C&L Intake and Diablo Predator Installed!
2/10/05, 08:19 PM
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First I must say, that Lee at C&L Performance is a stand up guy! When I called C&L today he was very knowledgeable and helpful. He spent a great deal of time with me and answered all my questions. I pre-ordered the complete kit including the Diablo Predator, a couple week's ago. The intake tube and MAF housing I had powdercoated in a polished finish. They recived a couple of pre-production Diablo's to dyno and Lee was nice enough to send me one of them, so they could go ahead and ship my kit out! I thought that was very cool, and I will be giving C&L feedback and copies of my Dyno runs. It should be here the middle of next week, and I will get a baseline dyno with my headers and exaust, then I will install the C&L kit and have it Dyno tuned with the Diablo Predator! I plan on doing this next saturday. I feel really good about breaking 300 HP to the rear wheels. 
I should be able to post some good info for you guy's and give you honest result's! I think this set up is going to beat the MMR/SCT set up, and I know C&L pruduct's are of the finest available as I've used them in the past. Fingers crossed! 
I should be able to post some good info for you guy's and give you honest result's! I think this set up is going to beat the MMR/SCT set up, and I know C&L pruduct's are of the finest available as I've used them in the past. Fingers crossed!
2/11/05, 11:03 PM
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Jay - I'm almost as excited as you are to hear about your results with the Diablo C&L CAI set up!!! You are in a great position to provide solid & honest feedback with your mods. Are you considering the Steeda charge motion plate as well? And how about underdrive pullys? I'd really be interested in seeing your dyno results from stock to CAI & Tuner, then add pullys and see results then the charge motion plates and see results.......man that would be a great way to see what mods really add vs ones that are just a waste of $$ or even hurt performance! :worship: :worship: Looking forward to seeing your results - whatever mods you decide to do!!
2/12/05, 11:07 AM
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Originally posted by HOTLAP@February 12, 2005, 12:06 AM
Jay - I'm almost as excited as you are to hear about your results with the Diablo C&L CAI set up!!! You are in a great position to provide solid & honest feedback with your mods. Are you considering the Steeda charge motion plate as well? And how about underdrive pullys? I'd really be interested in seeing your dyno results from stock to CAI & Tuner, then add pullys and see results then the charge motion plates and see results.......man that would be a great way to see what mods really add vs ones that are just a waste of $$ or even hurt performance! :worship: :worship: Looking forward to seeing your results - whatever mods you decide to do!!
Jay - I'm almost as excited as you are to hear about your results with the Diablo C&L CAI set up!!! You are in a great position to provide solid & honest feedback with your mods. Are you considering the Steeda charge motion plate as well? And how about underdrive pullys? I'd really be interested in seeing your dyno results from stock to CAI & Tuner, then add pullys and see results then the charge motion plates and see results.......man that would be a great way to see what mods really add vs ones that are just a waste of $$ or even hurt performance! :worship: :worship: Looking forward to seeing your results - whatever mods you decide to do!!
Now here's where it get's tricky! I'm starting to consider what can be done with these motor's naturally asspirated?? The key will be the Cam's IMO. To get to 400 HP or better the Cam will need to be changed. I think this Cam is going to be a major hurddle with the variable Cam timeing on our Pony's. If the after market can crack this nut I'm there! I want a mean lopey sound that can only be had with a Naturaly asspirated monster pushing 400-450 HP!! That sound would finish or my project perfectly! At that point I would go with domed, forged Pistons and Rod's and bump up the compresion ratio. Also a throttle body change(BBK?) and a better intake possibley?? A S/C may be more cost effective, we'll see, maybe not. Plus a S/C will not give you that awsome radical lopey sound.
Also, in the next round of Mod's will include a BMR shock tower brace, BMR lower control arm's (adjustable), and Sub-Frame conector's. I really want to stiffin her up dramatically, more BMR componates will follow latter.
So that's what's on the drawing board. I'll Dyno after Mod's and give you guy's real number's! I'll be useing the same Dyno so the number's will jive, apples to apples etc. I'm excited about the potential with our new motor, let's see what she can do!!
2/12/05, 11:50 AM
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Almost forgot! I ordered the Steeda motor mount's, but I missed out on getting thier original mount's and had to throw in an additional 100 buck's because they changed thier mount's. Now there Street/Strip mount's, that you can change out the bushing's at will. Hopefully they get here soon....
2/12/05, 08:41 PM
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I installed my C&L intake and Diablo tune today. I'm attaching the dyno results. 2 baseline pulls, and 2 pulls after installation of the CAI and the C&L tune from the predator. We tweaked the air fuel a little bit from the standard C&L tune because it was running a little lean.
Lee is going to have Diablo tweak the tune with these values.
