2005-2009 Mustang Information on The S197 {Gen1}

So What Should Ford Do Differently?

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Old Sep 22, 2007 | 05:21 PM
  #21  
tacbear's Avatar
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The car needs to be lighter by at least 200 Lbs.

The base V6 should be the 3.0L Duratec with 225 HP

The upgraded V6 should be the 3.5L Duratec, with true dual exhaust it would be at least 275 HP. Call it the Mustang ST.

The GT should have a 325 HP 4.6L 3V.(easily attainable)

Upgraded Mustangs would use a 5.4L 3V (if it had the same tune and cam timing as the GT it would be 350HP+ and 370 Ftlbs). Call it the Mach 1.

Put the old Terminator motor in the SE (Boss??), Superchaged 4.6L 4V 390HP.

Offer IRS, a 6 speed manual, and 6 speed Auto with paddle shifter.

These are all NO-Brainers and could easily be offered!!!!!
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Old Sep 22, 2007 | 05:54 PM
  #22  
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Lighter, the cars lighter then a gto, you want it lighter take out the power seats and put manual ones in and lose some wieght there ya go

Ill grant the v6 should have been a bit more powerful but still one of the best in its class.

sure 325 is easily attainable, premium gas and diffrent tuning, but believe it or not they would have sold less mustangs, with gas prices the way they are and the yuppies who by these cars will be turned off(not talking about true enthusiasts)

ANd no it cant be easily offered it would be cool, but your talking about 6 diffrent kind of mustangs. and more aded transmissions. all that would cost money money ford doesnt have for the research and developement of all those options, never mind the neccesary manufacturing plants to try to produce and sell 6 diffrent kinds of mustang, nevermind the optional 6 speed trannys you want, its just not feasible for a struggling company
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Old Sep 22, 2007 | 09:29 PM
  #23  
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I spent the last 6 months in the Middle East driving Euro-spec Fords. They pretty much need to can everything but the Mustang and the F-series and let the Brits build their entire lineup. An Aussie-sourced sedan would be nice, but the platform doesn't support left-side-drive so we're SOL on that on unless Mr. Mullaly can convince them to make a platform that works both ways for the next generation.

Seriously, the interior quality on the new Mondeo is right up there with Volkswagen. I was floored.

~Mike~
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Old Sep 22, 2007 | 09:50 PM
  #24  
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-Offer IRS standard across the board. The SRA is old technology. No one uses it anymore on passenger cars.
-More HP N/A: The only real way to do this is with increased displacement. 375 hp standard would be nice. Throw direct injection in the mix to boost economy a bit.
-6 speed manual for the GT. This should have been offered in 05!!
-Sport Package: Wider tires, upgraded 13" rotors with 4 piston calipers, and a tuned suspension. At least give it to us an an option...
-Better Seats: Give us some bolstering and better material.
-Upgraded Plastics: The interior is well designed, but the materials are cheap. GM is actually starting to build nice interiors, so why can't Ford?

Other than that, the car looks great! I cannot find a flaw in the exterior design.
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Old Sep 22, 2007 | 10:46 PM
  #25  
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Adjustable seat belts, a manu-matic and a sunroof

My wife hates the seatbelts. She's 5'5" and they cut into her neck on the pasenger side, so that's for her.
I'd like a manu-matic and as I've posted here before, I'd love a sunroof option, too.

Those are doable, I think (of course I'd like a free supercharger option, too, but I'm trying to be realistic).
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 12:24 AM
  #26  
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who cares ford doesnt listen any ways way waste your time
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 07:16 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by balboa
who cares ford doesnt listen any ways way waste your time
I would have to disagree...there was a lot of input about the new S-197 from the people.Even the Ford engineers captured the top brass and won approval for the retro Stang.
Sure there are some quirks about the s-197 but complaints aside this car has captured many enthusiast and have sent us back in time.But this time its has brought us all together to show off,share info, and share the passionate love we have for the Mustang...new or old.
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 09:54 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Poco
I would have to disagree...there was a lot of input about the new S-197 from the people.Even the Ford engineers captured the top brass and won approval for the retro Stang.
Sure there are some quirks about the s-197 but complaints aside this car has captured many enthusiast and have sent us back in time.But this time its has brought us all together to show off,share info, and share the passionate love we have for the Mustang...new or old.
That's partially true. The bean counters still have too much control over the company. What Ford really needs is a guy like Bob Lutz who is a car guy near the top of command.

