Dyno: Stock 2012 Boss 302 406whp
10/1/11, 07:57 PM
#21
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i have also seen 2 different dynos with the same car put down 30-40 difference in HP
mine was done with SAE..... and smoothing 3 if it makes a diff to anyone when i hit 401 with the JLT intake on,
on the other hand i couldnt give a crap what it hits on a dyno i wan 12.5 in the quarter BONE stock..... cant wait to see what it does on drag radials and with the new tune and some mufflers
mine was done with SAE..... and smoothing 3 if it makes a diff to anyone when i hit 401 with the JLT intake on,
on the other hand i couldnt give a crap what it hits on a dyno i wan 12.5 in the quarter BONE stock..... cant wait to see what it does on drag radials and with the new tune and some mufflers
10/7/11, 11:44 AM
#23
Here's mine...
Weather cooled off a bit here in AZ this week, took her in to get a baseline dyno.
2550 miles on the car now.
Mods: K&N filter, Roush Mufflers, Open sidepipes.
Run 2 (Red Line)is the K&N.
Run 4 (Blue Line) is the Stock Paper Filter.
Not much difference, K&N might have a slight advantage from 5000rpm to 6800 or so.
Weather cooled off a bit here in AZ this week, took her in to get a baseline dyno.
2550 miles on the car now.
Mods: K&N filter, Roush Mufflers, Open sidepipes.
Run 2 (Red Line)is the K&N.
Run 4 (Blue Line) is the Stock Paper Filter.
Not much difference, K&N might have a slight advantage from 5000rpm to 6800 or so.
10/7/11, 03:58 PM
#24
Tasca Super Boss 429 Member
Very Nice
10/8/11, 10:42 AM
#27
10/9/11, 11:49 AM
#28
Cobra Member
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Run 2 (Red Line)is the K&N.
Run 4 (Blue Line) is the Stock Paper Filter.
Not much difference, K&N might have a slight advantage from 5000rpm to 6800 or so.
Now thats how you track your changes in engine mods. Great job! Keep us posted on any other progress.
Last edited by boss man; 10/9/11 at 11:51 AM.
10/10/11, 06:38 PM
#29
Bullitt Member
I agree with Boss Man and Gary, very nice run and good "relative" data.
This is the most effective way to really see what a single modification does for power and torque.
Although caution should be used with this observation, it appears about a 10% loss in power from engine output (billed by Ford as 444 hp) to a rear wheel rating of the dyno of 401 hp. This is certainly reasonable but with all the caveats that go along with using the actual peak power the dyno displays (ambient temperature, ambient humidity, fuel temp, engine heat soak, SAE corrections, smoothing functions, type of dyno, etc, etc). Change in power due to a modification on the same dyno as close in time to the baseline run is always much more accurate as all the above noted factors become inconsequential because they are in both runs and thus cancel.
As to the octane fuel run, he confirmed 91 which is what would be expected for this power output. With the "black" key, 93 octane (or higher) would not have made any more power but 87 octane would have certainly made less as the the engine ECU would have pulled spark advance if the detonation sensors in the engine (2) detected this undesireable condition (likely). Trackkey though (if this feature is still in the software build which was "certified") has significantly different octane logic.
This is the most effective way to really see what a single modification does for power and torque.
Although caution should be used with this observation, it appears about a 10% loss in power from engine output (billed by Ford as 444 hp) to a rear wheel rating of the dyno of 401 hp. This is certainly reasonable but with all the caveats that go along with using the actual peak power the dyno displays (ambient temperature, ambient humidity, fuel temp, engine heat soak, SAE corrections, smoothing functions, type of dyno, etc, etc). Change in power due to a modification on the same dyno as close in time to the baseline run is always much more accurate as all the above noted factors become inconsequential because they are in both runs and thus cancel.
As to the octane fuel run, he confirmed 91 which is what would be expected for this power output. With the "black" key, 93 octane (or higher) would not have made any more power but 87 octane would have certainly made less as the the engine ECU would have pulled spark advance if the detonation sensors in the engine (2) detected this undesireable condition (likely). Trackkey though (if this feature is still in the software build which was "certified") has significantly different octane logic.
Last edited by P0 Corsa; 10/10/11 at 06:58 PM.
10/12/11, 07:31 AM
#31
Bullitt Member
Because the standard Boss tune ("black key" engine management software OE in all our cars) was developed using 91 octane fuel. In some states this is the highest octane available. In my state 93 octane is available but the spark advance built into the tune will not go any higher than what Ford developed while certifying the engine for the lower 91 fuel. Thus maximum programmed (available spark advance) is achieved using 91 octane fuel and the engine will deliver the 444 hp advertised rating. Since spark advance has peaked using 91 fuel, higher octane rated fuels prove no benefit.
Since you "can" run this 5.0 on 87 octane fuel as well, under heavy load conditions which might promote detonation, the engine knock sensors will signal the ECU to retard timing to protect the engine and less power will be produced.
Since you "can" run this 5.0 on 87 octane fuel as well, under heavy load conditions which might promote detonation, the engine knock sensors will signal the ECU to retard timing to protect the engine and less power will be produced.
10/12/11, 07:51 AM
#32
Originally Posted by P0 Corsa
Because the standard Boss tune ("black key" engine management software OE in all our cars) was developed using 91 octane fuel. In some states this is the highest octane available. In my state 93 octane is available but the spark advance built into the tune will not go any higher than what Ford developed while certifying the engine for the lower 91 fuel. Thus maximum programmed (available spark advance) is achieved using 91 octane fuel and the engine will deliver the 444 hp advertised rating. Since spark advance has peaked using 91 fuel, higher octane rated fuels prove no benefit.
Since you "can" run this 5.0 on 87 octane fuel as well, under heavy load conditions which might promote detonation, the engine knock sensors will signal the ECU to retard timing to protect the engine and less power will be produced.
Since you "can" run this 5.0 on 87 octane fuel as well, under heavy load conditions which might promote detonation, the engine knock sensors will signal the ECU to retard timing to protect the engine and less power will be produced.
10/12/11, 09:02 AM
#33
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10/12/11, 09:41 AM
#34
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10/12/11, 09:49 AM
#35
When I go back for the TK dyno comparison, I'll take a 5-gallon jug of 100 and splash the tank after a few of the 91 pulls to see if TK will do anything extra.
10/12/11, 09:59 AM
#37
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10/12/11, 11:02 AM
#38
Bullitt Member
In a word, yes. But usually states offer either 91 or 93 octane as the "premium" gasoline grade. I have yet to see both these octane grades available at the same time at the same gas station. But you see when Ford calibrates and certifies an engine for consumer use, they have to do so with the lowest grade fuel available in all states.
Rick, yes it will, or was suppose to. I do not know what software features (if any to be fair) were altered to achieve ultimate CARB certification. At my spring time discussion with those who know what is in the software logic, it was presented to me that TK would advance engine spark to take advantage of fuels with octane ratings up to 100. But I have posted this information several times before in other threads.
10/12/11, 12:20 PM
#39
Originally Posted by P0 Corsa
But usually states offer either 91 or 93 octane as the "premium" gasoline grade. I have yet to see both these octane grades available at the same time at the same gas station. But you see when Ford calibrates and certifies an engine for consumer use, they have to do so with the lowest grade fuel available in all states
10/12/11, 12:58 PM
#40
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You are correct. I run 92 and 93 here because they are priced the same as 91, but as Bill stated, not at the same station. Different stations choose 91, 92 or 93 in our state as their premium.