For some reason, I can't upload the .jpg of my dyno runs. So here are the max values. These are all SAE corrected numbers
Baseline
HP 257.24 Torque 282.10
HP 256.67 Torque 289.89
C & L Tune, C & L Intake, 2-4K subtract 6% Fuel, 4-7K subtract 3.5% Fuel
(It says subtract in the tuner because you are making it less lean. It was running a little lean with just the C&L Tune and the intake installed.)
Like I said, Lee is going to ask Diablo to tweak the tune.
HP 281.29 Torque 300.23
HP 282.24 Torque 301.46
I've seen some baseline numbers on 05's, and noticed they are usually around 266. I asked the guy at Trackmasters in Huntsville about it, and he said he usually will measure about 10HP below Birmingham. I don't know if there is a problem with his SAE correction or not.
Lee is going to have Diablo tweak the tune with these values.
For some reason, I can't upload the .jpg of my dyno runs. So here are the max values. These are all SAE corrected numbers
Baseline
HP 257.24 Torque 282.10
HP 256.67 Torque 289.89
C & L Tune, C & L Intake, 2-4K subtract 6% Fuel, 4-7K subtract 3.5% Fuel
(It says subtract in the tuner because you are making it less lean. It was running a little lean with just the C&L Tune and the intake installed.)
Like I said, Lee is going to ask Diablo to tweak the tune.
HP 281.29 Torque 300.23
HP 282.24 Torque 301.46
I've seen some baseline numbers on 05's, and noticed they are usually around 266. I asked the guy at Trackmasters in Huntsville about it, and he said he usually will measure about 10HP below Birmingham. I don't know if there is a problem with his SAE correction or not.
2/12/05, 10:13 PM
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Cool Rick! Why do I have to live so far away!!Darn shipping! :bang: Well you might have saved me some money, because if you can get the dyno sheet's up, I'm not going to worry about it! I'll just install my kit, download my tune and go straight to Dyno tunning! Those number's are looking real good Rick. With a little luck I should break 300 to the ground!
2/13/05, 07:12 AM
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I'll try again to put the sheets up. I was his test mule so there was no shipping involved.
Sorry for the poor quality. I had to re-size it. The original was 197K. I guess that's why I couldn't post it.
I forgot to mention. Lee filmed my dyno run yesterday. He said that Dale Jarrett, or his company, is going to make a SE Mustang using his intake, and they wanted some video of the dyno run. It's just shooting the front of the car while doing the pull. It should be available on the web soon. When they post it, I will put up a link.
Sorry for the poor quality. I had to re-size it. The original was 197K. I guess that's why I couldn't post it.
I forgot to mention. Lee filmed my dyno run yesterday. He said that Dale Jarrett, or his company, is going to make a SE Mustang using his intake, and they wanted some video of the dyno run. It's just shooting the front of the car while doing the pull. It should be available on the web soon. When they post it, I will put up a link.
2/13/05, 03:45 PM
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Rick...
Where did you get those charts??? I didn't see Arthur printing them out for you. Anyhow, I have gone through all of the data, and have given Diablosport the necessary information for the final production units. We saw a gain of 26 HP "peak before versus peak after" and as much as 30 rear wheel HP at around 6100 RPM. Torque picked up by about 25 ft/lbs in the upper RPM's. I am enclosing dyno charts below.
Oh, and in case you were wondering, the standard "performance tune" WITHOUT our air intake assembly added about 7 HP (peak before versus peak after) and a peak improvement of about 11 HP, which is about what I expected to see. It only makes sense, as anyone who has done a lot of dyno testing on Mustangs will tell you that a timing increase on the 2-valve modular GT engine will typically new you a 7 HP gain at the wheels. I probably could have picked another couple of horsepower up by fine tuning the fuel a bit, but we were focused on finalizing the tune for our intake kit. Beware of anyone who is trying to sell you on a tune with claims of making substantially more HP than this with just a re-flash. I know that I have heard outlandish claims about re-flashing the '05 GT, and I just hope that none of you get conned into believing that just a tune will give you anywhere near the performance like what is shown below. In previous testing, we saw 18 rear wheel HP and 17 ft/lbs of torque with just our air intake assembly and no tune. If you add that to the gains found from the standard performance tune, the results become exactly what you see below...
Lee
Where did you get those charts??? I didn't see Arthur printing them out for you. Anyhow, I have gone through all of the data, and have given Diablosport the necessary information for the final production units. We saw a gain of 26 HP "peak before versus peak after" and as much as 30 rear wheel HP at around 6100 RPM. Torque picked up by about 25 ft/lbs in the upper RPM's. I am enclosing dyno charts below.
