Motor Trend: Mustang V6 vs competition
GTR Member
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Seems like a good review to me and a reflection that it isn't only how fast a car goes, but how a car goes fast and the Genesis seemed to do more qualitative part best. The Stang had some of the best numbers, especially straight line and that carries the day for many on this forum right there, it seems the Genesis was the best driver overall. It's not like MT panned the Stang either, they were quite enthusiastic about it overall and how the 3.7 is a massive improvement over the 4.0 version on a number of fronts, now being a car worthy of an enthusiast's driveway rather than just a rental car lot.
I've never been a fan of this bulky, high-waisted, sitting in a bunker styling that really seems to have become the vogue for the past decade. To me, its all bad-boy wannabe pose but little purpose, actually compromising and detracting from the actual driving experience. A light, airy cabin with excellent sight lines well executed ergonomics can really make the actual driving experience, even if you stop watch says you might not have the fastest ride. The Camaro is clearly worst in this regard and suffered for it, while the Challenger is not too far behind in the rolling gun-bunker ratings. The Stang is much better, though still with a carrier deck's worth of hood to try to look over when aiming for apexes while the Genesis delivers a true wide screen hi-def presentation the road. While I won't argue for the aesthetics of these cars, I certainly would for the functionality of the designs in terms of actual driving enjoyment rather than just trying to look bad azz or something.
I would consider all four to be Pony Cars, especially in 6 cylinder guises, as they do, ostensibly, represent overall performance packages two door coupes. Muscle cars, at least originally, I tended to see as big, cloddish, mid-large two/four door sedans with big V8s that emphasized straight line acceleration over anything else. The Camaro and especially the Challenger do start to creep into the larger size/weight class of a traditional Muscle Car, but they aren't the simplistic, brutish one trick ponies of yore.
That the Genesis Coupe, particularly in V6 trim, is essentially a Korean pony car is interesting in itself and its credible performance here indicates that it is not a competitor to overlook or dismiss. I've always thought this car is but one 4.6 V8 away from really kicking in the barn door to making Hyundai a true player in the performance car market. Hyundai does seem to be getting ever more confident as indicated by its forays into exalted Lexus territory with its Genesis sedan. Perhaps that confidence might too be reflected in a Genesis Coupe 4.6 some day?
I've never been a fan of this bulky, high-waisted, sitting in a bunker styling that really seems to have become the vogue for the past decade. To me, its all bad-boy wannabe pose but little purpose, actually compromising and detracting from the actual driving experience. A light, airy cabin with excellent sight lines well executed ergonomics can really make the actual driving experience, even if you stop watch says you might not have the fastest ride. The Camaro is clearly worst in this regard and suffered for it, while the Challenger is not too far behind in the rolling gun-bunker ratings. The Stang is much better, though still with a carrier deck's worth of hood to try to look over when aiming for apexes while the Genesis delivers a true wide screen hi-def presentation the road. While I won't argue for the aesthetics of these cars, I certainly would for the functionality of the designs in terms of actual driving enjoyment rather than just trying to look bad azz or something.
I would consider all four to be Pony Cars, especially in 6 cylinder guises, as they do, ostensibly, represent overall performance packages two door coupes. Muscle cars, at least originally, I tended to see as big, cloddish, mid-large two/four door sedans with big V8s that emphasized straight line acceleration over anything else. The Camaro and especially the Challenger do start to creep into the larger size/weight class of a traditional Muscle Car, but they aren't the simplistic, brutish one trick ponies of yore.
That the Genesis Coupe, particularly in V6 trim, is essentially a Korean pony car is interesting in itself and its credible performance here indicates that it is not a competitor to overlook or dismiss. I've always thought this car is but one 4.6 V8 away from really kicking in the barn door to making Hyundai a true player in the performance car market. Hyundai does seem to be getting ever more confident as indicated by its forays into exalted Lexus territory with its Genesis sedan. Perhaps that confidence might too be reflected in a Genesis Coupe 4.6 some day?
