GM Said to Study Shedding Saab, Saturn, Pontiac
12/1/08, 01:02 AM
#41
Tasca Super Boss 429 Member
Interesting thing I just saw:
Mercury is selling less than 200,000 units a year, which is less than both Plymouth and Oldsmobile right before they were phased out.
Last edited by holderca1; 12/1/08 at 01:05 AM.
12/1/08, 08:21 AM
#42
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[quote=Red Star;5697294]Yeah, but why did those people pick A8 instead of Phaeton? Phaeton was cheaper and just as luxurious as A8 and Phaeton also had same engines as A8.
Cheaper? I don't think so! I VIVIDLY remember driving past the high-end VW dealer down in Feasterville, and seeing a brand new to the US VW Phaeton. I stopped and walked up to see it. It was $96,000!!
Yeah, they eventually sold it with a V8, as the original cars were W12s, but still. $96K for a VW is CRAZY! And this was back in the mid 2000s, when it 1st came out!
Cheaper? I don't think so! I VIVIDLY remember driving past the high-end VW dealer down in Feasterville, and seeing a brand new to the US VW Phaeton. I stopped and walked up to see it. It was $96,000!!
Yeah, they eventually sold it with a V8, as the original cars were W12s, but still. $96K for a VW is CRAZY! And this was back in the mid 2000s, when it 1st came out!
12/1/08, 12:05 PM
#43
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Cheaper? I don't think so! I VIVIDLY remember driving past the high-end VW dealer down in Feasterville, and seeing a brand new to the US VW Phaeton. I stopped and walked up to see it. It was $96,000!! Yeah, they eventually sold it with a V8, as the original cars were W12s, but still. $96K for a VW is CRAZY! And this was back in the mid 2000s, when it 1st came out!
Yeah, they eventually sold it with a V8, as the original cars were W12s, but still. $96K for a VW is CRAZY! And this was back in the mid 2000s, when it 1st came out!
12/1/08, 03:00 PM
#44
Shelby GT500 Member
Yes I said from the beginning they wouldn't sell that thing to anyone. 100K for anything even resembling having a VW badge on it is rediculous. How many people with the cash to buy a 100k vehicle are shopping the VW store?
None. Zero. Nada.
Audi on the other hand...plenty.
12/1/08, 03:49 PM
#45
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That's exactly my point.
Even though there are Volkswagens just as good as Audis (check new Touareg) people do not want to spend extra money on them simply because they're Volkswagens.
And same thing will happen to Ford if they kill Mercury.
Even though there are Volkswagens just as good as Audis (check new Touareg) people do not want to spend extra money on them simply because they're Volkswagens.
And same thing will happen to Ford if they kill Mercury.
12/1/08, 04:13 PM
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No it won't, and here is why. The difference between prices on the Fords and Mercury models are pretty darn close. There is a gap, and its probably aroudn $1,500 for example. On the other hand, who in their right mind thought it would be good to sell a almost $100,000 VW! That car was pretty much triple the average price on a loaded Passat at the time. We have people come in all the time, who ask the difference between the Fusion and Milan. I tell them, its the badging, bumpers, and seat trim. And they ask "is that it for the extra money". You know what they say afterwards? I'll buy the Fusion and save some $$$. True events, as I see it ALL THE TIME!! In my region, I see very few Milans, and only a few Mariners around, but I see TONS of Escapes and Fusions. People aren't buying the hype of Mercury being an upscale brand anymore. Especially since CR and the other auto websites/publications have said Ford's quality and styling are on par or above the japanese. People are coming back to Ford and thats what needs to happen. Not sell cars from a brand that is on life-support (200,000 units a year IS life-support). Some dealer groups sell more than this.
Last edited by 05fordgt; 12/1/08 at 04:15 PM.
12/1/08, 04:28 PM
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12/1/08, 04:34 PM
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No they wouldn't. Scion doesn't look ANYTHING like a current Toyota. Totally different car. Not like a bumper change between a Fusion and Milan. Apples to Oranges again.
And I don't get your Subaru referrence?
And I don't get your Subaru referrence?
12/1/08, 07:19 PM
#52
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No it won't. Cause TRULY upscale buyers aren't fooled by a different grille and some trim bits. They're going to be buying MUCH better cars than either Ford OR Mercury (or even Lincoln, if I'm honest).
12/1/08, 07:21 PM
#53
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And if he decides to keep it, it will be to offer Mercurys that are GENUINELY different from Fords, not just some front and rear rhinoplasty and contrasting seat stitching. 
Last edited by Hollywood_North GT; 12/1/08 at 07:22 PM.
12/1/08, 08:52 PM
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I can honestly see them bringing some of the Euro Fords over here and selling them under the Mercury brand.
Okay, maybe not honestly. But I'd sure like to see them try it.
Okay, maybe not honestly. But I'd sure like to see them try it.
12/1/08, 08:56 PM
#56
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After Fiesta and Focus arrive in the USA, only Euro Fords left are Ka and Mondeo.
And I don't think Americans would like European "larger" Fords.
I mean, take this C-Max for an example. Mazda 5 failed in the USA, I don't see why C-Max would be a success.
And I don't think Americans would like European "larger" Fords.
I mean, take this C-Max for an example. Mazda 5 failed in the USA, I don't see why C-Max would be a success.
12/1/08, 11:34 PM
#57
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Mazda5 may not be setting records, but it's not a failure. Given that a trend to more compact vehicles IS apparent across the market, a Merc-branded C-Max with reasonable sales goals is attainable. If they're already going to manufacture the platform over here, might as well put out as many products based off it as the market can handle and make some cash.
12/2/08, 06:43 AM
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They should kill it, just like GM did Oldsmobile. I mean that cost GM $1.5 billion, do you really think Ford has a couple billion to burn to kill something that (I think) turns a profit?
That combined with the circular logic of stating Mercury shouldn't get any compelling or unique product because they don't have any compelling or unique product is mind boggling. You have to be willing to give Mercury something in order to fix it, and if you're not, the problem isn't with the brand. And yeah, sometimes you need to give Mercury something that Ford doesn't have, even if the dealers whine and cry about it. Hell, GM is a case study in why listening to your dealer network too much is a horrible, horrible idea.
That combined with the circular logic of stating Mercury shouldn't get any compelling or unique product because they don't have any compelling or unique product is mind boggling. You have to be willing to give Mercury something in order to fix it, and if you're not, the problem isn't with the brand. And yeah, sometimes you need to give Mercury something that Ford doesn't have, even if the dealers whine and cry about it. Hell, GM is a case study in why listening to your dealer network too much is a horrible, horrible idea.
Last edited by Q`res; 12/2/08 at 02:02 PM.
12/2/08, 12:11 PM
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mercury is dead the only reason its being dragged out is their hoping the vast majority of dealerships roll over or get sick of the lack of anything new and pull out on their own this way the cost to ford when they actually do kill it is far less then what GM had to swallow on olds.... brilliant in my opinion. As for Lincoln I believe it is succesful as a luxury I would definately buy one of these over an infiniti and place it in a dead heat with anything caddy has to offer... However I must admit I would probably take a mercedes or audi over any of these. Personlly though I am not a very big bmw fan...