Yeah, you're right. With the abysmal financial situation most every single auto company find themselves in, you'd think they'd do almost anything for some much-needed sales (within reason, of course)! Asking a price over MSRP on ANY vehicle, given the situation, is ridiculous IMO (cough, cough, Shelby GT500, cough, Dodge Challenger...) I know the car dealers are usually the ones responsible for the ADM's, but I'd think that, by now, the "Big" 3, at the very least, would tell their respective dealerships, "look, we need money!"

 

You need to understand that the dealership *already bought the car* from the auto makers. If it's on the lot, the dealership owns the car outright. It's just not been titled to the final owner yet.

If it's in the ports awaiting a dealer to get it, that is still owned by the maker, and that's where they're losing the money, those unsold at the ports cars. Made way more than they need to.

The dealers are hurting in a different manner, in that they actually have to pay for the car regardless of if it sits for months or they just turn it immediately around. That transaction you never see when you buy the car. You are actually buying the car *from the dealer* not the manufacturer.

What then happens is the holdback for the car (a spiff for selling it if you will) will be refunded to the dealer once that car is sold to the buyer. This is why dealers can sell below MSRP, or "their invoice." It's also well known, so it's no real secret, go googling. If they were to sell it at their cost, they'd make no money. They'd have to depend on the other saps who paid full MSRP the rest of the time. Which is true, yes, but who pays MSRP in the first place, eh? Oh wait, those who buy at Saturn and Best Buy do. My bad.

Anyway, there is no manufacturer's incentive for the dealer to lower the deal unless the MSRP itself is lowered, and the holdback increased to compensate for that. If that doesn't happen, the dealer *still has the old buy price* invested in the car, and they aren't gonna take the hit unless that car sits for 4 months... and even then, if it's a 'hot' item, they won't. They will always strive for MSRP, but will never go below invoice unless that particular car is too long in the tooth.

And that's a comparitive thing, seeing as most of the cars on the lots are 'long' nowadays.

It's a really interesting scenario. They talk about the manufacturers, but when you get to it it's all about the dealerships. THAT's where the aid needs to be targeted, which ultimately needs to be the consumer receives it. The consumer buys the car on the lot (best buy thing again) and then the dealer needs more cars, the makers sell them to the dealers, and the makers can now make more cars.

It's stupid to give the makers money because they're *still not selling*. Duh. So, everyone go buy a new car already.

/Engenious! How do I come up with this stuff? I'll save the world eventually if I keep this up...

 

I had a dealer telling me he had 3 Challenger but could not do much better but said in 2 wks he should be getting 9 and give great pricing? What is the difference?

 

To be fair most dealerships haven't paid for these cars, the are carrying a loan on each and every one, and the "bank" who floats the loan for these dozens or even hundreds of "new" cars monitors their inventory very closely. Every single "new" car must be on the lot or have a paper trail...

 

You're right! They finance through a bank as a contract "floor plan" to float the value of the car(s) for a specific time period. After a certain amount of time, if the car isn't sold, the dealer pays interest against that vehicle! A local Chrysler dealer recently lost their floor plan and subsequently lost their franchise with Chrysler!

 

From what I've heard this doesn't surprise me.

"We want to ensure a flawless launch and the highest quality"

Translated, this means... we are still having problems with this car and we have to have time to fix these issues.
Seriously if they were suppose to have this car ready to go in the next 8-10 weeks and they are still having problems.... NOT GOOD

 

It's a Chevy, par for the course...

 

I sat in one at the auto show yesterday, not impressed. Door sill is way high, hard to get in and out of. No handle to grab to shut the door, just a fingertip slot that is at such an angle, your fingertips keep slipping out of trying to pull the door shut. Then, when the door finally shut, the top of the door rattles. And that was just getting into it. It was a V6, but the decked out with lots of options. Rep there said this V6 was $39K, and had no idea when they would start selling them. Wasn't impressed, Challenger looked much better.

 

Maybe GM is delaying it because they're trying to retrofit it with a SRA after hearing the howls of protest from the F-body faithful.

 

 

You are correct, my mistake. It's *almost* like they own them, though. Same kinda idea.

 

Yeah, I know what you are saying. But something tells me it won't matter if or when the Camaro comes out! People can't get the credit to buy right now anyway! How many cash buyers are out there? Probably as many lottery winners! If things keep going like they are, we'll be going to something worse than " I owe my soul to the company store!"

 

just makes me laugh, a 4 year old car that no one owns. and may never. this doesnt upset me though, hope to not see them on the streets

 

1+

 

Remember that many people are NOT quick studies. At a time when money is scarce and buyers even less available, the approach at dealerships should be (in my opinion) specialty cars are sticker, NOTHING LESS. Run of the mill products like trucks, sedans, and econoboxes can be discounted.

Greed is largely responsible for what got us into this horrible situation. Obviously car stealerships haven't learned a GD thing at this point. If they had, they wouldn't be trying to gouge people on specialty cars like the Challenger. They would be very happy to put buying customers into them at sticker and explain to the customer that they cannot discount these due to the limited production run and nature of the car. If they want a discounted vehicle, we have a nice Sebring for you or whatever. But no. Dumb*ss dealers have to still try to ADM cars in a near economic depression.

May the ADM people of '09 go out of business and may the customer friendly, decent dealerships flourish I say.

 

^Amen!

 

My thoughts exactly! The only fox I'd ever cared was the SVO for it's looks, but the Camaro/Firebirds looked cooler. I wowed even more when I saw for the first time the 93 F-bodies, but that changed with the 94 Mustang And when I saw both car's engine compartments, the Mustang had the most room for wrenching. Those last F-bodies are a nightmare to take stuff in & out of them
That's the real truth.
Rest in peace Camaro. We never knew ye.

 

Well said!!!

 

I recall articles predicting the Camaro's debut at the '06 Detroit Auto show, some time around August of '05 (Edmunds Inside Line, I think.) The Camaro, looking nearly like a production piece was unveiled in January of '06, and a convertible appeared in 2007. Off the cuff, I can't recall a production vehicle with so much exposure taking so long to hit the streets.

It seems the Pontiac GTO seemed much quicker from debut to production than the new Camaro. I can't believe that it could have beeen much more difficult to transform the Holden Commodore to the Camaro than it was to convert the Holden Monaro to the Pontiac GTO.

It's hard to believe, given all the posts on this (and other forums) comparing the Camaro to the Mustang, comparing the Camaro to the Challenger, and in some cases comparing the new Camaro to Nissan's Z car, that people are referring to a product that doesn't even exist except in pre-production prototypes. And it's hard to believe after all the photos, articles, and benchracing the future of the Camaro (and GM) is still in question.

It seems GM may be paving the way to hit up the government for more money...

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationwo...,4370506.story

 

they did this car wrong. they should have just reskinned the GTO, updated the interior and dropped in the LS3. it would have been much cheaper and quicker, oh well