Another Hurst Shifter install question.....
8/21/05, 08:07 PM
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OK I apologize for a simple question on a simple topic but hoping to get input here - something don't feel right nor does it add up......
Installation of the Hurst shifter specifies that at the stick bottom, there is an offset to the stick bottom that should go to the RIGHT (passenger side) of the car. This is in step 6 and referred to in figure 2.
My shifter still feels pretty "notchy", un-smooth especially going into 4th and reverse is about the only way I can describe it. I mean it works and all but, I wonder about it. Maybe it's still gotta break in and all, but I did lube everything up pretty good. BIG BUT: the kicker is I was looking at the pics of the stock unit and something caught my eye:
The stock unit has the same kind of offset at the stick bottom, and it's clear from the pictures I took during disassembly that this offset was on the other side - LEFT (driver's side). If anyone has the stock unit sitting around you can check this yourself - the stock unit has a "bend" in the top part of the stick that actually bends toward the passenger side of the car (it's true, or at least mine did), and when you look at it that way, the offset is on the opposite side than what Hurst says (I have a picture that shows this).
....and figure two of the instructions has an arrow pointing to this offset and it also seems to be indicating it's on the left side, toward the trans linkage rod, although the intructions state differently. So, if you follow the instructions you get this:
....which is backwards from the factory setup.
Now, I'm just thinking that when you look at both sticks, the way they both mount is identical and the stick CENTER at the pivot point is located in exactly the same spot....so, wouldn't this mean the trans linkage rod is now kicked in tighter (possibly rubbing on something or at the least, just not right) and also, what good is this offset when it's just located on the other side? Why offset a bolt?
So...just to be on the safe side I sent a tech support question to Hurst and will post whatever answer I get.... in the meantime I'm wondering if anyone else who installed this unit remembers what they did or noticed about this?
Sorry for the long-winded post on a simple topic but I can't help but wonder if in "version 1.0" of this new product there coulda been an error in the instructions.....
Installation of the Hurst shifter specifies that at the stick bottom, there is an offset to the stick bottom that should go to the RIGHT (passenger side) of the car. This is in step 6 and referred to in figure 2.
My shifter still feels pretty "notchy", un-smooth especially going into 4th and reverse is about the only way I can describe it. I mean it works and all but, I wonder about it. Maybe it's still gotta break in and all, but I did lube everything up pretty good. BIG BUT: the kicker is I was looking at the pics of the stock unit and something caught my eye:
The stock unit has the same kind of offset at the stick bottom, and it's clear from the pictures I took during disassembly that this offset was on the other side - LEFT (driver's side). If anyone has the stock unit sitting around you can check this yourself - the stock unit has a "bend" in the top part of the stick that actually bends toward the passenger side of the car (it's true, or at least mine did), and when you look at it that way, the offset is on the opposite side than what Hurst says (I have a picture that shows this).
....and figure two of the instructions has an arrow pointing to this offset and it also seems to be indicating it's on the left side, toward the trans linkage rod, although the intructions state differently. So, if you follow the instructions you get this:
....which is backwards from the factory setup.
Now, I'm just thinking that when you look at both sticks, the way they both mount is identical and the stick CENTER at the pivot point is located in exactly the same spot....so, wouldn't this mean the trans linkage rod is now kicked in tighter (possibly rubbing on something or at the least, just not right) and also, what good is this offset when it's just located on the other side? Why offset a bolt?
So...just to be on the safe side I sent a tech support question to Hurst and will post whatever answer I get.... in the meantime I'm wondering if anyone else who installed this unit remembers what they did or noticed about this?
Sorry for the long-winded post on a simple topic but I can't help but wonder if in "version 1.0" of this new product there coulda been an error in the instructions.....
8/21/05, 10:00 PM
#2
Yes, I feel and thought the same as you about the shifter feel!
I never look at the old one while I was taking it out...hmmm, you bring up an interesting point though, I Thought that piece with the off set can turn completely around, if that is the case, how do you know where the stock one was, unless you looked at its position before removal.
I found a few discepancys with the directions, I called Hurst and never got a good response, just an idiot who knew no more than me!...how about the part where it tells you to remove the 2 metal sleeves from the front of the shifter and then put them into the HUrst, well mky stock shifter only had ! metal sleeve?????
Keep us abreast of this situation, you may have found the answer to the notchy, clunky shifter blues...lol, if you did , you will be the hero of the Hurst thread...in my eyes anyway!
