sincitybronco

I have an 06 GT Auto,{yeah I know}, and am thinking about getting a blower. I am hearing that I cannot go intercooled because it is too much for the Tranny to handle, but I also want my engine/blower to last and to get optimum performance. the new camaro is gonna come with 400 plus hp, and I will be dammed if I will ever lose to a freakin stock camaro.

should I get a different tranny? should I forget the blower and just stroke the engine? I am planning on rebuilding with forged internals before adding the blower anyways.
what would you guys do?

OKLACOP

Rob,

Cool name by the way. I just bought a Whipple non-intercooled for my 06 auto. I had the same questions you have now. The reasons I went w/ Whipple:

First I wanted the twin screw. When Whipple and Ford Racing partnered up I knew the Whipple was what I wanted. It had the factory look, the tunes were going to come straight from Ford, it would fall under the factory warranty, etc, etc..........I debated back and forth (see my two threads under this forum about the Whipple) when I heard the tune was pretty weak. Just the other day I learned about the new tune for the auto and was convinced the Whipple was the way to go!

About going intercooled or non-intercooled. This has been debated to death on here, but here's what I learned dealing with Whipple (Kenne Bell and others may tell you different). Whipple techs told me they will not sell an intercooled unit to someone who tells them it's for an auto. They told me the intercooled has too much boost and will tear an auto up. Others on here will claim B.S. Whipple also told me the warranty is out the window if you put an intercooled unit on your auto. Seems that would be up to your Ford dealer. My local Ford tech that is going to install mine said you could put an intercooled unit on an auto and just reduce the boost, but that would requre a custom tune. That's all I can tell you. Others can speak for kenne bell, and other twin screw or roots blowers/superchargers. I have no idea about the Vortechs, Paxton's etc as I never really inquired or researched the centrifugal superchargers. I wanted low end. My understanding is the centrifugal superchargers are more for midrange to top end power. You are going to get a lot of different opinions on here. None of which are bad. In the end just get what you want!

70MACH1OWNER

Hey Rob,
I am going out on a limb here but here goes. I have had several superchargers thru the years on several stangs. The last being a non-intercooled KB. I would not think that the tune would be any different on a intercooled verses non-intercooled Whipple if both are say running 8 psi boost. The intercooler will reduce the air charge temp. only. This is why you can run more boost with more aggressive timing with the intercooled systems. If you want to run an intercooler and just reduce the boost to the level of the none intercooled version I am really hard pressed to see why the tune would be that much different. I am sure since you have a auto trans there is a whole lot of cover my azz going on with the people you are talking to. Just my 2 cents. P.S. I also believe that running an intercooler is always the best.
Scott

don_w

From everything I've read (and experienced with my own car), the auto trans is actually more durable than most thought. And maybe less trouble than the stick, which seems to have clutch issues. Personally, I'm running 12psi boost on a daily driver, and go out every weekend and beat the snot out of it at the track. The tranny has over 200 runs (and 7,000 miles) at that power level, and I routinely run in the low 7's in the 1/8-mile.

tom281

, 'xcept minus the "stupid" part lol!


Scott and Don both make alot of sense to me.

70MACH1OWNER

Welcome back Don... We missed you!!!!
Scott

don_w

Thanks Scott...

mvon919

I totally agree with Don... Auto is probably better option for charged induction, in terms of durability...

Can't wait for weather to warm to begin my Saleen S/C install!

jaiasmit

I'm very glad to hear this from someone who has experienced it. There's someone on one of the boards that blew his transmission after less than 3,000 miles and only 20 runs at the track. That certainly scared me off of the SC with an auto for a while.

I really want the Saleen SC though, and by the time I can afford, I'll also be able to afford to rebuild/replace the tranny if need be.

EDIT: Hold on, back the bus up! I just read your complete mod list Don. It looks like you have a modified tranny and torque converter. From your previous post, it sounded like you were running the stock tranny. What all is involved in your "street/strip" rebuild tranny? How much is it beefed up compared to the stocker? And, did you have it rebuilt before you started pounding on it, or after because it was dead?

Thanks for all the info guys. I'm not the one who started the post, but I sure have all the same questions.

jaiasmit

I'm with ya' on that one. Ran my budget last night, and hope to have a Saleen sitting in the garage come July.

Doug@C&L

I've ridden in both a magnacharged automatic car and a Vortech automatic car and where the magnacharger car did have more bottom end the Vortech wasn't as bad as I thought it would be down low. Now on a manual car the Vortech's don't have much down low as I've tuned and driven them both. But with the auto I dont know what makes it feel better but its not as explosive when it gets to 3000 rpm's as it is with a manual. It actually pulls pretty well. Of course even better as the RPM's gain from the Vortech's ability to build boost as the RPM's climb.

