X-plan question for salesmen
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GT Member
Joined: June 4, 2006
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X-plan question for salesmen
My wife and I have an X-plan PIN already assigned to us as my wife's current employer qualifies for this partner plan. We're planning to order a GT in about 5 weeks with it and have spoken with the dealer that we intend to order from and have discussed the X-plan with them and they are happy to write our order based upon the X-plan.
However, my wife has just started to puruse a job with a different company and this company does not qualify as a Ford partner. So my question is if we can still use the X-plan if my wife switches jobs. As I said, we already have the PIN assigned to us. While I can imagine that it might be beneficial to place our order ASAP, we can't order the car until late August.
So for you sagacious Ford sales people, what do you have to say? I appreciate your time and responses.
However, my wife has just started to puruse a job with a different company and this company does not qualify as a Ford partner. So my question is if we can still use the X-plan if my wife switches jobs. As I said, we already have the PIN assigned to us. While I can imagine that it might be beneficial to place our order ASAP, we can't order the car until late August.
So for you sagacious Ford sales people, what do you have to say? I appreciate your time and responses.
Team Mustang Source Legacy Member
Joined: September 2, 2004
Posts: 1,679
Likes: 5
From: Las Vegas
I'm no sales man, but having just bought my car last night on x-plan, and talking to the finance guy when signing the papers, the x-plan pin is only good for a limited time (90 days I think). They really don't need the pin until you pick up the car, so it would have to be assigned within 90 days of that, and you have to prove that you work at the sponsor company.
Ford employees can give friends/family an x-plan pin, and there are a few online willing to do that. I don't know if there are any on here, but I think I remember reading there are a few on blueovalnews.com or another Ford forum willing to help buyers out.
Good luck, hope you get it on x-plan.
Ford employees can give friends/family an x-plan pin, and there are a few online willing to do that. I don't know if there are any on here, but I think I remember reading there are a few on blueovalnews.com or another Ford forum willing to help buyers out.
Good luck, hope you get it on x-plan.
GT Member
Joined: February 10, 2006
Posts: 125
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From: Atlanta, GA
Miscommunication?
They screwed me because I clearly stated that I was looking for X-Plan level pricing...I made it clear that I did not have a pin. They offered me invoice...I negotiated down from there..but only a couple of hundred dollars. Again....it was "understood" not to be x-plan since there were negotiations.
7 weeks goes by..the car comes in...and oh, by the way...where is your pin?....I reiterate that I don't have one...they say, "We will honor the price...but we have a $500 documentation fee....
That is what I call being screwed...but considering the fact that I had already promised my car to my cousin...who also gave me the money in advance for my downpayment...and the car was at such a good price...I just sucked it up.
$300 over invoice for a completely loaded 2007 in August of 2006 is still a good deal for a car with this demand.
7 weeks goes by..the car comes in...and oh, by the way...where is your pin?....I reiterate that I don't have one...they say, "We will honor the price...but we have a $500 documentation fee....
That is what I call being screwed...but considering the fact that I had already promised my car to my cousin...who also gave me the money in advance for my downpayment...and the car was at such a good price...I just sucked it up.
$300 over invoice for a completely loaded 2007 in August of 2006 is still a good deal for a car with this demand.
Team Mustang Source
Joined: June 19, 2004
Posts: 6,840
Likes: 2
From: Phoenixville, PA
Originally Posted by Cleveland
no offense but that is nowhere near "screwed"... there is always a "documentation fee" involved with car deals...
-Dan
-Dan
Mach 1 Member
Joined: June 16, 2006
Posts: 628
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Originally Posted by 05fordgt
Keeper, Dan is right. Every dealer, no matter what the car brand, always has a doc fee. The only difference in them is each state has a limit to what can be charged. In my state, we charge what the state says is acceptable, $55.
Team Mustang Source
Joined: June 19, 2004
Posts: 6,840
Likes: 2
From: Phoenixville, PA
Originally Posted by flashfearless
I think that what he was trying to remind you is that A/Z/X/D plan buyers do not have to pay the doc fee no matter how trivial it is...
GT Member
Joined: February 10, 2006
Posts: 125
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From: Atlanta, GA
Doc Fee
I understand what you are saying....and I knew about doc fees before I went into the deal. But we dealt with that (or so I thought) before I ordered the car...read on....
The screwing comes from several key points:
During the negotiation:
1) In person, raising the price quoted to me over the phone.
2) Trying to tell me that invoice was the same thing as X-Plan
3) Trying to tell me that to sell below invoice would, "get them in trouble"
4) Trying to tell me that there is no holdback with the Mustangs
I recognized all that as B.S. And we were not in X-Plan territory, because we negotiated for 30 minutes....but when I got $200 below invoice I accepted that as a good deal...and here is the key....
