Power yes...torque no

The way I see it, if the v8 gets great economy compared to this twin turbo setup, and costs less... well... you can figure out the rest.
Especially when compared to real world numbers on fuel economy.

 

Boomer have you seen any pricing news? While I agree this isn't the best comparison, I looked at some other companies and how they positioned/marketed different engines.

The Volvo S80 has a N/A 6, turbo 6, and a V-8. Prices are $39,500, $42,800 and $50,000 respectively.

The BMW 5 Series has the same line-up. Prices are $45,000, $50,200, and $58,500.

Looking at these companies, a V-8 commands a premium over a turbo 6, regardless of actual production costs. I still want to see those production costs.

If we can scale this down to the Stang, maybe low twenties for the base 6, mid to upper twenties for the T-6 and maybe low thirties for the 8?

 

Sounds good to me.

 

Not a good comparison.
Their V8s are pretty high tech compared to the Ford V8s (take a look at the size of engines and the power coming from them), so yes they will command a premium.

As for seeing pricing?
Disregard everything I say...I have no idea what is going on, infact I have not taken my medication in months.... I'm just certified crazy.... CRAZY i tell you

 

Regardless of the production costs, I still think the TT will be marketed in between the 6 and 8. Do you think Ford has forgotten about the SVO so soon? The Mustang never has and never will be able to pass itself off as a sophisticated sports car. Thats not why people buy it. Theres too many cars that it would be competing against in that scenario that are far superior.

Plus, I'm not entirely convinced that the TT would be that much more expensive than the 8 when you take into account that the costs can be spread across a number of potential models, whereas the 5.0 is more limited in its usage and appeal.

Personally, I think they should make it like the old 5.0 sport/LX where you can upgrade the base model with the TT.

Regardless...it will be interesting to see what they decide to do...

 

Theres no way a TTV6 could be slotted between the normal V6 and V8 in pricing. A TT V6 would cost more to build then a V8, not to mention a TT V6 would make more hp then the V8. So even if they could build it for the same price it would be marketed higher then the V8 because of that.

 

Knight, my best guess for HP numbers are 265 for the 6, 340 for the TT 6, and 400 for the V-8. So the TT 6 makes less HP than the 8 and should be marketed under the V-8. I'm guessing you could get a TT 6 over 400 HP with a hand held tuner but that won't be the factory number. Volvo and BMW have similar powertrains and that's how the are priced. The new 5.0 from Ford is just as sosphicated and/or expensive as any other V-8 engine, especially when DI is added. The only info I have on production costs is a quote from a Ford engineer saying the TT 6 costs about the same as a V-8. I could see Ford charging a couple of grand extra for the V-8. They already do some profit taking with the current V-8.

 

The V8 always has and always will be the premium engine choice in the Mustang world. Theres no way they will make the TT more expensive, or more powerful than the V8 GT model regardless of cost. The numbers that 1trickpony offers look very plausible to me. All you have to do is think...would you really spend MORE money than whatever a 5.0 V8 GT costs to get a TT6? Who cares if it made 450hp (which it won't) it will never be as desirable as the 5.0 with all that torque, rumble and general badassness that a V8 offers. Anyone who has ever owned a V8 Mustang knows this.

 

I can see 2 problems here:

1 - the TTV6 is more expensive than the v8

2 - the TTV6 has potential to up its HP exponentially with the already supplied hardware (tune/boost)

Because of this it, it will more than likely be a niche SE car

 

Couple of problems I see with Boomer's and Clino's posts.

First of all, there is an entire generation of younger buyers who would prefer a TT6 to a V8. I'm not saying one engine is better. I'm just saying they are out there and Ford would be stupid to ignore them. Not everyone can afford for their Mustang to just be a toy; they have to use it everyday. If you can have your cake (HP) and eat it (MPG) too, why not. No matter what the official ratings are, the perception is that a TT6 will be significantly more fuel efficient. There may be people willing to pay a premium for that.

Second, several posts have stated that the TT6 will cost the same to manufacture as the V8 and several others say it will be more expensive. I agree that all else being equal a TT6 should cost more than a V8. However, Ford is talking about putting the TT6 in the Explorer, Edge, F-150, possibly an SVT Fusion and don't forget about the Lincolns cars that have/ will have this engine. So you have economies of scale which will bring the cost per engine on the TT6 down.

Finally, what does it matter if the V8 car is more expensive or if the TT6 car is?? Buy the one you prefer. If the V8 car is less expensive does that make it inferior??

 

usually an engine has either port fuel injection (the injectors are mounted into the intake ports) or direct fuel injection (they're moiunted into the combustion chamber). there are exceptions though: the v6 in the lexus gs or is or both has both the port and combustion mounted injectors. what purpose this has i have no idea, but i do know that the older versions of di engines had horrible driveability problems. it wasn't until the advent of computer controlled ignition and fuel injection that di was able to meet all federal requirments and have decent deiveability.

you are right about the compression ratio...much higher with a di engine.

as far as what v6 goes into a "lightweight" mustang...that's a contradiction in terms; the mustang is anything but light and that is the problem; the base engine on the mustang should be a four banger and the v6 should be the performance engine......gas is selling in my neck of the words for 4.25/gallon in southern connecticut.

drop the weight on the 2010 stang and put in some high tech 4 and 6 cylinder engines...i want my cake and i want to eat it too: goodfuel economy and decent performance. it can be done.


jackg
06 sts6

 

The V8 is going in more than just the mustang as well, just as the V6TT is.

