The Camaro's path is substantially different from the S197's... GM's zeta platform apparently didn't translate well for the increased length of the car -- made it too heavy and dulled the handling.

It'd probably actually be hard for the S197 to gain enough weight to kill it... even the 2010 gt500 with that big honkin' motor works well. However, this is exactly why we won't see a factory 6.? in the Mustang.

 

The Camaro is on a shortened Zeta though...

 

Eeep. My bad, I had always thought it was made longer, that'll teach me to think without checking my facts first.

 

The Camaro and Challenger went wrong by building a sport coupe out of a full sized sedan platform.

 

No worries, but you could be on to somthing, as the full size zeta the G8 was always praised for its handling yet it is a even heavier car then the camaro.

Maybe the suspension favors the longer chassis.

 

Exactly! That's the thing that kills both cars. Those platforms worked well on the Comodore and the 300C, but those are full sized cruisers. Just merely hacking a few inches of floorpan won't be enough to lower their mass. for the amount of cash they wasted on that, they should've made an all new platform, just as Ford did with the S197.

 

A few thoughts on the Camaro/Challenger not to bee too off topic.

Both GM & Chrysler used the only RWD platform in the fleet. For these two companies this is quite a feat, considering what they were faced with.

I fear that Ford would have done the same thing if they had been in the same position, back in S197 development time they were trying to find the funds to develop a global RWD platform. Had the funds been around I think that we would have a RWD "interceptor concept" type CV in the Ford fleet as well as a Mustang based off of the same platform

 

They were GOING to attempt that with DEW98... but deemed it too expensive.
DEWLite evolved into its own D2C purpose built mustang platform.

 

YES! What he said!

 

Exactly! And for those who think that we somehow got none of what Ford envisioned in the GRWD concept, two things to keep in mind. D2C possesses a lot of what FNA initially envisioned for a GRWD platform, and before GRWD was shelved indefinitely one of the prevailing rumors was that D2C was actually going to provide the basis for much of that work.

Those who continually wish for an Australian developed GRWD platform might want to rethink their wish, as D2C is literally a superior platform to E8 in every respect but one, the inclusion of IRS. To be blunt, dollar for dollar, D2C makes a heck of an argument for the title 'best automotive platform in the world'.

 

Yet Camaro fans knock it for being 'old'
hahahah

 

Keep in mind the only reason the Mustang is doing as well as it does is the rules totally favor the Ford. The BMW M3 they are running is an older E46 M3 with only software updates. The Mustangs rear end is not production and I didn't see a 5.0L Cammer motor under the hood of the current Mustang, granted there will be this year but not the last 3 years the Mustang has been running the Koni series. The Porsche and M3 are basically stock...except they are gutted and they can run Motons.

Dave

 

Wouldn't that be BMW's problem? After all, if they want to win, they should bring the most effective cars they can build.

 

No the rules don't allow it...that's what I am saying, the rules favor the Ford. Doesn't surprise me as the owners are the Frances or basically Nascar. BTW, BMW did win 2 years ago with the older E46M3 and Porsche one the year after. In fact BMW has the lead this year with Ford and Porsche right behind. The Porsche has to run the non DFI 3.6L not the DFI or 3.8L motors, also pretty much stock spec.

Don't get me wrong it shows that Ford can be competitive but in reality if you ever watched the races its in the corners that BMW and Porsche catches the Mustang but on the straights look out at that 450hp 5.0L cammer motor just kicks ****.

Current point standings.

Engine Mfr
Pos Manufacturer PTS
1 BMW
281
2 Ford
276
3 Porsche
238
4 Dodge
5

Also BMW teams will be running the E92 next year...with their 414hp V8s. Should be very interesting.

Dave

 

I still don't get it, but I'll take your word on it.

 

LOL @ Dodge with only 5 points hahahaha

I thought you said BMW can't run their new engines, yet at the end you said they can put their new 414hp V8's in?

 

Starting next year...

Dave

 

Go to www.grand-am.com you can read the rule book whats allowed for each model car. You will see for the drivetrain what can be run and what suspension setup. Thanks for the trust..

 

Now what do you guys think of the 3.5TT engine in the mustang. On another site, a poster who knows a lot about stuff Ford is planning says the 3.5TT is better than the new 5.0 in everyway so Ford can't use both engines in the mustang. I don't personally care for the ecoboost eninge and I have a hard time believing that Ford would produce 2 new engines and have the v6 outperfm their own v8. The poster who stated this though is very credible so I'm puzzeld. What do you guys think?