I never look at the old one while I was taking it out...hmmm, you bring up an interesting point though, I Thought that piece with the off set can turn completely around, if that is the case, how do you know where the stock one was, unless you looked at its position before removal.
I found a few discepancys with the directions, I called Hurst and never got a good response, just an idiot who knew no more than me!...how about the part where it tells you to remove the 2 metal sleeves from the front of the shifter and then put them into the HUrst, well mky stock shifter only had ! metal sleeve?????
Keep us abreast of this situation, you may have found the answer to the notchy, clunky shifter blues...lol, if you did , you will be the hero of the Hurst thread...in my eyes anyway!
8/21/05, 10:33 PM
#3
Team Mustang Source
Keep this thread alive because my shifter should be here by the end of the week. If I have to do something different than the directions specify I would like to know! 
8/22/05, 05:58 AM
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Originally posted by davids2toys@August 21, 2005, 10:03 PM
I Thought that piece with the off set can turn completely around, if that is the case, how do you know where the stock one was, unless you looked at its position before removal.
I Thought that piece with the off set can turn completely around, if that is the case, how do you know where the stock one was, unless you looked at its position before removal.
A) Pretty sure that the part we're talking about can rotate on the Hurst unit, (at first I had actually hooked it up "wrong" per the instructions and had to unbolt it and turn it around, kinda ironic) but on the stock unit I am almost certain it's fixed in place. I'll take another look at my stock unit tonite but I looked it over pretty well before this post...never hurts to double check tho.
B) Check this pic out...this is the stock unit before I removed it. I was sitting on the passenger side of the car when I took this picture, and note the bend in the shifter stick - the bend is coming toward the pax side - you can also verify the front of the car is to the right, because you'll recognize the curved little tray-like area at the front of the console right below the environmental/ A/C controls on the far right:
When I look at my stock shifter now, and I view it from the rear (with the big square rubber bushing), with the stick in this position, the offset is on the left, not the right.
Will definitely post what Hurst says - if it's not convincing enough I'm going to swap it around anyway and will share the result. What could possibly go wrong?
PS Oh yeah, I only had one metal sleeve in the front bushing as well....go figure......
8/22/05, 06:27 AM
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Originally posted by Rich@August 21, 2005, 10:36 PM
Keep this thread alive because my shifter should be here by the end of the week. If I have to do something different than the directions specify I would like to know!
Keep this thread alive because my shifter should be here by the end of the week. If I have to do something different than the directions specify I would like to know!
8/22/05, 07:17 AM
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PLUS - what I'm gonna do anyway is double-check the sides of the white plastic/rubber bushings that are in the bottom of the stick itself to make sure they're smooth, and lube 'em up like I did the trans linkage insert.....and then I'm going to get another 13mm nut from the hardware store, and when I put the original nut back on I'm going to tighten it just snug, back it out about 1/4 turn, then hold it in place with a slim wrench and double-nut it tight with the second nut and some red loctite for good measure.
I totally munched up the shifter assembly on my Honda bike when I put footboards on, the shifter assembly also had a sleeve insert and was tightened by a bolt that went through it very much like this. I don't trust anything that pivots but that has a sleeve or insert that can crush up and induce binding. So now I'm 0-for-2 with my wife as far as my luck in dealing with shifters goes....maybe I'm really just looking for another reason to crawl back under this great car again....
I totally munched up the shifter assembly on my Honda bike when I put footboards on, the shifter assembly also had a sleeve insert and was tightened by a bolt that went through it very much like this. I don't trust anything that pivots but that has a sleeve or insert that can crush up and induce binding. So now I'm 0-for-2 with my wife as far as my luck in dealing with shifters goes....maybe I'm really just looking for another reason to crawl back under this great car again....
8/22/05, 04:58 PM
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Well my Hurst arrived today....The picture in the instruction's(page 2, figure 2) does seem to show the "offset" at the bottom of the stick to the drver's side, when all the instruction's state in bold that the "offset" goes to the passenger side... 
I'm going to also call Hurst tomorrow and try to get to the bottom of this. If anyone else has any luck, please post. BTW: The Hurst unit can rotate 360 deg. ( the stick itself including the offset portion), so you could bolt it up either way...Which is not good combined with the fact that there are discrepencies in the instruction's... :notnice: :bang:
I'm going to also call Hurst tomorrow and try to get to the bottom of this. If anyone else has any luck, please post. BTW: The Hurst unit can rotate 360 deg. ( the stick itself including the offset portion), so you could bolt it up either way...Which is not good combined with the fact that there are discrepencies in the instruction's... :notnice: :bang:
8/22/05, 06:30 PM
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Cool.....I'm still waiting to hear back from them too.