1) I told them I did not have a pin.
2) I told them that I had better not see any "dealer prep", "etching", or any other kind of fees.
3) He agreed that the price + tags + tax + title was my "out the door price.
Unfortunately, I never got that final # in writing....I only got the sale price we negotiated on.
So....I call adding $500 (which is a riduculous doc fee) to the agreed upon price of the car "screwing".
If I had not pre-sold my car to my cousin who needed it....and more importantly, if I had not negotiated such a good deal in the first place...I would have told them to stick it.
But that is based on principal. And when you have exactly the car you ordered sitting in front of you for $300 over invoice....principals tend to bend and I took it.
So..what did I learn? Get the final $$ in writing before you order the car.
Lesson learned.
The screwing comes from several key points:
During the negotiation:
1) In person, raising the price quoted to me over the phone.
2) Trying to tell me that invoice was the same thing as X-Plan
3) Trying to tell me that to sell below invoice would, "get them in trouble"
4) Trying to tell me that there is no holdback with the Mustangs
I recognized all that as B.S. And we were not in X-Plan territory, because we negotiated for 30 minutes....but when I got $200 below invoice I accepted that as a good deal...and here is the key....
1) I told them I did not have a pin.
2) I told them that I had better not see any "dealer prep", "etching", or any other kind of fees.
3) He agreed that the price + tags + tax + title was my "out the door price.
Unfortunately, I never got that final # in writing....I only got the sale price we negotiated on.
So....I call adding $500 (which is a riduculous doc fee) to the agreed upon price of the car "screwing".
If I had not pre-sold my car to my cousin who needed it....and more importantly, if I had not negotiated such a good deal in the first place...I would have told them to stick it.
But that is based on principal. And when you have exactly the car you ordered sitting in front of you for $300 over invoice....principals tend to bend and I took it.
So..what did I learn? Get the final $$ in writing before you order the car.
Lesson learned.
Team Mustang Source
Joined: June 19, 2004
Posts: 6,840
Likes: 2
From: Phoenixville, PA
Keeper, I believe you that you got taken advantage of. Like I mentioned, you should look online at what the maximum amount dealers in your state can charge for a doc fee. If its way under the $500 that they charged you, you may be able to get it back. Just a thought.
From what you described during the negotiations, that the dealer was a bit greasy, if not downright shady.
To contradict what that slimeball of a salesman (who give my profession a bad name) said, there IS holdback on a Mustang that was ordered by the same dealer. When you have to go purchase it from another dealership, without giving a car up in trade, the holdback goes away.
Secondly, X-Plan, depending on the Mustang, is basically invoice, if not a little bit under (like less than $100). The salesman was wrong again.
The whole under invoice thing. Personally, if you can get any car at or a few hundred $$ above invoice, most car sites (KBB, Edmunds, Autobytel), list this as a good deal. I won't lie to you, I don't sell cars under invoice. Only the dealer gets the holdback, I don't see 1 cent of it. When I sell a car at anywhere less than $300 over invocie, all I get for that sale is $75 BEFORE taxes, thats it. When the time comes to sell every car under invoice, I think I may have to look at another profession. Most new cars I sell are a few hundred $$ over, and everyone is happy.
Lastly, price over the phone didn't match the price when you got there. I hate the "lowball" approach. So many long seasoned salespeople still do this, and think it still works. Here is a eye opener for all who do this: IT DOESN"T WORK ANYMORE, STOP IT!!! The consumer is too well educated to pull this on. Give a price over the phone is great, just stick to the same price. If anyone gets a price, and when you get there its higher, get up and walk out. Don't do business with them.
Keeper, I'm sorry to rant like I did (its late). I didn't like how you were treated at the dealership by a so-called salesperson, made a rant come out. All in all, you got a great deal, not a good deal, a great deal. Hope you enjoy your Mustang.
From what you described during the negotiations, that the dealer was a bit greasy, if not downright shady.
To contradict what that slimeball of a salesman (who give my profession a bad name) said, there IS holdback on a Mustang that was ordered by the same dealer. When you have to go purchase it from another dealership, without giving a car up in trade, the holdback goes away.
Secondly, X-Plan, depending on the Mustang, is basically invoice, if not a little bit under (like less than $100). The salesman was wrong again.
