IRS provides a more comfortable and controlled ride, that's why it's needed. It also provides superior real world handling. Ford is the only manufacturer I know of that currently uses an SRA rear on a passenger car. The Challenger and Camaro both use IRS rears, so I am sure Ford will too in the near future.

 

Go drag race a Vette with your SRA Mustang and let us know what happens.

 

Your comparing two cars, one of which has over 100 more hp, and is probably atleast 300-400lb's lighter and calling that an argument for suspension.

 

Maybe most drivers who drive their Stangs competitively - a vast minority of owners to begin with - drag race their Stangs because the lack of a more broadly capable, read IRS, suspension pretty much limits them to that. The Vette reference may be read to indicate that a good IRS need not detract from strip performance. That many Cobra SVT owners swapped out their IRSs for live axle is probably more indicative of the rather cobbled and compromised nature of that particular design rather than stand as a broad indictment of IRSs in general.

If you don't "race" a Stang, then yes, an SRA can be made to ride very softly and comfortably, but that same level of cushiness will extract a far higher loss of handling capability from the SRA than what a IRS would be able to maintain. But making the bold presumption that Stang owners generally are a bit more interested in some, if not a race, level of performance (handling) capability, and drive on lumpy, bumpy, winding real world roads, then a good IRS will offer a significantly better rider, better suspension compliance (not to be confused with mere, wallowing cushiness) and thus maintain superior cornering capability and control over a far wider range of road conditions than an SRA with similar smooth test-track numbers.

The argument for an IRS is that the actual ride AND performance advantages would far better benefit real world Stang drivers over the exceedingly narrow advantage that an SRA has in the narrow confines of a drag strip -- basically instead of just offering either good ride or handling, the Stang would offer superior ride AND handling.

Of course, the obvious, to everyone but Ford, solution would be to offer both, perhaps with the live axle in base penny pincher models and as part of a "drag pack" option or Mach I model and/or the IRS as a "handling pack" option or Boss model.

Having such a range would I think give the Stang more credibility into a wider range of performance car buyers - by offering a good IRS - who now, rightly, tend to dismiss the Stang as a narrowly focused straight line blunderbuss, yet with the SRA availability, maintain the low price points and drag racing capability to more traditional Stang buyers. This would be a competitive advantage over the Camaro and Challenger and would be the type of "Bold" (is Ford still trotting out that marketing pap any more?) design and product more they disparately need these days.

 

Nope! they dropped it like a bad habit. The new marketing mistake is "Drive One".

Ford hopes to get Dealer buy in on this campaign to get broader coverage of their "Marketing".

 

I love it when people think that because they do something then everyone else does it too. Most people drive their mustangs on the road, not on the track. More then likely you drive your car on the road more then you do on the track. Barring the possibility that you have a track only car, of course, if that were the case then you really wouldn't care what ford is doing with the general mustang because you would undo all of it to get your car Track "ready".
Even if I take my stang to the track weekly, as I do in the spring and fall, I only log a few hours each week on the track. Compare that to the daily hour commute I have each way on good old Indiana roads. Dealing with the rear end of the car bouncing around like Pam Anderson, I would take an IRS any day. Even going over railroad tracks is a pain with the SRA bouncing around an losing traction.
The reality is that most people do NOT drag race their cars. Many of us would like to auto cross or drive our cars on tracks other then one that is perfectly straight. While the current SRA is leaps and bounds better then the SN95 version, and may in fact be better then the SN95 Cobra IRS, it would not out perform a car designed for and Equipped with IRS. Of course when I say outperform, I do not limit my argument so narrow as to say in a straight line. The SRA may continue to reign supreme when you want to drive for 10-15 seconds in a straight line. Outside of that argument the SRA quickly loses ground. I believe Rhumb postulated it best, with the potential SE SRA equipped car.
However, these are just my thoughts..

 

As soon as Ford makes a 475hp 3500 lbs V8 Mustang and backs it up with something like 295 or 305 rear tire, sure thing. It will go toe to toe with the vette no problem.

 

Despite evidence to the contrary, There are autocrossers here that have competitve class wining cars, and the Mustang has proven competitive in road racing against cars equipped with IRS on various levels.

While its true a good IRS is better than a well setup SRA, the gap in performance isn't as wide as folks make it out to be.

 

Ah, another IRS vs. Live Axle debate.

Ford should offer both a live axle and IRS as options; at least have the IRS available to "keep up with the Joneses" and quiet all the enthusiasts who feel they are too "sophisticated" for a live axle.

But quite frankly, people who are not "enthusiasts" who sit around comparing rear suspension designs on different manufacturers cars, really don't know or feel the difference between a well designed and sorted live axle and an IRS in normal driving. By normal driving I mean commuting, highway trips, puttering down to the mall or grocery store, etc. They really don't care either.

My wife is an example. She is pretty much the average consumer in her tastes. She has zero interest in cars other than she likes a good looking design and comfy interior and seats. She likes our Mustang for those attributes.

When comparing the ride of the Mustang on bumpy roads to my 240z or the Subaru she used to own, she says they are about the same and she can't really tell the difference. Both the 240z and Subaru have IRS.

But even in light of that, I do like IRS due to the "techiness" of it, all those arms and joints moving around back there....

And what's with all the put downs of drag racing? It makes you sound like a bunch of Euro Snobs.