I'm going to make a guestimation that the NA engines will be your run of the mill V6/V8 (base/GT) cars

and your specialty cars will be the forced induction engines.
V6TT (GT350 kinda car) V8S/C (GT500 kinda car)
More expensive, exclusive, powerful.

 

I believe the goal is to produce three new GDI engines - GDI V6(250-300HP), GDI V8(350-400), GDI V8(500-550HP).
Ford is going to mirror what GM & Chrysler are doing. You can fill in the blanks for the SE GDI V6 Model.

Considering the popularity of Muscle Cars and the resurgence of the Classic Car Industry, I think we will have at least one form of a V8 Mustang after 2020.
But, V6's are the future. Heck, sooner or later we may see a high tech 4 banger in the Stang.

I prefer a V8 Mustang. That's all I have ever owned. As long as Ford produces a V8 that makes sense both in performance & price, I will most likely buy it.
But, I believe a TTV6 would be an incredible car, even at 300hp, because of the reduced weight. Add 50hp & IRS and you have one heck of a car!

 

I'm beginning to think you could be right. The only other alternatives I can see are a: Ford could drop the least expensive of the many versions of the 3.5L GTDi we are likely to see (as you well know some insiders have already hinted that there could be a few different turbo setups on these engine beyond the cimple differences between rwd-fwd or low pressure-high pressure) in the Mustang and push it as a truly volume piece. I'm not certain this is among the cars Ford wants to do this with.

or b: This car could still simply skip the GTDi V6 altogether for the next several years. The V8 has prestige and image, and the new one is going to up the ante here considerably. Even more, fuel economy with the new 5.0L is so rumored to be very good so a 3.5L GTDi V6 isn't a must have here.

......back to your V6 SE Mustang. I wouldn't be surprised to see a GT350 either, particularly not with a 415hp+ V6 under the hood. It would be in keeping with the original GT350 concept offering a curb weight a solid couple hundred pounds lighter than the GT while increasing hp over that car as well.

The weight issues of the current Mustang are still blown well out of proportion. The current V6 Mustang weighs about 3350lb or so even with the surprisingly large, cast iron 4.0L lump under it's hood. Replace that with the all aluminum 3.5L DOHC V6 and you are going to drop another 100lb at least....and that is being very conservative. Were at 3250lb and we haven't even considered the fact that the Mustang is going on a bit of a diet.

3250 for a car in this segment is virtually featherweight territory.

 

I agree there is potential for the TT6 to be a SE as Boomer says, its very possible, but then again, no matter what you call it you still have an SVO situation on your hands where given the option between a V8 GT, or a TT6 SE for more money, the V8 will win out 90 percent of the time (as in 84-86) when the 5.0 GT waaaaay out sold the SVO even though when put side by side, the SVO was the better performer in most categories, and probably worth the extra money.

And as far as there being a new generation that would prefer a TT6 to a V8, yes there is, and almost all would be happy to pass right by the Ford dealership on their way to the Nissan or Subaru lot and I wouldn't blame them. If thats the kind of car you're into a Mustang will never be as refined as the imports in that category. The only way it would be appealing is if it was cheaper (such as the Cobalt SS) and everyone seems to think it will be the more expensive engine (However, I'm still not convinced).

 

Yeah the SVO was the precursor for the Buick Grand National. Not many people found out that the stock SVO engine could handle 900RWHP until it was already taken out of production. So the Grand National with its 3.8L turbo went unchallenged by Ford but beating very badly the 5.0 Mustangs.

I am sure this time around, many V8 owners will not let a stock 1000RWHP Ford engine slip past them. I encourage many of you to please continue to purchase and support the V8 platform. This will help keep the price down on the new V6's.

What would be a very bad thing is for you guys who are dedicated to the V8 platform, to jump ship and ruin our price point on the new V6's. Forget about this new V6 engine. That 5.0 is sweet!

 

The fact that both the V6 AND V8 have the potential to become BEASTS is awsome.

 

Hey Boomer, have you seen this video of the Ford XR6 Inline 4.0 motor? This is what the new V6 Mustangs will be like on the dyno's once we get our hands on them.. This Inline 6 is trying to break the dyno straps literally! Check it out!

Don't hold back Boomer! Unleash the beast within you! Its gotta be a 6 this time around.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPyCDF1zwg4

 

hahaha... sorry man... had a 6...

As much as I know what they can do...
... I love the sound and the torque of a V8

You keep the 6, I'll take the V8 any day.

 

that is absolutely scary as hell and wonderful!