Still, for my auto I would like a Roots or Twin screw but I'm just saying if you buy a Vortech or Paxton dont expect to be left behind at a light.

Thanks, Doug.

mvon919

Yep, as far as I understand, risk of blowing manual tranny with S/C is more likely to happen than auto... auto tranny isolates human errors 99%....

hope some tranny guru chimes in... my believe and what people have been talking is that auto is risk-free to supercharge. and that is the only thing that i've found positive with choosing auto tranny... i'm about to cry.

uberPony

I am the guy with the tranny that blew on this board.
Yes, My car has 6500 miles and the supercharger was installed at 3500 miles. The supercharger and automatic transmission are a great combination for the street.
My tranny went out two weeks ago. Before mine went I had seen several other people on these forums who have had their trans fail. I though mine would be okay because my car is not a daily driver etc. I was wrong.
I have put approximately twenty runs on the car at the track. My car is absolutely babied and not driven daily. I do not manually shift when I race at the track, I just stick it in Drive.


I would be careful who you are listening to about this issue. First of all most of these superchargers for the S197 have been around for less than a year. I think you will be seeing a large number of people with trannies failing in the near future if they are running 8 PSI of boost or more. These trannies cannot withstand the torque being created by blown 4.6 motor. I know another guy with a Vortech S/C installed and heis transmission lasted less miles than mine did.

If you want to know what these trannies can or cant handle ask someone who has taken them apart after they have gone out - like Level 10 or Lentech.
The torque converters on these cars are cheaply made and are the first weak point. Then you can consider the tiny clutch packs etc. in the 5R55S. The stock parts cant handle a whole lot of power.
The Shelby cannot be ordered from Ford with the 5R55S automatic because they know it cannot handle the blown 5.4 horsepower.
Whipple wont sell you a high boost intercooled blower for an automatic because they say it will toast the transmission.
Anyone who said that you can supercharge these automatics "risk free" is mis-informed.

mvon919

I'm about to run my S/C with 3.6" pulley... producing about 7-7.5 psi. It's a daily driver, though I don't drive it hard. Always.

RUgoinUp?

I'll have a converter, upgraded tranny pan, fluid, and cooler before adding F/I.

Thomas S

I would like to know this also.

TillmanSpeed

Spend the money to rebuild the tranny to higher torque specs. Go with the intercooled, if you can swing it.

If you can't then go with the non-intercooled whipple. It will still rip like crazy!

CR
TillmanSpeed

RedDragon777

i do not care what whipple has been telling me, i am going 10psi (in reality i will use 8 or 9 psi but the kit is made for 10) I/C whipple kit

don_w

Yes, you read correct... my tranny was "allegedly" beefed up. I had the work done while the motor was being rebuilt. I had 17,000 miles and 300 N/A runs on it before the motor went. The work was done by Art Carr (of TX), but there were plenty of F'ups by them on several trannies during that time frame. In fact, the first TC I got from them was defective, and actually damaged the planetary gears. I had to have those replaced locally. And now, my replacement TC is slipping and I need to get another one (but it will not be from Art Carr ). So... bottom line, I really don't know if I got anything at all for the money I sent them. Their track record is horrible over the past year, and I have no confidence that they did anything at all to the tranny to make it better. I'm just happy that it has held up this well (so far).

FWIW, if (when?) this tranny lets go, I'll be seriously looking at a Lentech-modified 4R70W (with a transbrake), or maybe something from Level 10.

HiRoller

There's risk when performing ANY mods on these cars. a bad tune will toast the motor with just a CAI. I agree with the first sentence. Be careful who you are listening to.

Whipple has a tune for the automatics now. You CAN get a I/C Whipple with an updated tune for the auto trans.

JDM Engineering in Freehold, NJ is one of the top...if not THE TOP Saleen tuners in the US. They put over 600 runs on their Saleen s/c car with a stock auto transmission last year. They've done their homework and determined with the right tune 475-500hp is safe (not bulletproof) for the autos. They toasted a band in their final race, but they were well into the 600hp range.

A tune is just as important to the trans as it is to the engine. The computer controls everything (shift points, shift pressure, etc) JDM has tuned MANY autos and none of them have failed yet..... They never toasted a motor either. Most of their kits range from 8-10 psi. Mine is being installed on Feb 5th.