Mach 1 Member
Joined: March 25, 2010
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From: Dallas, TX
Tell me about it! The handling of my 2011 is the only thing I'm nervous about but I guess I'll just lower it (among other thing, if necessary) if I don't like how it handles. I guess I'll end up coming out ahead either way since I don't like the PP wheels.
GTR Member
Joined: September 28, 2009
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Waiting til Job 2 kicks in isn't a huge deal. Let them work the kinks out, polish everything even more, and then throw the goodies in. Plus, odds are, we'll be seeing some light incentives on them, which is never a bad thing.
FR500 Member
Joined: July 1, 2008
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From: Oxford, UK
I'm disappointed that it appears the Recaros didn't make it into the Performance Pack, given that they aren't in the media demo cars.
GTR Member
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I still hope that even if I decide to go with a 2011, they come out soon and they'll be a bolt-in replacement. If I have to pay out of pocket for them, it might not be all bad. I'd be even happier if they were available with the heated seats for the Comfort pkg.
Last edited by Overboost; Apr 12, 2010 at 11:23 AM.
Mach 1 Member
Joined: April 11, 2006
Posts: 911
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From: Ohio
Correction the camaro WAS a pony car
it isn't anymore because of the shear size and weight.
IMO that has everything to do with the classification.
All my classifications are of the current gen cars not the old ones.
Just because a car shares the name of it's older brother doesn't make it the same animal.
it isn't anymore because of the shear size and weight.
IMO that has everything to do with the classification.
All my classifications are of the current gen cars not the old ones.
Just because a car shares the name of it's older brother doesn't make it the same animal.
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 29, 2004
Posts: 2,358
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Hyundai has made impressive progress over the course of the last decade, but after spending the previous weekend with a brand new Sonata (and driving it just shy of 1000 miles in the process) I remain convinced that the company still has some work to do. Crosswind instability was surprisingly fierce for example, taking both me and my wife by surprise given the bullet-shaped profile of the car. Wind noise was also more intrusive than I would have expected, and materials usage was just a bit too low-rent in some places, particularly for a car which starts just shy of 20k.
Don't misunderstand, there were many compelling reasons to like the car, but in many places it did feel a bit like amateur night even as we enter Hyundai's apparent golden age. Of course, the Genesis coupe is not the same car, but I would be surprised if the newer Sonata represented a step backwards from the older Genesis coupe design in these respects, and as such I would be rather surprised if I didn't find at least a few obvious gaffes that I wouldn't expect to see on a Honda or a Ford.
Don't misunderstand, there were many compelling reasons to like the car, but in many places it did feel a bit like amateur night even as we enter Hyundai's apparent golden age. Of course, the Genesis coupe is not the same car, but I would be surprised if the newer Sonata represented a step backwards from the older Genesis coupe design in these respects, and as such I would be rather surprised if I didn't find at least a few obvious gaffes that I wouldn't expect to see on a Honda or a Ford.
Last edited by jsaylor; Apr 12, 2010 at 11:58 AM.
Cobra R Member
Joined: September 11, 2009
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Here's all the MT video's of the articles you all keep referring too.
Genesis 3.8 vs 2010 mustang gt vs 370z
Genesis 3.8 vs Camaro v6 Part 1
Genesis 3.8 vs Camaro v6 Part 2
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 29, 2004
Posts: 2,358
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Really? Have you actually looked at the dimensions of the Camaro? The Camaro is only 2.3" longer, 1.6" wider, and is actually 1.4" lower than the Mustang. Most of those dimensions are less than the amount that the S197 grew over the SN95, especially length. It is true that the Camaro is heavier by several hundred pounds, but so is the current Mustang compared to past generations. Does your "classification" of what defines a pony car change as every generation of Mustang gets larger and heavier?