I'll reiterate that I may be full of poup on this, maybe my thinking is wrong or maybe Hurst's design has something in it that makes this right (don't know what it could be tho). All I know is whatever they have to say better be convincing.....looking at the stock unit again, it looks like somebody's got some 'splainin' to do!
Oh, and David.....good thinking about the possibility of the bottom lug connector having spun around...I just checked the stock unit and it's solid as a rock, no chance of it moving or rotating on mine. Hmmmmmm, indeed, eh?.
Don't mean to hammer it into the ground but I always plan for the worst when dealing with companies - so here's a couple pix to show the reason for the question, in case we get the run around from tech support.....
I'll reiterate that I may be full of poup on this, maybe my thinking is wrong or maybe Hurst's design has something in it that makes this right (don't know what it could be tho). All I know is whatever they have to say better be convincing.....looking at the stock unit again, it looks like somebody's got some 'splainin' to do!
Oh, and David.....good thinking about the possibility of the bottom lug connector having spun around...I just checked the stock unit and it's solid as a rock, no chance of it moving or rotating on mine. Hmmmmmm, indeed, eh?.
Don't mean to hammer it into the ground but I always plan for the worst when dealing with companies - so here's a couple pix to show the reason for the question, in case we get the run around from tech support.....
8/22/05, 06:43 PM
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One thought on the "Why offset" the bolt question?". If indeed the offset does go to the passenger side as Hurst states in there instruction's, the offset could be there so the bolt would not become to long i.e. not enough thread's left to tight'n...Again IF the design of the Hurst dictates that the offset to the passenger side is correct. They could have used a spacer to simplify thing's however, if that is the case. It would make more sense if the offset went to the drivers side like the stock unit. I just want a deffinate answer from Hurst before I go to install... I don't think your full of poo, I think your on to something. Just from the descepency in the pic and the wording in the instruction's.
I don't think your full of poo, I think your on to something. Just from the descepency in the pic and the wording in the instruction's.
8/22/05, 07:23 PM
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Yup, good point about the spacing - that occured to me after I wrote it but still....kinda strange about why having the different offset is important, when they really just changed pivot point but not the travel (or we'd never reach the gears either). Maybe I'm over-thinking it but I want it perfect, you know?
Definitely I'm going to try it......might be until this weekend, unless I take my bike to work in the next day or two, because I just don't like crawling under and working on a hot car these days and I'd have to do it when I get home after a long commute. Unless someone else beats me to it and reports that it's worse or no difference. And I'd like to see what Hurst says too. Oh who am I kidding I'll crawl under there anyway just because I'm stubborn.
Definitely I'm going to try it......might be until this weekend, unless I take my bike to work in the next day or two, because I just don't like crawling under and working on a hot car these days and I'd have to do it when I get home after a long commute. Unless someone else beats me to it and reports that it's worse or no difference. And I'd like to see what Hurst says too. Oh who am I kidding I'll crawl under there anyway just because I'm stubborn.
8/22/05, 07:33 PM
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Originally posted by Stoopy@August 22, 2005, 7:26 PM
Yup, good point about the spacing - that occured to me after I wrote it but still....kinda strange about why having the different offset is important, when they really just changed pivot point but not the travel (or we'd never reach the gears either). Maybe I'm over-thinking it but I want it perfect, you know?
Definitely I'm going to try it......might be until this weekend, unless I take my bike to work in the next day or two, because I just don't like crawling under and working on a hot car these days and I'd have to do it when I get home after a long commute. Unless someone else beats me to it and reports that it's worse or no difference. And I'd like to see what Hurst says too. Oh who am I kidding I'll crawl under there anyway just because I'm stubborn.
Yup, good point about the spacing - that occured to me after I wrote it but still....kinda strange about why having the different offset is important, when they really just changed pivot point but not the travel (or we'd never reach the gears either). Maybe I'm over-thinking it but I want it perfect, you know?
Definitely I'm going to try it......might be until this weekend, unless I take my bike to work in the next day or two, because I just don't like crawling under and working on a hot car these days and I'd have to do it when I get home after a long commute. Unless someone else beats me to it and reports that it's worse or no difference. And I'd like to see what Hurst says too. Oh who am I kidding I'll crawl under there anyway just because I'm stubborn.
