Hi all,

How many toasted motors have there been from superchargers in the 05-06 stang? I've seen a few on the various net boards. These all seem to be from people pushing the performance envelope (more boost than 'kit', other mods, etc.) on their blown motors to see how much the GT can take (before upgrading the internals). My question is, how many have seen toasted motors running the various blowers in their stock 'kit' format with the manufacturer's tune? Anyone blow up a 'kit' saleen, roush, KB, or centrifugal blower using the kit parts/tune as intended for the install?

Tilt

 

Last I heard 3 Prochargers and 1 Vortech.

 

8k Miles on my vortech and no issues to speak of

 

I think my personal count is up to five total now... all centrigual, and all but one of them was pushing 500+rwhp and/or 12+psi. I am unaware of any twinscrew, roots, turbo or N2O grenades yet. But give them time... I know several guys pushing the edge with those, too. It's bound to happen.

 

You're not asking the important question....You need to ask, how much boost is every1 running. If they are running higher than recommended, yes they will have a higher chance of blower that motor.

 

He asked the question that was important to him, which was:

"...how many have seen toasted motors running the various blowers in their stock 'kit' format with the manufacturer's tune?"

My guess is that he wants to run a stock kit and wonders about the likelyhood of problems at that level. As for the limits, we'll have plenty of those threads soon enough.

 

I highly doubt that you'll grenade the motor in the stock format, unless you run some screwball crap.

 

Yeah...you guys are right on the money. I'm looking at running a SC in the stock format and was wondering about doing so safely. I know that running higher boost is potentially bad. I was wondering if anyone had seen a motor toasted with a stock SC kit. Thanks to all for the replies.

Tilt

 

There's a whole handful of guys on Modular Fords board running Saleens and not one major BOOM to speak of......

 

Not even a little BOOM.

 

What worries me about our car's is that even at 'safe' boost levels,
the material will still eventually fail. Aluminum, unlike other metals, does not have a fatigue limit, and will fail under any stress under a number of cycles. I'm sure under normal usage, that number of cycles is quite large...but with the additional stress from forced induction - it could be 2 years..or 20 years. I don't know.

I'm staying away from any forced induction mods for now.

 

It's all in the tune and being smart in regards to boost levels.

 

The weakest link isn't the block. It's the hypereutectic pistons with ringlands very close to the top of the piston and the sintered metal connecting rods.

Even with the safest of tunes these are the weakest links so they are bound to fail first.

Once they fail they will most likely damage the block.

Some people say that the stock block itself, with all other variables taken out of the equation, can sustain 600rwhp while others say 800rwhp

Even though I know of many people running superchargers with stock internals I am still hesitant to go that route myself.

This is because I know that I will never be satisfied with whatever the final numbers are.

I will continue to increase the output till the motor fails.

 

Yes the weakest link is the rods and the pistons. I agree Thump...I won't boost until I forge the internals. If i'm going to spend 5K on a blower I want to be able to use it right.

 

This hysteria about an aluminum block is absurd. What exotic doesn't use an aluminum block and heads? With the thousands of supercharger kits sold and installed on these new mustangs, it is a testament to how decent these engines are. I don't consider 6 blown engines an international crisis or horrible design flaw when more than half if not all were fuel starvation and/or bad tunes. What Cobra (iron) block will last with a 12lbs of boost and an 13.5/1 AF ratio at 6000rpm? None... half the Cobras in MM&FF's are rebuilt engines blown up in the quest for more power.

 

Hello All,

This forum is great and is a lifesaver for those of us who are clueless
about cars and what is the skinny about just about everything.You
start to depend on you guys (and vendors like bamachips and
brentspeed) to mod the right way and without damaging your pony.

The idea of a S/C is certainly intriguing!But when you see (what I
assume are knowledgeable people) disagreeing it becomes
paralyzing

For instance:

>What worries me about our car's is that even at 'safe' boost levels,
>the material will still eventually fail. Aluminum, unlike other metals,
>does not have a fatigue limit, and will fail under any stress under a
>number of cycles.

Vs.

>This hysteria about an aluminum block is absurd.

Clueless people would love to know who's right

>The weakest link isn't the block. It's the hypereutectic pistons with
>ringlands very close to the top of the piston and the sintered metal
>connecting rods.

>I won't boost until I forge the internals

Pistons,ringlands,connecting rods...forged internals.
Just what parts are covered in forging internals?

I wouldn't even consider a S/C until I knew the answers to these
questions.Just common sense indicates that the 05 is still young
and potential problems may not yet have surfaced.

Just some musings from a group admirer :worship:

 

Generally speaking, "forged internals" refers to pistons, rods, and crank. And yes, for the highest level of confidence, forged internals is the best practice when considering power adders and high hp levels. But, these engines aren't total wimps. They can handle some added power without rebuilding the shortblock... if done correctly. There's always a chance something can let go, regardless of the power level. But, IMO it isn't the hp level or the boost level that is critical... it is the tune and the fuel. It is most often detonation or a lean condition that causes fatal failures. Someone running 8# boost with an aggressive tune (i.e., more timing) making 450rwhp will be more at risk than someone running 10# boost with a conservative tune making the same 450rwhp.

Of course these are my opinions only and do not necessarily reflect those of Brad Barnett, The Mustang Source, Inc., or Ford Motor Company.

 

Plenty of motors WITH forged internals have went south under forced induction over the years. They can just take a little more abuse from a poor tune than the stock parts. Don is correct-the tune is the most important variable in this mix. Boost +good gas+good tune +
Boost +poor gas+poor tune + bucket of bolts. Been ther /done that!
Scott

 

I need to make a clarification on my statement about the Aluminum and fatigue limits...I was worried about the hypereutectic aluminum pistons and not the block.


Sorry for any confusion I may have created.

But having said that...are the 4.6L Aluminum block susceptible to cracks under greater than stock loads? I can't remember which car show I saw it on, it was either Sean Hyland or one of the guys from Horsepower TV added additional bracing during an engine re-build.

 

Tony,
I think you spelled that wrong. It's spelled HYPERPATHIC!