laserred38

Lol not replacing rear speakers does not make it a half a$$ job.

For kicks, I swapped out my Escape rear speakers with Alpine 5x7s. I have the top of the line Hertz Mille 3-ways on my front stage with 3"/1" separates on the pillars, amped by an Audison LRx5.k. The rears are so useless it's comical. You can't hear them, even though they're only amped by my Alpine CDA-9835 (26w a channel, RMS). It was a waste of time taking the rear door panels off. Again, do what you like. Your money is better spent on better front speakers and not doing the rears. *Or* spend the same on the fronts, skip the rears, and spend the rest on sound deadening materials (CCF, MLV and the dampening tiles).

And while we're on that subject, completely covering your interior and door panels with the peel and stick tiles is completely unnecessary, a waste of money and just adds weight. You only need to put strips on the flat panels that will resonate. The peel and stick does not block sound. It just dampens vibrations. The closed cell foam (CCF) and mass-loaded vinyl (MLV) are what actually absorb the outside sound and keep the music in.

laserred38

Btw, just because most people think a full audio system requires rear speakers, doesn't mean it's right. If everyone jumped off a bridge, would you do it too?

Mustang Freak

Personally I can't stand the music biased towards the front I need to have the sound behind me. Even with stock systems I always bias to the back.

laserred38

And that's why 99.9% of car stereos have rear speakers. Because most people (especially of the two generations before me) are of this train of thought.

My point is, you shouldn't actually hear where the speakers are anyways. You should just hear the music, and be able to pick out each instrument and/or singer. That only matters if you're listening to actual music that is produced by singers and instruments though...

Mustang Freak

I like the music to hit me pretty much from all around but I don't like it hitting me in the face. So I tend to have it slightly rear biased. So in that application I definitely need good rear speakers as well. I'd never be able to ignore them they would be my first swap before any other speakers. :-)

laserred38

All I can say is, you have to hear a properly tuned system with good quality speakers. Some like a more mellow laid back sound, of which my Hertz tend to be actually, with silk done tweeters. Focals tend to be more bright, which some ears will hear as "harsh," but it really depends on what kind of music you listen to. Loud doesn't mean better. That's why I actually have my stock bass and treble turned down. Whatever the frequency ranges that the "bass" and "treble" options are adjusting, ends up creating peaks in the frequency response. That's why the bass will make the door panel rattle when the rest of the sound isn't at the same level. If you lower the stock bass and treble, it allows you to turn the master volume higher, which in turn allows you to hear more details of the music. Most people's tendency is to raise the bass and treble to levels they think appropriate - no one thinks to try and lower the settings, then test at a volume that they actually listen at!

Mustang Freak

True but I ain't gonna gear it from the front! It is an instant headache maker for me! :-)

laserred38

You should come hear my Escape. Bet you don't get a headache

2k7gtcs

Just give me a pair of Pioneer 6x9s in the rear and I'm all good.


And an active EQ with THD less than 9%


Lol

Mustang Freak

I would love to hear a good sound system! Back in my young and foolish days when I had more money than common sense I spent 5k on my sound system. That was a crystal clear and loud as I wanted it system. Probably why my hearing isn't the best anymore!

SteelTownStang

Not sure what your BTW means... I'm a proponent of rear speakers, especially if tuned properly. A "full" audio system would definitely include rear speakers, especially in a Mustang. That is, if you want it to sound good. Don't worry, I doubt anyone will be following you off a bridge.

Without getting too deep with the physics of sound- speakers create alternating positive and negative air pressure. That's what sound is... When a high or low sustained musical note comes through a speaker the sound hits your ears at different times because one ear is closer to the source of the sound.

If your brain can't tell where the sound is coming from then the sound must be hitting both ears at the same time, or and the sound must be coming from directly in front of you or directly behind you at the same time.

A cabin of a vehicle poses many challenges to sound engineers due to the various angles, as well as interior material (some sound reflective and some sound absorbent), including plastic, leather, metal, glass, carpet, etc. Additionally, the driver, as well as passenger(s), are not centered... and yes, people also affect soundwaves.

Essentially, in varying degrees, high frequencies are directional and low frequencies are non-directional. A low frequency most applicable to music is between 20Hz and 150Hz, and that is the very bottom of the range of human hearing. Bass directly vibrates your eardrums and sound appears to arrive at both ears simultaneously.

The legacy Shaker system has overbearing bass that floods the cabin with sound, which can be deceptive. It can also be loud, but loud does not necessarily mean good. To compound the system's deficiencies, high frequencies are not sent to the rear speakers, which intensifies the muddled tone(s).

As you suggest, turn down the bass, but now the high frequency soundwaves are hitting you in the face with no acoustical balance, which is not the answer. You suggest/pretend that there is no space behind the front seats so rear speakers are not necessary. Also, not the answer.

Another flaw of the Shaker system is poor speaker placement. If you had ears in your knees it "might" sound OK. This is why rear speakers are necessary to compensate for the imbalance and create a pesudo-suitable sound stage, which was unfortunately deemed acceptable for mass production.

So, the lagacy Shaker has inferior components, poor calibration, and bad speaker placement. As such, replacing the speakers (all of them) help, adding crossovers and amps help a little more... and obviouly replacing the HU would greatly help, but most people, including myself, perfer the OEM look in a cabin of a newer vehicle- not to mention that they are also integrated with other peripherals and its replacement is generally not feasible.

