You would be broke and VERY pissed because the stock heads are STILL the most restrictive part on the engine. You would have gained SOME HP with all your mods, but the heads are still holding you WAY back.

Finally, you decide that you are in for a penny, in for a pound, so you pickup and install that latest, greatest cylinder heads you can find that are perfectly matched to all the other mods you have already done.

The result?

You REALLY wake up that engine! Now, EVERYTHING is flowing the air and fuel needed to make the kind of power you wanted. Suddenly, all the money you spent doesn't appear to be a waste because you are seeing the HP you thought you where buying in the first place. That lasts right up until you throw a cheap, stock, cracked metal rod through the side of the block while shifting at 7500 rpm... Time to upgrade the bottom end to match the top end!

Now look at this the other way: you put those same heads on the engine to start with. In this case (we said the heads were very restrictive, so they are holding the engine back), you DO gain some HP because you removed the restriction of the stock heads. But you don't gain nearly as much HP when you installed the heads this time because you ended up moving the restriction from the heads to some other restrictive part (say the intake manifold).

You then install that new intake manifold and you gain more power as you removed the most restrictive element in your engine. And so on and so on...

So in short, the C&L intake won't do much for a stock 3V because the stock 3V intake is VERY good. It's only when you start doing modes that remove other restrictions (ported heads, larger valves, bigger cams, TB, etc...) that the improved flow of the C&L intake will start to shine and make more power than the stock intake.

And that is pretty much what the C&L page on the new intake was saying. That is why they are going to very great lengths to educate people about what the intake can and cannot do as well as explain just how good the stock intake is. They don't want a bunch of people buying installing it and then complaining that they just spent $700 on an intake manifold and only saw 5-10 hp on the dyno with their stock engine.

 

Yeah, what he said... LOL!!

I think that the bottom line is that the OE intake is quite satisfactory for NA builds that keep the stock heads and internals. Start pushing the revs way up (cams, heads) and only then does the stock intake begin to become a restriction. The C&L is most likely optimized for higher-rpm flow, and will not show huge HP gains below 6000RPM, since the stock manifold does quite nicely down there! If you push a stock build up in revs, there will be other parts (cams, heads) that will become the limiting factor, not just the manifold.

 

C&L is testing on 3 kinds of cars, FYI. A bone stock car, a bolt on car, and a wild fully built power adder car. So we're gonna know what's what when it's all said and done.

 

I saw that the LSx V8s now have an aftermarket intake manifold that claims to use Formula 1 style velocity stack flow tubes. I wonder if C&L will do something cool like that for the 4.6 3V because it would make the engine sound even more aggressive.

 

Do we know if this manifold is going to be any taller than the stock maifold? I don't want to burn money on a strut tower brace only to have to remove it if this turns out to be a good addition to a bolt-on car.

 

The strut tower brace is mainly for decorative purposes on the S197. Save your money for the intake if you're interested in performance and handling.

 

Thanks for telling me that, it makes sense now. =D

 

You are welcome. Sometimes it can be a pain wrapping your mind around these things.

 

The heads and cams are usually one of the most "restrictive" OEM engine components followed by the exhaust manifolds and intake manifold. The reason is that the OEMs are tasked with reducing NVH to allowable levels, reducing emissions, and improving fuel economy. Old people will complain about "noisy" engines while tree huggers will b*tch and whine about NOx.

 

Metroples, it was freaking EXAMPLE!!!! And from the numbers I have seen on the parts on these cars, it is VERY well matched from the factory. Look at the flow rates of the stock heads. Look at the flow rates of the stock intake manifold. Look at the exhaust, at the TB, etc. All of it is very well matched on this engine. Which is why it is so freaking expensive to get any real gains other than CAI + tune.

The thing just works very well stock.

 

I agree. I am keeping my Stang as stock as possible. No CAI or even a tune for me.

 

 

cool

 

You have GOT to try a good CAI and a tune! That makes a HUGE difference in these cars! Nothing else will give you the same bang for the buck as a CAI and good tune on these cars. It's pretty much the ONLY weak link (air flow wise...) in these cars.

If you drive one with a CAI for a while, then switch back to stock, your first thoughts are "what the heck happened to my car!?!?!?"

 

=|, when before have you had trouble explaining something to me?

 

I honestly doubt any real gains on stock engine with this intake.

They do make a ventury like intake for the 4.6L its for the 4v engine though. Even that has only made about 410hp crank. Venturi/f1 intakes make your engine breathe better in the top end reducing low end force. Basically shift the power band.

In any case this intake will increase efficiency for the turbo/centri guys but probably wont do much for the stock 3v engine unless you rev in the 9k range. BTW 9k is not entirely undo able for a 3v 4.6L, you just need the correct springs. Even the stock springs are tested to 9k in short bursts to ensure safety.

I believe this intake coupled with some forged rods and pistons running 12:1 or more will net around 500hp and rev like a 4cyl, then you could always balance the assembly to 1g, providing you use some nice cams along with the springs necessary to run 9k, I would love to see the focus/cosworth 12k springs in a 3v engine. Hell even a stock 4.6L 3v is rev happy out the box.

Long runners = tourque down low = street/dragstrip
short runners or venturi = high rpm breathing and gutless low rpm = great for corner caring allowing to hold a high gear longer with a higher gear ratio

 

Subscribing

 

Actually, I usually just have a hard time keeping my mouth shut...

 

Awesome!

 

Have we heard anything on this yet? I haven't been on all of the sites yet but I'm too tired to do a bunch of searching right now.