Bullitt995

In reference to this thread:

http://forums.bradbarnett.net/showthread.php?t=67492

First off, this is not a personal attack on anyone. I'm just trying to help people out by warning them about some of the mis-information that floats around this forum.

I just got back from the dyno with my fresh set of plugs in and guess what the A/F was?

15:1

It was below 13:1 with the old plugs in and nothing else has changed. Clearly the new plugs caused a more complete combustion which caused less fuel to be read at the 02 sensors, which WILL cause the car to go lean. So honestly, if you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about (like some of the people in that thread) PLEASE do not give people advice. Especially if the advice could put an end to their motor.

PS: I'm pretty sure Tillman misunderstood the question. So I'm not talking about him.

70MACH1OWNER

I'm going to take a chance at your flaming me here but here goes. Read your post #21 in that other thread. If it is possible your plugs were in that shape when Doug did the tune on your car than I would look at that as a possible problem. Start with poop you end up with poop. Think about it.
Scott

JRay05stang

its a message board... everyone can have their input... its your choice to listen to the input you like... if you dont like the advice dont ask for it...

Bullitt995

Yeah they were like that and I knew that. That's what the question was. It wasn't "will a colder plug cause my motor to lean out" it was "will fresh plugs cause my motor to lean out"

70MACH1OWNER

I think you may already know the answer. If your plugs looks like post 21 when Doug tuned it than I'd say all bets are off. There is no way you could have had a complete fuel burn with plugs that looked like that. I would put in your new plugs and get back to the dyno for a new tune.

Bullitt995

And you really think it's ok to go around spouting of BS to people as fact? It's one thing to say "Well I think it might be..." and "Yeah it definatly is...". How about I start going into all the "how much rwhp until my rods go" threads and say 700rwhp dyno proven!!! Is that ok? Because I'll start doing it...

Bullitt995

The 15:1 was with the new plugs. And you know what you're talking about. Thank you.

don_w

Unfortunately, the entire internet is full of inaccuracies and misinformation. Most of us can weed out the BS and understand that a lot of independent research is usually also required. Are you actually just now figuring this out? And do you really think this Rambo-esque thread and holier-than-thou attitude will change that? Good luck to you... I'll try to remember to not post in your threads in the future.

Bullitt995

You're one of the good ones Don. You actually put forth some valid and personally tested information. I've ignored a bunch of people to date but I've never had people just blatantly tell me the exact opposite of what was actually true for a fairly simple concept.

It's fairly obvious I didn't take their word for it as I did go get the car dynoed.

holeshot

Dude. Come on, you're being very un-Dude.

Haha, I saw your avatar and that is the first thing that came to mind. I had to say it.

tom281

Well speaking for myself, I've never had a fresh set of plugs affect the a/f ratio, especially by more than 2 points which is what you're claiming. I don't think I posted in your previous thread, but if I had I woulda said "no". Maybe most everyone else's experiences are the same as mine, thus the reason why you got the answers that you did.

On a related note, I do agree with Don though regarding the tone of this thread. Its up to you to make your own decisions which obviously you did, but your comments in this thread imply that you were almost purposely given the wrong information with harmful intent, which is not the case. Good luck with your car.

GottaHaveIt

Geez Settle down people before the Mod Squad comes and spanks, btw opinions not need to be so serious , that it cause one to become so aggressive take a cool shower think about it. were all part of the human league here . " Have a nice day "

RadBOSS

Sorry, but 2 points lean out condition due to a colder plug change does not compute. Colder plugs resist heat more than warmer ones, hence the more agressive dose of insulation around the electrode. The plug is not sending a message to the computer reporting I am rich, lean me out. I suppose you think its magically fooling the O2 sensor that its rich by 2 points? You are all wet dude ... the problem is somewhere else. Not in this thread.

And now having gone back and read the other post and looking at your plugs and realizing you are running on nitrous (missed that on the first read) ... your nitrous system is not adding enough gas or conversely adding too much N20 ... that is where you should be looking for your problem and solution, not the spark plugs ... cold plugs don't solve lean condition ... though they might last a few moments longer. You are lucky you haven't holed a piston (yet?).

TillmanSpeed

I'm sorry, I was under the impression you were dropping a heat range.

So what's the story... was your car tuned on the dyno, or a canned tune?

The plugs I guess you're using HT0's?

I am sure that if someone tuned it on the dyno, the problem would have to have been there at that time. If you're just replacing plugs it wouldn't have been an issue... I guess I didn't read the question enough.

Sure glad you caught it now, though! Phew... 15.1 AFR + Nitrous = not a happy ending.

However, it does sound like there might be an underlying problem...

CR

kepfordj

The colder plugs did not cause the motor to go 2 points leaner, it was that lean on ever cylinder that fired with the old plugs, if it was missing badly enough to put that much raw fuel in the exaust you should have been able to hear the miss.

Bullitt995

But the rug really tied the room together man!

Look let me explain it in simple terms.

1. Dead plugs = not combusting all of the fuel going to the cylinder.
2. Unburnt fuel getting to o2 sensor = seeing a rich condition
3. Car was TUNED with these bad plugs = fuel taken out so rich condition goes away
4. Car is not showing correct power on the dyno through all of this.
5. Put new plugs in = combusting all of the fuel and then some
6. Because of the fuel taken out of the tune = LEAN WITH NEW PLUGS

Made sense to me before I even pulled the plugs to see if they were bad. I asked the question because I had a feeling it would happen. And it did.

And I think some people are missing this : The heat range WAS NOT changed from old/new plugs.

Bullitt995

I didn't really explain it enough and I didn't answer your question correctly. I figured out we had miscomunicated and just droped it.

sodaman

well i am not defending anyone about anything. But plugs dont make the difference. If your a/f went from one thing to the the other by just changing the spark plugs, then maybe you should pay a little more attention to your car to begin with. Because if they made that much of a difference you were already blown on the first plugs. You were running to rich and ate the plugs up, dont blame anything on anyone here except your self. If you dont know what your doing, let someone else do it. I have gotten lots of good info on here, and I have been a master mechanic in my field for 8 plus years. But I would never blame someone else for something I did, Hence I did! If you choose to hold peoples advice here as gospel, then you probably shouldnt be listening to begin with. Good luck with your future indevers. Hopefully you learned something. Dont blame others for things you do! Wether you trusted someone or not, if your not sure of yourself. Investigate, investigate, investigate.

Bullitt995

I now know what caused the plugs to go bad. There was no sign that they were bad until I pulled them out. Doug himself tuned the car as is and we just scratched our heads as to why it wasn't making the correct power. Infact, I posted another thread on here:

http://forums.bradbarnett.net/showth...t=64092&page=2

The only reason this got solved AT ALL, was because I DID know what I was doing and went out on limb on a gut feeling and pulled the plugs when there was no feel of a misfire. No codes, nada. Doug and a bunch of reputable people in the presence of the dyno session didn't even hear a misfire.

edit: I guess I learned my lesson. No posting questions on here that are more complicated than, "Which hole does the gasoline go in?". You get on the internet and all of a sudden anyone that has changed their oil is a "master mechanic".

05mustangman

people are just trying to help by giving their personal opinions. granted they might not be the best all the time but their trying to help you out. no one was saying their a "master mechanic", maybe some of the people on here are. you never no. i mean, if you dont like that people on here are trying to help, you shouldn't post your problems here and ask people to try to help. like don said, the internet is full of bs. use some of your common sense and filter out the bs.