Dyno'd
V6 Member
Joined: September 13, 2005
Posts: 61
Likes: 0
I don't think it is really that high. I think you are incorrectly assuming that the drivetrain is losing a set percentage of power (I think you mentioned 21% earlier).
It really makes no sense to assume that it will lose a certain % of power but rather, it loses a certain amount of hp total. Not necessarily a static amount but definately isn't losing 20 something % power.
Remember, if this engine is SAE certified that means that an independent person was present when Ford was rating the engine. I HIGHLY doubt that they would let them get away with advertising an engine that has that great of a variance in power.
More than likely, this dyno read slightly high and the drivetrain is more efficient than you are giving it credit for. It may be in the high 4 teen range (416-419) but definately not 475 hp.
It really makes no sense to assume that it will lose a certain % of power but rather, it loses a certain amount of hp total. Not necessarily a static amount but definately isn't losing 20 something % power.
Remember, if this engine is SAE certified that means that an independent person was present when Ford was rating the engine. I HIGHLY doubt that they would let them get away with advertising an engine that has that great of a variance in power.
More than likely, this dyno read slightly high and the drivetrain is more efficient than you are giving it credit for. It may be in the high 4 teen range (416-419) but definately not 475 hp.
V6 Member
Joined: May 14, 2005
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Ok, so we know this particular dyno over-reads right?
And we know that the pull was achieved in 4th gear right?
And we also know that 4th is a 1.32:1 ratio compared to 5th's 1:1 right?
So...
Surely somebody knows an equation or calculation based on the above to give us a true idea of the output?
And we know that the pull was achieved in 4th gear right?
And we also know that 4th is a 1.32:1 ratio compared to 5th's 1:1 right?
So...
Surely somebody knows an equation or calculation based on the above to give us a true idea of the output?
Bullitt Member
Joined: October 28, 2009
Posts: 202
Likes: 1
From: Coopersburg, PA
I like this guy. We lost focus of one of the most important parts of the video, people!
Although, I think it would be funny if Ford underrated the engine by that much, and just happened to have all-new literature on the car waiting. "What, you mean we beat the camaro? Really? We are SO shocked. Here's a new brochure we had laying around, just in case..."
Although, I think it would be funny if Ford underrated the engine by that much, and just happened to have all-new literature on the car waiting. "What, you mean we beat the camaro? Really? We are SO shocked. Here's a new brochure we had laying around, just in case..."
FR500 Member
Joined: July 1, 2008
Posts: 3,352
Likes: 0
From: Oxford, UK
Ok, so we know this particular dyno over-reads right?
And we know that the pull was achieved in 4th gear right?
And we also know that 4th is a 1.32:1 ratio compared to 5th's 1:1 right?
So...
Surely somebody knows an equation or calculation based on the above to give us a true idea of the output?
And we know that the pull was achieved in 4th gear right?
And we also know that 4th is a 1.32:1 ratio compared to 5th's 1:1 right?
So...
Surely somebody knows an equation or calculation based on the above to give us a true idea of the output?
V6 Member
Joined: September 13, 2005
Posts: 61
Likes: 0
Team Mustang Source
Joined: January 30, 2004
Posts: 3,738
Likes: 0
From: Montreal
Mach 1 Member
Joined: January 18, 2010
Posts: 562
Likes: 0
From: KC, MO
MotorTrend has dyno'd the 3.7 and 5.0 me thinks. Here's the article...gonna go read it...
http://wot.motortrend.com/6659607/au...v-6/index.html
"Of course, the best news we discovered on Friday we can only hint at. We believe those dyno figures just have to be accurate, given the outrageous numbers these two 'Stangs threw down at our test track. But you'll have to check back with us bright and early Monday morning to find those out..."
*giddy*
http://wot.motortrend.com/6659607/au...v-6/index.html
"Of course, the best news we discovered on Friday we can only hint at. We believe those dyno figures just have to be accurate, given the outrageous numbers these two 'Stangs threw down at our test track. But you'll have to check back with us bright and early Monday morning to find those out..."
*giddy*
Last edited by Skotty; Mar 26, 2010 at 08:32 PM.
Member
Joined: November 15, 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
here's another Dyno run by Motor Trend..
Motor Trend Dyno 5L V8 and V6
and some comments from the article...
Motor Trend Dyno 5L V8 and V6
and some comments from the article...
Originally Posted by MT
To call Ford's bluff, we took both vehicles to our dyno shop of record, the research and development department at K&N Air Filters in Riverside, California. Why K&N? Because we use them all the time and love the professional operation they run. Oh, and we dig inertia-type dynamometers.
Inertia-type dynos, like K&N's Dynojets, use large, heavy rollers that employ a 4800-pound roller capable of measuring 1200 horsepower at each axle and measure the rate at which the drivetrain can accelerate them. This type is better for determining horsepower of high-output vehicles, as the power is measured directly. (Torque is mathematically calculated using engine rpm data recorded from a spark signal wire).
