1) They read these forums anyways, so maybe we'd get lucky and they might answer.
2) They don't care about aftermarket tunes, their job is to program their own stuff and be done with it.

 

Didn't Ford say it changes like 600 parameters on the car?
That seems like an awful lot to "change" on a car, not sure how there is that many parameters to change.
I know of the loppy idle cam adjustment, probably steering quickness, throttle response, MAYBE rev limiter raised by 100 rpms or something, removing traction control nannies, and possibly changing some fan settings and so forth, but I don't see where there is 50 things to change much less 600.
And I agree, it would be nice if it did have a small (like 10 hp) increase in power too, anything more would probably require a true CAI system, but who knows.

See if Ford will explain to you what EXACTLY the track key changes.

But as I said, if I was going to mod aftermarket and tune the car, I'd pass on the TK and just do everything I wanted via the aftermarket tune.

 

One thing you may notice after some extensive reading here (in this forum specifically) is that performance isn't always measured in horsepower gains alone. Yes, it's true that since the release of TK, Ford really hasn't offered up a list of parameters that are altered. At the same time though, many here would agree that you mod money would be better spent on driving lessons and/or track time. The true benefit of TK's alterations may not show on a dyno graph, but rather on a time slip.


I for one, would be willing to turn over my BOSS to a tuner like SCT, etc, for the 15 months I'll be overseas, in hopes that they
could crack TK and allow it to be modified in the same ways a stock tune could, to allow for modifications.

 

Here's what TrackKey changes and adds..........

Whenever the TracKey is used to start the vehicle, many engine control characteristics are changed to be more suitable for track use. These include:

· Ignition timing
· Twin Independent Variable Cam Timing (TiVCT)
· Wide-Open Throttle fueling
· Engine braking
· Accelerator pedal map
· Idle speed
· Throttle response
· Cooling fan activation temps
· Skip-shift disable

In addition, the following features are unique to TracKey:

· Driver adjustable Launch Control, or "2-step engine speed limiting"
· Driver adjustable Pit Lane Speed Control
· Lopey idle

 

Given the hundreds of hours of programming the Ford engineers put into this on and off the clock, good luck getting an after-market tuner to do all that. Sure they can tune a HP bump for you (at the expense of engine longevity), but you won't get all the precision that went into tuning it for road racing. If you're just going to drag race the car and pull it through four gears for 10-12 seconds, an after-market tune might be what you want. If you're going to torture the car on extended 20-30 minute road course sessions in crushing heat over and over and over again, good luck keeping the engine alive for several years.

 

Exactly.

All I want is a TK tune for offroad pipes, as I'm very pleased with the TK calibration itself. I don't want to deal with cat failure when the car becomes a dedicated track thrasher.

Maybe I can just talk someone from FRPP into sending me a 302S PCM if this is such a big deal.

 

You might say that historically a good part of our business has been in tuning... but with that said, I don't know if I would want anything but Ford's tune in the car when I am at the track driving "***** to the wall". Perhaps oversimplifying, but in a normally aspirated car the aftermarket tuning is eeking out HP from additional timing and potentially adding fuel if other mods (like exhaust) are done. Let's look at both of those: At the track - with RPMS and engine load frequently at max or near max - do I really want more timing in the car than what Ford thinks is reasonable? No. Regarding fuel, with the widebands on each bank, the Boss is already demonstrating an amazing ability to adapt to headers/exhaust mods. NO ONE does smoother, more consistent fuel curves than the OEM. So, if timing is set to near-ideal levels and A/F's are "on" because of good programming and feedback from the widebands.... it sure DOESN'T seem that there's anything on the table for a custom tune.

 

I'm with Kendal on this one. Why argue with engineers who do this for a living?
Believe me, the Boss team is bunch of hard core track guys!

 

I know I am the new guy here, but how would the car/computer know if a CAI/ exhaust was installed ? Would'nt the changes in air flow/temp, rich/lean be detected and just simply adjusted for, instead of going through a bunch of 1's and 0's to decide if it suspects an aftermarket part install ?

 

Equipped with Wideband sensors - and not just O2 sensors, the computer is monitoring air/fuel ratios very precisely and adjusting injector pulses to keep A/F's spot on.

 

Exactly my thinking.....as much passing gets done at the end of a straightaway as is done in the middle by horsepower alone....im concentrating more on stopping power than horsepower. This car has plenty of power for what it is....and hooks up beautifully...Drag racing is another story, those guys are and will never be satisfied with HP numbers....even if it makes the car undrivable for anthing but straight line runs.