I burn't my day off today trying to figure this thing out so I won't be able to install it until the weekend. :bang:
8/23/05, 01:42 AM
#13
Great Job stoopy
, WOW what a big mess! I emailed Hurst looking for a chrome curved stick to bring the handle back 2', havent heard a thing. You know they took 6 months to bring this thing to market, you would think they could have got the directions right...WTF :notnice:
I hope somone reverses the position of the part in question, I wont have any time for at least a week or more!!!
, WOW what a big mess! I emailed Hurst looking for a chrome curved stick to bring the handle back 2', havent heard a thing. You know they took 6 months to bring this thing to market, you would think they could have got the directions right...WTF :notnice: I hope somone reverses the position of the part in question, I wont have any time for at least a week or more!!!
8/23/05, 12:15 PM
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Stoopy,
Can anyone post a picture showing how the Hurst "should" be lined up (back view like Stoopy did for the stock shifter). I have one and was going to put it in this weekend...Now this...I am confused as to which way it goes now...
Jay
Can anyone post a picture showing how the Hurst "should" be lined up (back view like Stoopy did for the stock shifter). I have one and was going to put it in this weekend...Now this...I am confused as to which way it goes now...
Jay
8/23/05, 12:44 PM
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Gents, I really didn't mean to confuse or intimidate anyone away from this stick.....really, despite the photos and all my yakking, it's not hard to deal with, nor is it, I think, a serious issue. I mean the thing works, several of us are obviously driving around with them installed as per the instructions. I'm just looking to be sure it's as good as possible.... a "tweak" if you will. even without it I STILL prefer this shifter over stock. I just want it to live up to every bit of the Hurst logo I put on the dash.
Honestly, I'd just treat this like a heads-up and go ahead and put it in, this part that I'm talking about is the LAST thing you put a wrench on when you are under the car wrapping everything up, and all you have to do is bolt the chrome stick on, screw the **** on, sit in the car and see how it shifts. It's easier to mess with and figure out, and try either way, as you are installing it. Undo one nut. Turn the doohicky at the bottom of the stick around. Put the nut back on. Try it that way. Choose the one you like best, if you could even feel any difference.
I wish I'd done that when it was on the ramps - getting time to crawl back under a second time to hose around with it is much harder than noodling with it a little on the first time.
Ain't heard from Hurst yet anyways......
Honestly, I'd just treat this like a heads-up and go ahead and put it in, this part that I'm talking about is the LAST thing you put a wrench on when you are under the car wrapping everything up, and all you have to do is bolt the chrome stick on, screw the **** on, sit in the car and see how it shifts. It's easier to mess with and figure out, and try either way, as you are installing it. Undo one nut. Turn the doohicky at the bottom of the stick around. Put the nut back on. Try it that way. Choose the one you like best, if you could even feel any difference.
I wish I'd done that when it was on the ramps - getting time to crawl back under a second time to hose around with it is much harder than noodling with it a little on the first time.
Ain't heard from Hurst yet anyways......
8/23/05, 05:41 PM
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UPDATE!.............
O.K. after about an hour and a half of "phone war" I got an answer... :bang: I had to go through about 4 people till I got one that sounded half way like they new what an 05 Mustang shifter even was.
Anyway, on to the solution. The pic in the instructions (page 2 figure 2) is misleading. The offset at the bottom of the shifter does go to the PASSENGER side as per the instalation instructions. The gentlemen did say it would work either way ( ) but the offset to the passenger side is correct. That will put the serrations of the stick bottom (black part of stick with two bolt holes were the chrome stick bolt's on) also facing toword's the passenger side. Hurst will now be changing the pic in the new instruction's to better illustrate the correct offset position...
Now everyone go Hurst up your Pony's with some peace of mind.....
O.K. after about an hour and a half of "phone war" I got an answer... :bang: I had to go through about 4 people till I got one that sounded half way like they new what an 05 Mustang shifter even was.
Anyway, on to the solution. The pic in the instructions (page 2 figure 2) is misleading. The offset at the bottom of the shifter does go to the PASSENGER side as per the instalation instructions. The gentlemen did say it would work either way ( ) but the offset to the passenger side is correct. That will put the serrations of the stick bottom (black part of stick with two bolt holes were the chrome stick bolt's on) also facing toword's the passenger side. Hurst will now be changing the pic in the new instruction's to better illustrate the correct offset position...Now everyone go Hurst up your Pony's with some peace of mind.....
8/23/05, 06:29 PM
#19
Team Mustang Source
Good news! I was about ready to send it back and just put the Steeda bushings in my stock shifter and call it a day. Thanks for all the trouble shooting guys. That's what I love about this place. 