I'm hoping that none of the aforementioned remedies will be necessary for the S550 Shaker Pro... but if so, attention will definitely be afforded to the rear speakers.

I hope you can swim...

P.S. Typing on an iPad and this is way too long... and off topic. Still seeking S550 stereo reviews... Thanks

laserred38

I don't want to quote your reply to make the thread longer, but if you reread my posts, we are in agreement on a LOT of your points here. I didn't say they were completely unnecessary. I said a lot of times they may not be needed - especially if they're tuned for "rear fill." I've only done one system where I've removed them altogether, and that was more so to let more bass into the cabin. If you go to an IASCA SQ completion, there will be a wide variety of setups, some with rear fill and some without.

Placement helps, because it's easier to tune when you have good placement to start with, but having the woofers in the doors isn't as bad as it can be. SN95s had much worse placement, and I ran a simple two way setup with the mids in the doors and tweeters on the kick panels in my 2000 V6. The soundstage was still right on my dash and my trusty 9835 handled the 3-way crossovers, EQ and tike alignment (which for me, is one of THE most crucial aspects of properly tuning a system).

I listened to the Shaker 1000 equivalent in a 2015 GT today at the car show. The tweeters on the A-pillars did bring the sound stage up nicely, there was a very well centered image, and pretty decent frequency response. I'd still rip out the 3-way setup, but I'd use the stock locations and just put better stuff in there with an Audison bit8.9 running it all active.

I'd leave the rears alone and run them off the factory head unit though :P

laserred38

Btw = by the way. And btw, turning down the bass IS a bandaid on the Shakee system. That's because Ford has tried to make the 8s in the doors play well into sub bass frequencies, that they did not design the doors to handle (not to mention the woofers really falls on their faces when asked to play less than 50-60hz).

I have some 8" Hertz HX mids waiting for the rest of my system, and they will be crossed as proper midbass, which provides that "punch" that a lot of systems are missing. If you ask your speakers to play too much of a range, they will most likely not do anything well, and end up sounding mediocre across the whole range - which is exactly how the stock Shaker systems have been. You can either add a bunch of mediocre speakers to play multiple ranges, with a ton of software to correct for the imbalances and make them all play nice with each other (all the high end "luxury car" systems these days with 21 speakers and Dolby processing this, 5.1 surround sound that), or you can have a nice simple 2-3 way front stage of high quality speakers, with the "just right" amount of tuning, that doesn't get overly complicated.

The pillars on the S197s are a terrible starting point for a tweeter pod, so I had originally planned on doing a super simple 2-way horn + 8" mid setup, but scrapped the idea when I realized my meth head cousin stole my 1 of 5 prototype sets ever made Image Dynamics 8" mids from my uncle's house, where he was letting me store some stuff. I picked up the Hertz mids used off a guy that was running a 4-way front stage (no rear speakers...). I'll probably be pairing them with the 3" Mille components from my Escape, and I'll put some cheaper tweeters in there, since that's now the baby mobile and my fiancé doesn't care about sound like I do.

SteelTownStang

^^^This is what I was hoping for... Thanks

laserred38

Imo it is definitely a notch above the Shaker stuff in the S197s, but it's still not world class. That said, it's a good starting point. I think I'd probably start with replacement tweeters in the factory locations and go from there.

Tony Alonso

My "non-audiophile" of the 9-speaker Shaker system in the GT Premium -

SHAKER 9-SPEAKER SOUND SYSTEM PERFORMANCE
I preface my comments with these provisos -
1) my hearing is somewhat dulled from years of loud 80s music in my college years
2) my sensitivity to some of the clarity that audiophiles can easily detect is somewhat suspect because of number one
3) I listen to A LOT of satellite radio

Compared to my 2010 car, I'd say that the new Shaker system's sound is clearer. I can hear the high and midrange performance better. I will say that the base response seems similar, although the 2010's Shaker has a bit more boominess, which I like because of my dulled hearing!

I've listened to FM stations, satelllite radio stations, and MP3 files from a Bluetooth-connected Android phone. Of all those sources, I like the sound of the MP3 files better than what I heard in my 2010. The FM stations sound similar to me, and the satellite radio sounded better to me in the 2010. This is most likely because of the better high and midrange sounds in the new car, some of the base boominess of the 2010 is gone, which again I like because of my hearing sensitivity.

I think an audiophile with better hearing than mine would have different judgments.

Overall, I definitely think the new 9-speaker system is a step up from the 2010 version. Of course, since I heard the Shaker Pro in Zombie's car, I can definitely say that power and volume of that system is a BIG difference from the one in my car. I actually would have considered that system had it come as a separate option. I do like my trunk space maximized though.

SteelTownStang

Thanks Tony. Nice review

Cavero

FWIW, I think Sirius is sounding worse lately. Their stations, especially rock, sound compressed and muddy. I think I get better clarity from an FM station. This is in my Focus, but a lot of the people I work with that have Hondas and toyotas say the same thing.

Storm75

I agree completely - thought it was just my bad hearing!

stam616

Question- I'm getting the V6 with 051A pkg early next year. It comes with the base stereo system and six speakers. I'm wondering without getting rid of that which is not an option, could I eventually upgrade the speakers and perhaps add more power? Could I also add Satellite Radio? I' don't want to get rid of the unit because I want the Sync and steering wheel controls to work but I'd like to get clearer sound and more power out of this system if it's possible- thoughts??