 

While I sort of agree with this and I know you have a whole lot more experience with this kind of thing than I do Kendall. My experiences from the BMW and Subaru world showed no discernible differences in longevity in cars that had been tuned by reputable people on cars with conservative mods when being used on track extensively. In fact, the newer WRX's and STI's had some pretty lean A/F ratios from the factory that were considered to be unsafe by pretty much everyone.

Having said all of that, keep in mind I have all of three months of experience with Mustangs, it seems that the Mustang community is lightyears behind the European and Japanese car scenes when it comes to tuning. In my Subaru, I could buy a $100 usb OBDII cord, download open ECU for free (software written by enthusiasts), and install a wide band and start tuning and data logging. This is awesome in that there are tons of experienced DIY tuners who know what they were doing and would kill any BS that some companies like to spew at times. In the BMW world, most of the tuners are road racers and own shops to support their race teams and the same thing can be said about the big names in the Subaru world. I think this is a big part of the reason the tuning scene seems so much better than what I have been seeing in the Mustang world.

I will use the whole intake and tune trend that is so popular with the new 5.0's. From what I have seen, these companies are claiming 25 to 35 WHP from an intake and tune and the dyno results tend to support this. The problem I have with this push for an intake and tune is that I have seen cars with just a tune make very similar numbers. I just suspect that 95% of gains seen with the intake and tune are from the tune and they just want you to buy the $200 to $300 intake. They also seem to ignore the higher IATs you will seen in daily driving from these "cold air intakes."

I am even more suspicious of these intakes and there "big gains" because I have not seen an after market intake that made any measurable amount of horsepower in any of the newer cars I have followed or owned with the exception of the $3k plus intake on the E46 m3 that eliminated the MAF sensor and required a special tune and even then all of the tuners that new how to tune in Alpha N mode said they could make very close power using the stock air box. If I remember correctly, you said that one of the Ford engineers laughed at the companies pushing intakes for the Boss saying that the only place they really left power was in long tubes.

I will end my rant here. Forgive me of typos, I just got off a twelve hour shift and it is my bed time.

 

This is wrong in so many ways, where do you start to dismantle this comment? Light years behind?

 

I'm surprised I was able to spin my neandrethal American hunk of steel past all those M3s, Cayman Ss and even several GT3s last year........on the lowly black key at that.

 

I'm working on a DIY tune for you. Should be ready in an hour.

 

The question here is, was it the car, the driver, or the combination that made the difference?

 

It's always a package deal, isn't it? But unless you have a silly mismatch, it's going to be the driver. Every time I pass a better car (like the Audi R8 GT last Sunday), or even a slightly slower car, I ask myself could I have passed that car if Hans Stuck was driving? Answer - no. Keep practicing.

Jimmy

 

Good answer.

 

Analysis: When bad factory tunes are corrected with good aftermarket tunes, the life of the car is not shortened.

Conclusion: Agree (though it's a daring glimpse of the obvious and I'm not sure of the relevance).

Analysis: I just worked a 12 hour shift and smoked some crack in the parking lot with my pals, before making this post.

Conclusion: Agree. Crack is whack.

Analysis: The last nth degree (5%) of performance is typically expensive.

Conclusion: Agree

Analysis: Ford engineers not asked to be on SVT (where they use cold air intakes on their GT500), can come across as a little snarky and know-it-ally.

Conclusion: Agree

It took a bit of time to get through, but in the end was mostly reasonable...well, except for that one part. Wow.

Jimmy

 

Light years is a bit of an over statement and I said I have limited experience with Mustangs. Just outside of the Boss specific forums, I have found a lot of the information out there on these cars to be generally suspect. Maybe the tuning isn't behind but it sure seems like it from what I have seen. Maybe it is the lack of specific data and information on tunes that is out there for everyone to see. I can post data logs on the Subaru forums and get numerous experienced tuners to help me adjust my tune to make it safe and get the most out of it at the same time. They can tell me what the parameters do, and what to adjust and why.

Go spend a couple of hours on NASIOC or the m3forum.net. For car communities that are both smaller than the Mustang communities, they have 20 times the amount of useful information.

Now come on Gary, I was cross shopping Cayman Ss, new M3s, used 996 Turbos and C6 vettes. I picked the "neandrethal American hunk of steel." I have no car bias what so ever. I buy what I like best that I can afford and you an I both know there is way more to buying a car for the fastest lap times, I buy for mostly the experience the car gives and what can work for my lifestyle. If I wanted fastest lap times, I would have bought a used C6 Z06.