97GT03SVT

Any word on how long the GT500 will be produced? Maybe it's just me but I think that with the Challenger, Camaro and Mustang restyle all coming fairly soon, perhaps ADMs will disapear sooner than later. Chances are the next gen SVT 10' Mustang is gonna be superior to the current GT500 and make it possible to score either a new 09' (if they make them that long) or a low mileage 07-08 at a reasonible price...

1 COBRA

More than likely. Today's top dogs will be tomorrow's old news.

JonW

I found a post from Amy B on another forum: Guys, Carroll Contract for Gt-500 is very long term, well into the next body style.

That is definitely good news!

97GT03SVT

Is that good news? I prefer the "SVT Cobra" name. Plus, how much is added to the MSRP with a "Shelby" badge on the trunk lid? My personal issue is that I want an S197 Mustang but don't want a GT, Shelby GT or Bullitt. I want something with about the same or better performance as my current 03' Cobra but I personally can't justify paying an ADM on a GT500 or for any other vehical. I'm gonna wait for the next gen stang and see what the next SVT does and the price for it. If I can find a GT500 used with under 10k on it for a good price i'll buy one if not I might end up buying a vette or see what kinda performance per dollar I can get with a Camaro or Challenger SE.

1 COBRA

What counts is the final assembly plant is Flat Rock not Las Vegas.

JonW

Well, if you want a Shelby, which I do, and you want to pay MSRP, which I do, that is good news. I don't disagree with you, Phil, on Shelby adding some $$$ to the cost. But I've wanted to buy a new Shelby Mustang since I was a teenager. And I finally have the chance.

97GT03SVT

I don't mean to play devil's advocate here but in my opinion the new GT500 is not a Shelby. Ford had begun developing the car way before Shelby rejoined Ford as the next gen SVT Cobra. Shelby really had little to no development in the current Shelby GT500 or even the Shelby GT which just has Ford performance parts(like the bullitt). The only real Shelbys in my opinion were the cars from 65-67. By 1968 Ford took over Shelby's development program and basically added his name to the car much like the current new gen Shelbys. Either way I love the look of the car but i'd rather have it called SVT Cobra but like you said we all have the right to our own opinions.

1 COBRA

Which happened to be code named Condor and never once mentioned by anyone related to Shelby Autos probably because no one there knew.

It's next to impossible to expect he would. His age, physical limitations, financial state of affairs, and lack of innovative ideas (or the opportunity to borrow someone else's ideas ) might have had something to do with it.
Well, well, well! Isn't that ironic?

I seem to remember raising the ire of a few fellow TMS members when I debated amyb with regards to the cues of the GT500 to be associated with the Ford produced 1968 GT500 rather than the Shelby's 1967 GT500 and the historical meaning it represented. Perhaps that is one of the reason why I am not one of her favorites.

Hollywood_North GT

You're right, George. You're a troublemaker...but you're right.

crazyhorse

You're not one of her favorites, George? Now that is a surprise.

97GT03SVT

I'm not 100% on this but I also think that Shelby was against the big block GT500s. From what I remember he felt that the car should be a lightweight autocross car like the original 65' model. by 66' Shelby's ideas were compromised by Ford by adding a backseat, radio etc....

I agree the 07' without a doubt pays homage to the 68' Model built by Ford! So I don't understand why people line up to kiss Shelby's a**!

In my personal opinion the 68' GT500KR is the best looking Mustang of all time, but it was a Ford car!

1 COBRA

Because it tastes just as good going down as coming up?

RCSignals

I thought Ford originally said it would have a 3 year run with 10,000 built over 3 years. Obviously they've already buillt more than that.

Five Oh Brian

I kept a copy of the contract we had to sign and send back to Ford to sell GT500's. The contract only specified GT500's for 2007 and 2008 only, but did mention that there would be SVT products beyond that. But, the contract was only for the 2007 and 2008 model years, with a fee of $1500 due to Ford to offset marketing costs. No production estimates were listed on the contract. However, Ford did plan to offer about 8K for 2007, then later bumped the estimate to 9K, then eventually produced more than 10K of them for 2007 as demand warranted more than originally anticipated.

The question now would be which products SVT will be offering for 2009 and beyond? Will they continue the GT500? Very likely! Or, could it be something different or in addition to the GT500? We're still waiting for an official announcement from Ford and/or SVT on the subject.

97GT03SVT

Is it just me or his the whole fate of SVT puzzling? First SVT was on pace for next gen Mustang, Lightning, Focus..suddenly the Mustang gets pushed back to 07' while the focus and lightning are canceled. Then there is news of an SVT Sport Trac to replace the heavy F-150 Lightning concept. Now the concept looks make it to production but the SVT tuning does not..... Reliable sources like Motor Trend and even Mustang magazines say SVT is on hold.nobody knows whos even running SVT anymore. Do the dealers in the Forum have any assurace that SVT still exsists? Will they be more than high performance parts? Is the Mustang the only SVT in the works in the Future? Will the Lightning ever return? Will cars like the Fusion, Sport Trac, Explorer, Taurus, Focus receive the SVT treatment?

1 COBRA

Unless Ford engineers figure out a way to improve fuel efficiency while maintaining a high level of performance why bring SVT back to give it the boot in a few years? I would be embarrassed, perhaps Ford wouldn't but that's beside the point.