That said, I do disagree with Burningman with regard to the Camaro being a muscle-car, as I still hold the Camaro to be a pony-car after giving the issue some thought. That said, IMHO the Camaro is not a pony-car in the same spirit as the original or current Mustang coupes are, instead being far more like the 1967-1970 Cougar models that would follow later which were, arguably, not pure pony-cars but rather a hybrid of sorts. Of course, the Camaro is nowhere near as luxurious now as the Cougar was when introduced, and it lacks some class as well, and then there is the interior space issue......but the footprint is pretty close.
Last edited by jsaylor; Apr 12, 2010 at 12:07 PM.
Mach 1 Member
Joined: January 18, 2010
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From: KC, MO
I've never been a fan of this bulky, high-waisted, sitting in a bunker styling that really seems to have become the vogue for the past decade. To me, its all bad-boy wannabe pose but little purpose, actually compromising and detracting from the actual driving experience. A light, airy cabin with excellent sight lines well executed ergonomics can really make the actual driving experience, even if you stop watch says you might not have the fastest ride. The Camaro is clearly worst in this regard and suffered for it, while the Challenger is not too far behind in the rolling gun-bunker ratings. The Stang is much better, though still with a carrier deck's worth of hood to try to look over when aiming for apexes while the Genesis delivers a true wide screen hi-def presentation the road. While I won't argue for the aesthetics of these cars, I certainly would for the functionality of the designs in terms of actual driving enjoyment rather than just trying to look bad azz or something.
Ultimately, when I started looking into buying a new car, I diverted away from the Camaro in no small part due to visibility concerns. When I looked at a 2010 Mustang before committing to ordering a 2011 Mustang, I thought the hood did seem a bit too...in my face...as I looked out through the front windshield. I'm sure I'll get used to it, though.
Cobra Member
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So as someone pointed out early it wins in every performance catagory, including handling an still loses lol 
. They didn't even say they preferred the design. As usual motor trend makes you go 
. I had some hope for them recently when they seemed to be able to get more real life performance numbers out of vehicles but 
Roger
. They didn't even say they preferred the design. As usual motor trend makes you go . I had some hope for them recently when they seemed to be able to get more real life performance numbers out of vehicles but Roger
GTR Member
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I'm still disappointed in the way this was written. Despite the overwhelming praise for the car, they still have shortcomings and don't option them all out equally. I don't know if that would have been enough, but at least make it a fair matchup across the board. That's the one thing that sticks out the most about that. Option that V6 out to $30k with the appropriate options (Premium, Comfort pkg, HIDs, etc) and then re-test. Regardless if they wanted to test the performance aspects of it, make sure that they're all equal.
I'll just wait until more relevant reviews are posted. You can't take anything away from the performance data though, that is at least useful for these cars.
I'll just wait until more relevant reviews are posted. You can't take anything away from the performance data though, that is at least useful for these cars.
Mach 1 Member
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From: Kansas
Bullitt Member
Joined: January 24, 2010
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From: fredneck county, MD
kudos to the Genesis, that being said...
used to be that performance trumped subjectivity in the mainstream car mags, a few warts were usually overlooked, unless they were testing BMWs
wasn't the Genesis 3.8 supposedly to compete with the v8s when it debuted?
anywho, the Mustang they tested is a hell of a bargain
at x-plan or year end sales event where can you buy that kind of performance for 22-23k?
used to be that performance trumped subjectivity in the mainstream car mags, a few warts were usually overlooked, unless they were testing BMWs
wasn't the Genesis 3.8 supposedly to compete with the v8s when it debuted?
anywho, the Mustang they tested is a hell of a bargain
at x-plan or year end sales event where can you buy that kind of performance for 22-23k?
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: January 6, 2006
Posts: 14,053
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From: Bay Area, CA
That's what I said on page 1. The Genesis they tested is Hyundai's top dog. The other 3 are the "base" models in the range. Significantly upgrade in the Mustang's case, but still the base model. The Genesis Coupe Track was being compared to the GT last year, where it couldn't hang. I see it as more of an in-between competitor for the V6 and GT, even though the new V6 matches its power and handling.