Fifth gear for both the Mustang 5.0 and V-6 is 1.00:1, which is typically ideal for dyno pulls because less torque multiplication (or overdrive reduction) lowers the load on the gear teeth and reduces losses. These gears proved too tall, so we dropped down to fourth and third gear and made several runs. K&N's policy is to select the median of three consistent runs, so here is what we came up with:
2011 Mustang 5.0
3rd gear (1.69:1)
Horsepower: 365.26 hp @ 6600 rpm
Torque: 335.27 lb ft @ 4500 rpm
4th gear (1.32:1)
Horsepower: 377.99 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 351.44 lb-ft @ 4400 rpm
2011 Mustang V-6
3rd gear (1.67:1)
Horsepower: 268.06 hp @ 6700 rpm
Torque: 249.95 lb-ft @ 4000 rpm
4th gear (1.24:1)
Horsepower: 267.11 hp @ 5800 rpm
Torque: 259.90 lb-ft @ 4100 rpm
Now here is where it gets interesting. Those numbers are what the V-8 and V-6 Mustangs are putting down at the rear wheels, without factoring in anywhere from 10-25 percent of output lost to friction. Motor Trend's tech department recommendation is a bit more conservative 15 percent. After examining the power peaks, K&N's techs suggested we use the fourth gear pulls for the 5.0-liter and third gear pulls for 3.7-liter. With that we arrive at what we think are the most correct output figures for the 2011 Mustangs:
2011 Mustang 5.0 (4th gear pull, 15% powertrain loss)
Claimed horsepower: 412 hp @ 6500 rpm
Claimed torque: 390 lb-ft @ 4250 rpm
Actual horsepower: 435 hp 6500 rpm
Actual torque: 404 lb-ft @ 4400 rpm
2011 Mustang V-6 (3rd gear pull, 15% powertrain loss)
Claimed horsepower: 305 hp @ 6500 rpm
Claimed torque: 280 lb-ft @ 4250 rpm
Actual horsepower: 308 hp @ 6700 rpm
Actual torque: 287 lb-ft @ 4000 rpm
Bottom line? Both cars over deliver on both power and torque. The Mustang 5.0 is certainly the most impressive with 435 horsepower - if you can believe it, that figure put its well over the top of both the Camaro SS and Challenger SRT-8. Even though the difference between Ford's claim and what we discovered is not as great, the Mustang V-6's output is no less impressive - especially when you consider its claimed 31 mpg on the highway.
Of course, the best news we discovered on Friday we can only hint at. We believe those dyno figures just have to be accurate, given the outrageous numbers these two 'Stangs threw down at our test track. But you'll have to check back with us bright and early Monday morning to find those out...
Inertia-type dynos, like K&N's Dynojets, use large, heavy rollers that employ a 4800-pound roller capable of measuring 1200 horsepower at each axle and measure the rate at which the drivetrain can accelerate them. This type is better for determining horsepower of high-output vehicles, as the power is measured directly. (Torque is mathematically calculated using engine rpm data recorded from a spark signal wire).
Fifth gear for both the Mustang 5.0 and V-6 is 1.00:1, which is typically ideal for dyno pulls because less torque multiplication (or overdrive reduction) lowers the load on the gear teeth and reduces losses. These gears proved too tall, so we dropped down to fourth and third gear and made several runs. K&N's policy is to select the median of three consistent runs, so here is what we came up with:
2011 Mustang 5.0
3rd gear (1.69:1)
Horsepower: 365.26 hp @ 6600 rpm
Torque: 335.27 lb ft @ 4500 rpm
4th gear (1.32:1)
Horsepower: 377.99 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 351.44 lb-ft @ 4400 rpm
2011 Mustang V-6
3rd gear (1.67:1)
Horsepower: 268.06 hp @ 6700 rpm
Torque: 249.95 lb-ft @ 4000 rpm
4th gear (1.24:1)
Horsepower: 267.11 hp @ 5800 rpm
Torque: 259.90 lb-ft @ 4100 rpm
Now here is where it gets interesting. Those numbers are what the V-8 and V-6 Mustangs are putting down at the rear wheels, without factoring in anywhere from 10-25 percent of output lost to friction. Motor Trend's tech department recommendation is a bit more conservative 15 percent. After examining the power peaks, K&N's techs suggested we use the fourth gear pulls for the 5.0-liter and third gear pulls for 3.7-liter. With that we arrive at what we think are the most correct output figures for the 2011 Mustangs:
2011 Mustang 5.0 (4th gear pull, 15% powertrain loss)
Claimed horsepower: 412 hp @ 6500 rpm
Claimed torque: 390 lb-ft @ 4250 rpm
Actual horsepower: 435 hp 6500 rpm
Actual torque: 404 lb-ft @ 4400 rpm
2011 Mustang V-6 (3rd gear pull, 15% powertrain loss)
Claimed horsepower: 305 hp @ 6500 rpm
Claimed torque: 280 lb-ft @ 4250 rpm
Actual horsepower: 308 hp @ 6700 rpm
Actual torque: 287 lb-ft @ 4000 rpm
Bottom line? Both cars over deliver on both power and torque. The Mustang 5.0 is certainly the most impressive with 435 horsepower - if you can believe it, that figure put its well over the top of both the Camaro SS and Challenger SRT-8. Even though the difference between Ford's claim and what we discovered is not as great, the Mustang V-6's output is no less impressive - especially when you consider its claimed 31 mpg on the highway.
Of course, the best news we discovered on Friday we can only hint at. We believe those dyno figures just have to be accurate, given the outrageous numbers these two 'Stangs threw down at our test track. But you'll have to check back with us bright and early Monday morning to find those out...
Post *****
Joined: December 14, 2007
Posts: 19,953
Likes: 4
From: State of Jefferson Mountains USA
here's another Dyno run by Motor Trend..
Motor Trend Dyno 5L V8 and V6
and some comments from the article...
Motor Trend Dyno 5L V8 and V6
and some comments from the article...
What fuel?
Mach 1 Member
Joined: August 19, 2006
Posts: 610
Likes: 0
Anybody see this?
http://wot.motortrend.com/6659607/au...#ixzz0jLAYSK3f
http://wot.motortrend.com/6659607/au...#ixzz0jLAYSK3f
Of course, the best news we discovered on Friday we can only hint at. We believe those dyno figures just have to be accurate, given the outrageous numbers these two 'Stangs threw down at our test track. But you'll have to check back with us bright and early Monday morning to find those out.
Mach 1 Member
Joined: October 12, 2009
Posts: 963
Likes: 2
From: New Orleans, LA