Oh, and in case you were wondering, the standard "performance tune" WITHOUT our air intake assembly added about 7 HP (peak before versus peak after) and a peak improvement of about 11 HP, which is about what I expected to see. It only makes sense, as anyone who has done a lot of dyno testing on Mustangs will tell you that a timing increase on the 2-valve modular GT engine will typically new you a 7 HP gain at the wheels. I probably could have picked another couple of horsepower up by fine tuning the fuel a bit, but we were focused on finalizing the tune for our intake kit. Beware of anyone who is trying to sell you on a tune with claims of making substantially more HP than this with just a re-flash. I know that I have heard outlandish claims about re-flashing the '05 GT, and I just hope that none of you get conned into believing that just a tune will give you anywhere near the performance like what is shown below. In previous testing, we saw 18 rear wheel HP and 17 ft/lbs of torque with just our air intake assembly and no tune. If you add that to the gains found from the standard performance tune, the results become exactly what you see below...
Lee
2/13/05, 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by stock01gt@February 13, 2005, 8:15 AM
I'll try again to put the sheets up. I was his test mule so there was no shipping involved.
Sorry for the poor quality. I had to re-size it. The original was 197K. I guess that's why I couldn't post it.
I forgot to mention. Lee filmed my dyno run yesterday. He said that Dale Jarrett, or his company, is going to make a SE Mustang using his intake, and they wanted some video of the dyno run. It's just shooting the front of the car while doing the pull. It should be available on the web soon. When they post it, I will put up a link.
I'll try again to put the sheets up. I was his test mule so there was no shipping involved.
Sorry for the poor quality. I had to re-size it. The original was 197K. I guess that's why I couldn't post it.
I forgot to mention. Lee filmed my dyno run yesterday. He said that Dale Jarrett, or his company, is going to make a SE Mustang using his intake, and they wanted some video of the dyno run. It's just shooting the front of the car while doing the pull. It should be available on the web soon. When they post it, I will put up a link.
Lee, thank's for posting the Dyno chart's! This combo is doing great over the whole RPM range, super gain's! This will be a winning combo...
I have an appointment on friday the 18th, with my local Diablo Tuner, stay tuned...
2/13/05, 07:47 PM
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Originally posted by LeeB99@February 13, 2005, 4:48 PM
Rick...
Where did you get those charts??? I didn't see Arthur printing them out for you.
Rick...
Where did you get those charts??? I didn't see Arthur printing them out for you.
Lee... I asked Arthur to email the results to me when he emailed them to you so I could have them. He pointed me to a viewer so I could read them.
I just want to say it's been a pleasure working with you, and a real learning experience.
For those doubters out there, Lee is a stand-up guy, and I don't believe he would steer anyone wrong, or sell a product that he didn't believe in, or couldn't back up with proof.
2/13/05, 07:56 PM
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I have finished editing, adding text and compressing the dyno video. It is less than 3 megs in size and is just over a minute long. If anyone can tell me where I can send it to be hosted that you guys can link to until we get it up on our site, I would be glad to do so.
Rick- Send me an e-mail, and I will send you a copy directly. I don't have your e-mail address here at home. So, send me a message and I will get it right to you...
Lee
Rick- Send me an e-mail, and I will send you a copy directly. I don't have your e-mail address here at home. So, send me a message and I will get it right to you...
Lee
2/14/05, 10:16 AM
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Lee, can you tell how much hp can be supported before a larger one is needed? I hate to buy your set up then add mods only to have to buy another meter. Do you see larger air meters coming soon or the size in your kit will go a long way / lots of mods before needed. Lastly do you see anything better on the diablo vs sct. Both good products but I want to make sure I get the one that will benefit all my future mods.
2/14/05, 01:55 PM
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Our unit is larger than stock, and you would have to be making a lot more HP before going any larger would be necessary. I don't think that anyone who is naturally aspirated would need a bigger unit. All of the blower companies will be supplying tunes specifically for a new air meter housing provided with their kit, due to the fact that you cannot separate the factory air meter from the airbox.
As far as tuning diferences are concerned, we are using Diablo Predators due to the flexibility of the unit. I has MANY more features that save the customer both time and money in the long run. Since we have worked with Diablosport on the tuning of this system, we can guarantee that the tune is correct. I would reccomend against doing a mail order tune (other than the Predator that we are offering), as you really don't know how it will work with your vehicle. If you absolutely want to go with an SCT tune, I would reccomend only doing so if you are doing a custom tune in person, since I have no real knowledge of them having any experience with tuning a 2005 with our system installed. Hope this helps...
Lee
As far as tuning diferences are concerned, we are using Diablo Predators due to the flexibility of the unit. I has MANY more features that save the customer both time and money in the long run. Since we have worked with Diablosport on the tuning of this system, we can guarantee that the tune is correct. I would reccomend against doing a mail order tune (other than the Predator that we are offering), as you really don't know how it will work with your vehicle. If you absolutely want to go with an SCT tune, I would reccomend only doing so if you are doing a custom tune in person, since I have no real knowledge of them having any experience with tuning a 2005 with our system installed. Hope this helps...
Lee