V6 Member
Joined: February 2, 2005
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From: IL
I saw a Genesis in person for the first time a few weeks ago. I was getting the "slow the hell down fix" on my wifes Camry and they had one on the lot. It looked nice and I would like to have one but the interior I didn't feel was as nice as the stangs. And in this test the styling made the car stick out like an asian kid at a Lynyrd Skynyrd concert.
Cobra Member
Joined: May 16, 2006
Posts: 1,322
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From: NV
So as someone pointed out early it wins in every performance catagory, including handling an still loses lol . They didn't even say they preferred the design. As usual motor trend makes you go . I had some hope for them recently when they seemed to be able to get more real life performance numbers out of vehicles but
Roger
. They didn't even say they preferred the design. As usual motor trend makes you go . I had some hope for them recently when they seemed to be able to get more real life performance numbers out of vehicles but Roger
"We like the Hyundai better than the rest. Just because..."
Cobra Member
Joined: October 23, 2009
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From: NW Minnesota
It sounds like the Mustang and Genesis were pretty darn close in their overall appeal. A different group of writers on a different day of the week from the same magazine might have given the Mustang the edge. I wouldn't get worked up over it. As far as the superior numbers argument goes, not everything is easily quantifiable. A V8 Mercedes-Benz may have superior performance numbers to a Mazda Miata, but that doesn't mean it's more fun to drive down a winding canyon road. I think it's pretty commendable that an almost base-grade Mustang competes so well with a Genesis Coupe that has every available performance option.
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: January 6, 2006
Posts: 14,053
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From: Bay Area, CA
It sounds like the Mustang and Genesis were pretty darn close in their overall appeal. A different group of writers on a different day of the week from the same magazine might have given the Mustang the edge. I wouldn't get worked up over it. As far as the superior numbers argument goes, not everything is easily quantifiable. A V8 Mercedes-Benz may have superior performance numbers to a Mazda Miata, but that doesn't mean it's more fun to drive down a winding canyon road. I think it's pretty commendable that an almost base-grade Mustang competes so well with a Genesis Coupe that has every available performance option.
100% agree. Not a big deal. I personally like the Gen Coupe too. I wouldn't buy one, but it's a neat looking car and a good value, making it a strong alternative to the 370Z/G37 twins. G37 practicality and performance with 370Z looks and price. I could see it being cross shopped with a loaded 11 V6 Mustang, but not with the 11 GT. And again, the interior is not up to par with the Mustang. It's equivalent to the standards of the last 350Z, not the new 370Z or G37.
Big test numbers don't necessarily equate to a better driving car and often result in just the opposite in the hunt for the last 1/10 second advantage on a stopwatch. Don't forget how the 2010 Stang GT won most/all comparisons against the Camaro SS based on being a better, not faster, car to drive.
Unlike the Stang's salad days from '03-'09, when it was essentially the only Pony Car around, it is now enmeshed in a very close and very competitive field, which is a fantastic climate for all us enthusiasts. The pace of development and refinement of the Stang is now an order of magnitude greater than it was pre-Camaro/Challenger. That the Genesis Coupe is only adding more heat to the competitive fires is a great plus in my book.
None of these cars is perfect, but this one comparison is only a snapshot 2010. Given the furious pace of competition, I fully expect this pecking order to last all the way to 2011 when, undoubtedly, we'll see a whole new raft of improvements, upgrades, and updates. The Challenger will have a new V6 out, Chevy's already claiming (if rather disingenuously) that their V6 will have more power in '11) and Hyundai may well bolster up the G Coupe.
I really do hope, though, that Hyundai really does grow a pair and engineers in a hotted up version of their nice 4.6 V8 into the Coupe as that would really shake up and expand the Pony Car wars and mark Hyundai as running with the big dogs, performance-wise. Doubt it, but would be exciting.
Last edited by rhumb; Apr 12, 2010 at 04:59 PM.