A good example was the IRS debate before the S197 was introduced. Supposedly, the S197 chassis was designed for an IRS rear and it was going to make production until the bean counters ran some numbers. When all was said and done, the S197 chassis had to be re-engineerd to accept a SRA due to the cost issue of an IRS rear.
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 10:58 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Poco
I would have to disagree...there was a lot of input about the new S-197 from the people.Even the Ford engineers captured the top brass and won approval for the retro Stang.
Sure there are some quirks about the s-197 but complaints aside this car has captured many enthusiast and have sent us back in time.But this time its has brought us all together to show off,share info, and share the passionate love we have for the Mustang...new or old.
Back in time with out all the discomforts; and I don't just mean of the 60's, even the SN95 had room for improvement. I love SN95s, especially the Mach 1. My old Mach was such a blast! But its build quality is definitely below that of the S197. Ford does not do a lot of things right. Financially. Performance wise. Even costumer relations could use some work. But one thing they have been doing is continually improving the Mustang. Sure, the late 70's and early 80's had some duds, but overall the Mustang (like another American icon, the Corvette) has gotten better over the years.

One thing that would be nice though is to be able to pick and choose individual options when you order a new one, instead of having to upgrade other features the buyer may not be interested in. (i.e. HIDs without having to get the OEM security system) I don't know a lot about the costs of such things, but if it is feasible to give the consumer complete control of the order that would be nice.
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 11:03 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by max2000jp
A good example was the IRS debate before the S197 was introduced. Supposedly, the S197 chassis was designed for an IRS rear and it was going to make production until the bean counters ran some numbers. When all was said and done, the S197 chassis had to be re-engineerd to accept a SRA due to the cost issue of an IRS rear.
That's interesting. I haven't heard about that. I'm still up in the air with the IRS vs. SRA debate. I have owned and driven sports cars with both. Both have their pros and cons. Some people love their Mustang with the SRA, other would prefer an IRS. Hhmm...
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 11:12 AM
  #31  
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From: West Kelowna, British Columbia
1. Dual Exhaust for the V6.
2. Cold Air Induction Kit for V6 & GT.
3. Interior Bling Package for both V6 & GT (as an option).
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 11:39 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Willie
thats how the dealers make money...well that and intrest anyways..but i tihnk 20 & 40k is way to much i mean i know they have to make money too but more like 5k is reasonable

It's obvious dealer markup is pure profit. But how about cars that aren't marked up? How do dealers make money on these units? Simple. Let's look at the invoice and MSRP of a 2008 GT500 (thumbnail). IF the dealership pays invoice, $37,898, the difference between it and MSRP is the dealership's profit. This is the margin that Ford "gives" to the dealership that's built into every vehicle. In this case, it's about $4,000. This difference reflects only the base car with no options. Dealerships make over 18 percent (dependent on model) on the option total. So if options total $4,000 retail, they are making an additional $720.

So, if a dealership were to sell a GT500 for an MSRP of, say, $45,000, they are making about $4,700. This is selling at MSRP and not a penny more. Anything above and over is, simply, pure profit. It turns out that dealerships don't even pay the invoice price (trade secret, if you will). They pay slightly less. This is how dealerships can get away with sales such as "Our invoice + $100". They're actually making more than $100....

Now maybe you can understand why I'll NEVER pay over MSRP for ANY car. It's pure legalized robbery in my opinion. Can you say "Oil Companies"???

Willie
A new vehicle at MSRP has a lower net profit percentage then ANY retail product you buy(roughly 8% with holdback). Why not negotiate some of Home Depot's 50% margin next time you buy something? $30K worth of materials there makes over $15k for them. How much do you think a jewler makes on a $30k diamond? Its all relative, it just sounds like a lot, to you. Plus, dealers are not holes in the wall in low cost areas, they are mega million dollar investments with as much real estate needed as a shopping mall with only one store on it. Its the highest investement price per square foot/store of any retail outlet. Maintain tens of millions of dollars of inventory to sell most of them for around $400 a copy profit? Its not uncommon to spend over $100k per month in advertising. Many vehicles are sold at invoice. Ford needs to get rid of 30% of its dealers to reduce competition and raise per-dealer profits to reasonable levels. The number of dealers and giveaway sales are having dealers killing themselves with half the market share of 20 years ago. You never see Lexus overcrowding the market, they are all very high profit dealers spread way apart from one another. In this immediate area, 3 lexus dealers, 25 Ford dealers.

With the slowing market many dealers of all makes are just bleeding money right now by the millions. If you owned a dealership for a week, you would never sell the vehicles for what they do sell for, you would have a coronary and be marking everything up $10000 at a frantic pace. Not to mention something like Nike or Coach's fifteen thousand percent+ profit margin you'll just simply buy without asking twice about the price. The grocery store makes more profit off you every year then your car dealership ever will, you need to start negotiating the fruity pebbles if you think you bought too much car for your budget.
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 01:02 PM
  #33  
tacbear's Avatar
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Originally Posted by MustangRetribution
Lighter, the cars lighter then a gto, you want it lighter take out the power seats and put manual ones in and lose some wieght there ya go

Ill grant the v6 should have been a bit more powerful but still one of the best in its class.