The whole under invoice thing. Personally, if you can get any car at or a few hundred $$ above invoice, most car sites (KBB, Edmunds, Autobytel), list this as a good deal. I won't lie to you, I don't sell cars under invoice. Only the dealer gets the holdback, I don't see 1 cent of it. When I sell a car at anywhere less than $300 over invocie, all I get for that sale is $75 BEFORE taxes, thats it. When the time comes to sell every car under invoice, I think I may have to look at another profession. Most new cars I sell are a few hundred $$ over, and everyone is happy.
Lastly, price over the phone didn't match the price when you got there. I hate the "lowball" approach. So many long seasoned salespeople still do this, and think it still works. Here is a eye opener for all who do this: IT DOESN"T WORK ANYMORE, STOP IT!!! The consumer is too well educated to pull this on. Give a price over the phone is great, just stick to the same price. If anyone gets a price, and when you get there its higher, get up and walk out. Don't do business with them.
Keeper, I'm sorry to rant like I did (its late). I didn't like how you were treated at the dealership by a so-called salesperson, made a rant come out. All in all, you got a great deal, not a good deal, a great deal. Hope you enjoy your Mustang.
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: October 2, 2006
Posts: 4,777
Likes: 16
From: Southeast Michigan
X-Plan PINs are valid for 12 months from the date of issue.
Under the X-Plan, dealers CANNOT charge you documentation / runner fees, which amounted to about $99 back in 2003.
I believe the $75 admin fee is already part of the X-Plan price.
Basically you pay:
X-Plan Price
Tax
Title
Registration
X-Plan price = (0.996 * Dealer invoice) + $75 admin fee
For some cars, its about invoice price, and others is $20-$40 below invoice. The closest invoice pricing that is accurate is using Forddirect.com
MSN/KBB/NADA invoice is about $500 below Forddirect.com invoice, and Edmunds invoice is about $800+ below Forddirect.com invoice.
If you walk into a dealership planning to order a GT using a X-Pin with Edmunds invoice or KBB invoice pricing data, your dealership will tell you flat out you have the "WRONG" invoice pricing...
Under the X-Plan, dealers CANNOT charge you documentation / runner fees, which amounted to about $99 back in 2003.
I believe the $75 admin fee is already part of the X-Plan price.
Basically you pay:
X-Plan Price
Tax
Title
Registration
X-Plan price = (0.996 * Dealer invoice) + $75 admin fee
For some cars, its about invoice price, and others is $20-$40 below invoice. The closest invoice pricing that is accurate is using Forddirect.com
MSN/KBB/NADA invoice is about $500 below Forddirect.com invoice, and Edmunds invoice is about $800+ below Forddirect.com invoice.
If you walk into a dealership planning to order a GT using a X-Pin with Edmunds invoice or KBB invoice pricing data, your dealership will tell you flat out you have the "WRONG" invoice pricing...
Team Mustang Source
Joined: June 19, 2004
Posts: 6,840
Likes: 2
From: Phoenixville, PA
I just did an Edmunds price on a GT that we have in stock. Premium, 3:55 rear, 5-speed, IUP, AAT, SAB, PTP, Comfort, Polished Bullitts, GTAP, and Sirius. MSRP on the car is $31,050 (Edmunds is close at $30,950). Now, Edmunds lists invoice at $28,398. The actual invoice is listed at $28,929.80 (including D&D & Advertising). A little off if I may say. But the real kicker, the Edmunds "TMV what others are paying" price still has the MSRP listed! Tells you that Edmunds doesn't know that the prices of these has dropped to normal levels now.
Legacy TMS Member
Joined: October 2, 2006
Posts: 4,777
Likes: 16
From: Southeast Michigan
I started doing research on the different invoice prices after having about 3 salespeople tell me I brought in the "wrong" invoice price. Forddirect.com / Fordvehicles.com seems to have the closest match to dealer invoice pricing. I was within $5 of a salesperson's X-Plan quote for a 2007 GT Deluxe when I used the Invoice listed on Forddirect.com.
Title, Registration, and Undercoating seemed to have jumped up in price in the past 3 years. It used to be $156 for title/reg and $179 for undercoating on a cargo van (8600 GVW, 138" WB) back in 2003.
The dealership in MI wants $194 for title/reg on a little 'ol 07 GT, and $299 for undercoating (the amount of undercoating used on a 07 GT would probably fit only 1/4 of the cargo van).
Title, Registration, and Undercoating seemed to have jumped up in price in the past 3 years. It used to be $156 for title/reg and $179 for undercoating on a cargo van (8600 GVW, 138" WB) back in 2003.
The dealership in MI wants $194 for title/reg on a little 'ol 07 GT, and $299 for undercoating (the amount of undercoating used on a 07 GT would probably fit only 1/4 of the cargo van).
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