It's as legitimate form of racing as driving around cones in a parking lot. Drag racing is probably the most popular amateur form of racing in the USA and one of the most accessible to the masses. Hmm, I guess those are the reasons why so many are down on it.

 

It depends which SRA Mustang you're talking about. The GT500 and the non-Z06 Corvette are pretty evenly matched, drag strip or road course

Otherwise, of course a $26K 3500lb 300hp Mustang GT is not going going to be close to 3200lb, 400hp, $50K Corvette. Could it be, I don't know.... simple physics?

 

If you are referring to GAC, it's a highly regulated series. No serious race car uses an SRA rear.

 

I don't know what test you are referring to. The C6 Vette smokes the GT500 on the road course and beats it on the dragstrip. That was with the LS2 too. With the LS3, the beating should be worse.

 

Not at all. I really enjoy Drag Racing, but the insistant and often narrow focus on it within the Mustang Community as an end all beat all performance measure has gotten too old. The concept that Ford needs to design the mustang a certain way because a small portion of overall customers want to drag race their vehicle, is not a good model for production.

My wife drives the ford freestyle. Like a subaru it is AWD and IRS. She always complains about how bouncy and "loose" the rear end feels when she drives my mustang. She now doesn't even like to drive it. It depends on the person. How are the roads in Oregon? I've only been there once. Here in the mid west (i travel within Indiana, Illinois, and Michigan often) the road are mine fields of pot holes and cracks, to which the SRA bounces around.

 

I guess the main argument alot of people are trying to make is that IRS is the new thing and SRA's are becoming really outdated, which I can agree with. But even with the the GT500/C6 comparison the Gt500 is like 600lb's heavier. I don't know. We'll see how the IRS does on the Camaro...that will give us a much better comparison.

 

IRS isn't even a new thing. It's been around since the 60's. Remember "My Cousin Vinny". The Pontiac Tempest had IRS in 1963. About the only things with SRA anymore are Trucks and Mustangs. That is my main point. Heck even many SUV's have gone to IRS.

I agree the real comparison will be with the Camaro and the Challenger.

 

Just some data on a better comparison.
03-04 mach 1 vs. 04 GTO
GTO sports a 40hp/30ftlbs advantage, but a 250 weight disadvantage.
GTO has a 6spd necessitating more shifts and a IRS
Mach has 5 spd and a SRA
Driver is a mustang accustomed editor from Muscle Mustangs and Fast Fords.

"With a couple of laps under my belt, I figured I could squeak a little more performance from the dynamic duo. Plus, a little powershifting was in order. For round two we boarded the GTO first and ripped off a much-improved 13.52 at 105.50 and then a 13.57 at 104.89 mph. This put the GTO in the lead, but not by much. Powershifting the Pontiac was easy, but the shifter did feel a bit vague.
Because of my position at MM&FF I felt the pressure to uphold the honor of the Mustang, however, in the name of fair and honest journalism, I'd be giving my all in both cars. Forget the way the story would turn out, I wanted to know which one was quicker and faster. Our readers deserve the truth. On my third pass in the Mustang I launched smoothly, nailed the gear changes and clicked off another 13.62 at 103, then backed it up with a 13.65 at 103.04. Close, but not close enough. The GTO was still in charge".

After that the GTO misteriously slows down and the Mach Misteriously speeds up. But either way the data shows tha the SRA did not prove a substantially more performing axle then the IRS of the GTO.

Full article is below.



http://www.musclemustangfastfords.co...gto/index.html

However, not definitive

I am going to finish my posts in fear of the moderators shutting this down. I guess we will see what Ford decides to do??

 

That sounds like the roads around here, especially after winter... They are pretty good about patching the potholes in the spring, though. It's still bumpy, but at least you won't bend a wheel falling into a pothole.

 

Speaking for myself only, though I suspect other share my thoughts, those of us who might wish for an IRS on a Stang (optionally or as an SE), don't want it for some sort of snobbish technical fashion statement but rather, because under the vast range of conditions, situations, it simply works better, goes faster and does so more safely at that. True, the SRA works wonderfully ... for a live axle design. And it may be "good enough," but that reeks of meeting low expectations as the same might be said of drum brakes and 100hp motors.

I certainly have nothing against drag racing per se, it is an excellent measure of a very specific component of a car's performance envelope after all. But it is only that, an mere thin slice of a car's overall performance cake and hardly one I would want to so narrowly compromise the rest of my car's real world performance capability around.

But of course, this poor horse has been drubbed before. What will change shortly is that now a lot of very hungry sharks soon to be dropped into the Mustang's comfortably little pond. In short order, the comparison tests will appear and presumably they will for the most part dare to venture afield of the artificial confines of test and race tracks into the hurly burly of real world driving to expose these heretofore academic musings to the cold hard light of real comparisons. Will the Stang's SRA not only orbit about a smooth skidpad as well as a Camaro or Challenger - a fairly easy feat relatively speaking -- but will it also stick to and put down the power on a back road romp or get bucked into humility by more adept newcomers?

Speculation and bench racing will soon have to bow to hard numbers and real world results.

 

From what you guys have been saying I thought IRS was completely unsuitable for drag racing so a SRA Mustang should easily beat a Vette in a drag race no matter how much the Vette weighs or how much HP it has.

 

Lol, well you know that power to weight ratio thing, a 130 hp will do that for ya.