sure 325 is easily attainable, premium gas and diffrent tuning, but believe it or not they would have sold less mustangs, with gas prices the way they are and the yuppies who by these cars will be turned off(not talking about true enthusiasts)

ANd no it cant be easily offered it would be cool, but your talking about 6 diffrent kind of mustangs. and more aded transmissions. all that would cost money money ford doesnt have for the research and developement of all those options, never mind the neccesary manufacturing plants to try to produce and sell 6 diffrent kinds of mustang, nevermind the optional 6 speed trannys you want, its just not feasible for a struggling company
You are WRONG!!!! One of the reasons Ford is in the shape it's in is because they are too busy counting beans to build "REAL" cars. That is why people buy Brand "J" (japan)!!
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 05:13 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by tacbear
You are WRONG!!!! One of the reasons Ford is in the shape it's in is because they are too busy counting beans to build "REAL" cars. That is why people buy Brand "J" (japan)!!
The Japanese sell more cars because they're reliable and a good value for the money, not because they shoot for the moon with impossible weight goals and five engine choices. Ford needs to sell a sedan that 35 year olds want and can attain, not a sports car that 10 year olds dream about.

~Mike~
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 05:57 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by R-code
Ford needs to sell a sedan that 35 year olds want and can attain, not a sports car that 10 year olds dream about.

~Mike~
You are CORRECT, if they would sell a car like the Aussey Falcon here I would be first in line.

I hope you aren't calling the Mustang a "Sports Car", a sporty car maybe. Iv'e dreamed about Mustangs since I was 4 years old(the year they came out) and I still dream about them!!
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 06:37 PM
  #36  
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Me, I'd love to see Ford making the Mustang a better driver's car - FRPP handling pack from the factory, adjustable dampers, IRS, big brakes, that kind of thing.

Also, they should make more GT500s - get the price down to MSRP. I think people are quite happy about the MSRP, but I think most feel a bit ripped off with the dealer markups. I'm not entirely sure why they do this - the dealers probably like it, but they're ****ing off their customers.

Edit: Oh yeah, they really need to bring the Euro Focus and the Mondeo over here
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 07:30 PM
  #37  
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From: Beautiful New Hampshire!!!
A passenger-side grab handle so I don't have to listen to my wife complain about not having one!!
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 08:00 PM
  #38  
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More Power for the V6 and GT. Have some different engine options like Dodge does for the Charger. I would really like to see a T-top version of the Mustang come back but i doubt thats gonna happen. Ford really needs to bring back a performance division. If's it's not called SVT then oh well. This needs to happen for more than just the Mustang too. Gas prices may be higher now, but horsepower still seems to sell.
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Old Sep 23, 2007 | 09:09 PM
  #39  
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in addition to what Kevin has said if special cars such as the GT500, shelby GT or any others on the long list of special interest cars were sold right as MSRP there would just be people with alot of money buying them up and selling them at a preminum and not the dealers it is just they way things are with anything that has collectible value be it a car, a toy or anything that has any kind of demand just my view on it.

Originally Posted by kevinb120
A new vehicle at MSRP has a lower net profit percentage then ANY retail product you buy(roughly 8% with holdback). Why not negotiate some of Home Depot's 50% margin next time you buy something? $30K worth of materials there makes over $15k for them. How much do you think a jewler makes on a $30k diamond? Its all relative, it just sounds like a lot, to you. Plus, dealers are not holes in the wall in low cost areas, they are mega million dollar investments with as much real estate needed as a shopping mall with only one store on it. Its the highest investement price per square foot/store of any retail outlet. Maintain tens of millions of dollars of inventory to sell most of them for around $400 a copy profit? Its not uncommon to spend over $100k per month in advertising. Many vehicles are sold at invoice. Ford needs to get rid of 30% of its dealers to reduce competition and raise per-dealer profits to reasonable levels. The number of dealers and giveaway sales are having dealers killing themselves with half the market share of 20 years ago. You never see Lexus overcrowding the market, they are all very high profit dealers spread way apart from one another. In this immediate area, 3 lexus dealers, 25 Ford dealers.

With the slowing market many dealers of all makes are just bleeding money right now by the millions. If you owned a dealership for a week, you would never sell the vehicles for what they do sell for, you would have a coronary and be marking everything up $10000 at a frantic pace. Not to mention something like Nike or Coach's fifteen thousand percent+ profit margin you'll just simply buy without asking twice about the price. The grocery store makes more profit off you every year then your car dealership ever will, you need to start negotiating the fruity pebbles if you think you bought too much car for your budget.
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Old Sep 25, 2007 | 07:05 AM
  #40  
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Ford needs to put a leash on it's dealers and quit letting them set these outrageous ADMIN fees, so regular people can purchase them and they would sell more vehicles.
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