I was hopeful a year ago but combining Ford's decisions, the energy bill, the market, and Ford's financial health made me reach the conclusion our beloved muscle car reincarnation era might not last as long as we thought it would.

jsaylor

George is touching on some important points. By all accounts SVT was never a money making outfit, and while some may claim that wasn't and/or shouldn't have been the point the upcoming CAFE standards increase combined with Ford's current cash strapped position ensure that it is a sticking point now. An ironic footnote here is that, despite the unpopularity of the return of the Shelby moniker on the latest SVT/SVE engineered Mustang with some of the SVT faithful, that Shelby moniker may end up being a large part of the reason an 'uber' Mustang continues in any form for the forseeable future.

First let me revisit some points I've made in the past. As best as I can surmise the msrp of the GT500 isn't likely that different from what it might have been without the Shelby badge affixed. That said, the Shelby moniker has certainly helped increase visability and demand for the car at that msrp which has led to a long and profitable production run without the need for rebates or self-imposed production limitations. Personally, I believe that the biggest portion of the demand for the GT500 is the very well received appearance of the car and the fact that this is more or less the best hi-po Mustang ever and not by a small margin. But again, the badging is certainly making a difference. We see this all over the automotive universe, Corvette's, Porsche's, BMW's Motorport division machines, and Ferrari's are all fantastic cars that sell on merit....but they get more than a little help from the monikers affixed to those cars as well.

Personally I don't find the Shelby badge out of place by any stretch and given a choice I do prefer it to the SVT moniker. (as many already know I was never a fan of the SVT marketing scheme preferring the older hi-po tags instead) That said, I would be just as interested in the car itself with either badge affixed and neither badge would change that or what I believe the car to be worth. I'm not certain we can say that about the market as a whole. If the GT500 were another flagship Mustang that made a splash and then had to move the last 5-10k units of a 20k unit production run with a 4k dollar rebate or more the case for continued production is, needless to say, going to be a little stiff given the current situation. The GT500 is easily going to best the market performance of any previous SVT engineered vehicle, and that is going to make a huge difference in how seriously Ford looks at trying to keep cars like this around in the upcoming, performance hostile environment.

To wit, even more important than what we want to buy is what Ford is willing to build. I've heard more than one person lament the reality that the Terminator was available with fairly serious rebates during it's second year on the market citing the Shelby moniker as a reason why this hasn't happened on this model. They may well be right. As hinted at above while this is great for the consumer in the short term it isn't what Ford wants to see short or long term and isn't good for the enthusiast in the long term because it doesn't do wonders for the business case of said product.

JonW

Some very good points there, jsaylor. I'm sure Ford saw the marketing value in badging the car as a Shelby. Although, it's interesting that the GT500s are still commanding a premium, while the Shelby-badged GTs are languishing on dealer lots. So that proves that, while the Shelby badging on the 500s has probably insured that there would be no incentives on the cars, it also shows that the car itself has made enough of an impact on it's own merits, that had it not been badged as a Shelby, it still would have sold well as an SVT.

For me, the Shelby badging was important. When I was 14 years old in 1969, I saw a white GT500 convertible, and I vowed that I would buy a Shelby Mustang someday. As you know, life doesn't always deal the cards you would like to have, and for various reasons it's taken me 38 years to fulfill that promise I made to myself. I now own a brand new 2008 Shelby GT500 convertible, and at MSRP. Would I have bought the same car if it was badged as an SVT? Maybe, but I probably would have just thrown a blower on my GT. Bad logic, perhaps, but sentiments some times have a way of overriding logic.

1 COBRA

Good points and observation by you and jsaylor.

Ford's marketing emphasis has placed more weight on the public's perceptions, personal image, and fantasy than the actual unique and unparalleled performance innovations of the most exceptional muscle car produced to date by any American auto manufacturer. I have to hand it to Ford. The concept of selling to the image minded and the performance oriented both out of the same package is nothing short of brilliance. Other comparable models are portrayed, promoted, and advertised one way or the other while the GT500 enjoys the luxury of both.

The GT500's unique design, engineering, and performance by itself can only appeal to a small and selected segment based on merit joining the likes of Z06, Viper, BMW's M series, and a few others. The opposing approach are the nostagia and/or name recognition driven factors which deliver the likes of modern Shelbys, Nissan's Z, Dodge Charger, and the ultimate fantasy, the Bullitt, targeting a less scrupulous and larger segment.

A new generation has taken over at Ford and SVT as it once was is sadly gone forever. There was a special personal feeling I had with the '04 Cobra lacking on the superior GT500 and I am unable to pin point it, sort of as an itch moving about one's body. I guess over all perception does have an impact whether it is wanted or not.

97GT03SVT

This is an intelligent conversation and i'm glad to see some insight on this whole situation. I think that a HUGE part of 04' Cobras selling at rebate is because many (myself included) decided to hold off for the next gen SVT that was thought to be availible just 6 months after the 05' launch. That being said I have a feeling that 09' GT500s will sell at rebate when spy shots and concepts of the next Mustang become availible, plus lets not forget that the Camaro and Challenger will both in well into producton by that point. I feel it's a pitty for Ford to tease us with promises of SVTs return (04' Lightning concept, SVT Sport Trac concept) then fail to deliver a product. My question is why did the GT500 take so **** long to come out? Corvette's Z06 was out only a year after the C6 launch, Dodge, Chysler, Jeep SRTs are usually availible at launch or within 6 months, the same can be said for Subaru STIs and Mitsu EVOs. I think Ford's hesitation to bring out SVTs kinda killed off a great deal of its recognition and may have played a role in its demise.