If your one of the vendors and your interested in selling me a combo either reply back on this thread or PM me since I'm ready to buy. I have questions before I buy though. Mainly can you tell me the difference between the different CAI's you offer and also what the diference between the Diablo and SCT X-Cal are. Also I'll need to know price on the combo's you offer.

Also I know (or have heard) on the Diablo that you can change it back to stock before taking your car in for service, but if while at service FORD updates your computer you can get rid of the old stock tune thats saved into the Diablo and save the new stock tune. On the SCT i've heard that to replace the stock tune with an updated stock tune you have to send the SCT back to have it cleared before the new stock tune can be saved. Is this true? Does that make sence I kinda confused myself there? Its just that I was told if FORD ever updates with a new Stock tune and you don't save it, later on when you go to set the car back to stock for more service work it won't run or Ford with see that its been changed.

Example.
I hook up the SCT X-Cal and save Version 1.0 stock tune.
I Tune the car with 87 performance tune.
Month later
I Tune the car back to stock Version 1.0 to have service work done.
FORD updates computer to Stock tune 2.0
I reload 87 performance tune.
2 months later
I plug in SCT X-Cal and reset back to stock Version 1.0 to find the car won't run or I take it in for service and FORD sees Version 1.0 instead of 2.0

Basicly can I update the saved Stock tune on the SCT X-Cal as Ford does their computer updates without sending the tuner back to have it cleared.

Sorry about all the rambleing, Its late and I'm a little

 

I never thought about that.... let me know what the answer is since I am in the market for both a CAI / Tune!!! PM me or post answer you may get if possible!

 

I am pretty sure Ford service can tell no matter what even if you flash the car back to its stock tune, hopefully someone else you chime in to confirm or deny?

 

I'm pretty sure that FORD can't tell if you have a tuner or not as long as you reset the tune back to stock before taking the car in for service. Any adjustments done to the computer via tune would void the warrenty. Thats why everybody on here says to make sure you reset your car back to stock before takeing it back to FORD for service. I have an 8 year Bumper to Bumper warrenty on mine and I'd hate to see that voided.

 

Yeah if I can ever get any of the vendors to respond I'll post the answers. I thought for sure one would respond to sell me a combo.

 

My suggestion is to call Brenspeed or Doug at bamachips. They can answer your questions as I am not so sure the vendors are patrolling the boards looking for support questions to answer.

As far as I understand it and I am not a guru of tuning...

Example.
I hook up the SCT X-Cal and save Version 1.0 stock tune.
I Tune the car with 87 performance tune.
Month later
I Tune the car back to stock Version 1.0 to have service work done.
FORD updates computer to Stock tune 2.0
You cannot reload your previous tune if Ford changed the ECM code. You'd have to call the vendor to get a re-written tune

Either way your new 2.0 tune from Ford would have been downloaded to the device
I reload 87 performance tune.
2 months later
This would not happen. If you re-flash it back to stock it would be the 2.0 version
I plug in SCT X-Cal and reset back to stock Version 1.0 to find the car won't run or I take it in for service and FORD sees Version 1.0 instead of 2.0
I plug in SCT X-Cal and reset it to stock Version 2.0 and take it in for service.

See this thread
I could be missing something or be wrong but it is how I believe it would work and what I gathered from the link above

 

I've heard the exact same thing. The way I heard it, dealerships cannot ascertain what WAS flashed on the ECM (i.e., tune) after you reflash back to the stock tune; however, they CAN tell that the ECM was reflashed. Something to do with a flash ePROM in the ECM which apparently keeps 'count'. Thus, dealership service would know you (or someone) reflashed the ECM... just not exactly when or what program was on it.

 

They way you can tell a car has been flashed recently is that all of the system checks have not been completed. It takes about 50 miles of driving to complete all of these checks. If you flash your car, drive it 50 miles, then take it to the dealer, they can't tell anything. I've worked with the same flash tools they use. There's no counter or anything like that.

 

OK, in a nutshelll.....


1.) A Ford DEALER cannot tell if you have reprogrammed your PCM by simply checking for codes, as before stated they will get a system clear code, P1000, if you take it back to stock and dont drive it enough before you get there. This code only means that the PCM hasn't had time to learn anything but basically just the system is free and clear of any codes. You can disconnect your battery for 20 minutes and get the same code OR even clear your DTC's and you'll get the same code.

2.) A Ford ENGINEER can tell how many times the PCM has been reflashed, not what programs are in it or anything about the program. Then they can compare that with the warrenty notes and see if its been flashed by Ford and the dealer twice, then the other 3 times must be aftermarket.
I've seen this done but ONLY on SVT vehicles that have had MAJOR drivetrain related problems. I've never seen this done on a standard GT. On a side note, Ford would send out an engineer on ANY major SVT product concern, I've seen them drive a engine out for a 93 Cobra and take the core back with them when they left.
The dealership does not have the capability to do this, this requires special software. The dealer can't even tell if an aftermarket tune is in the car because an aftermarket tune SHOULD run well within factory parameters. When they do load a tune into it all they know is they are loading a tune, they have NO CLUE as to what is changed in it as they cannot open it OR modify it, it may have a note with it saying what is repaired in the new tune but most of the time not even that.

Now, as for tuner differences and reprogramming.

The Diablosport unlocks the device each time it is returned to stock. Then when it is prompted to reload a tune it will compare the program that it is writing to the Original Backup file and if they are not the same then it will not program the car.
So, if you were to get a custom tune for an 06 auto, then load it and drive it and return it to stock and take it in for repairs where they uploaded a new tune the CUSTOM tune wouldn't be the same and it would not upload the CUSTOM tune into the car.
Now on a side note, the Diablosport comes with preloaded tunes that will work with the type of car it is designed for, the U7140 is setup for the 05-06 Mustangs, so the base Diablosport tunes would work with the new calibration but the custom tune would need to be rewritten for the new Calibration/Strategy code. Basically you could use the Predator until you got the new tunes.

The SCT X-calibrator does NOT unlock when you return it to stock but rather you MUST go into the device using Liveload or SCT dealer software and manually unlock the X-cal. This can only be done 5 times before it must be returned to SCT.

As for the reflashing by the dealer. If you return your car to stock before taking it in for warrenty work and they reflash your PCM then it changes the calibration code as noted before. The X-calibrator Version 9400, not the Strategy Flasher, is always loaded for tunes using a specific calibration code. Now I'm not sure as to what the X-cal looks for in the vehicle to ensure it is the same but I will say that this value doesn't change when the dealer reflashes the car.
So the X-cal will load the old custom tune into the car. The BAD part is the new Calibration from the dealer wont work using the old tune so the car wont start. Also, since the X-2 wont download the new factory tune unless it was unlocked then it will erase the new Factory tune. Basically the car will not run at all and you will have to call the dealer to have them two it in and reflash it with the same factory tune that they just did.

The way around this is when you first get your X-2 use it to read the strategy code off of the PCM now. Write this code down. Always return your car to stock before going in for repairs, and when you get your car back pull the strategy code off of it again, it doesn't reflash anything when its just reading the strategy, this is in the DTC menu.

Compare the two strategies, if they are the same then you have nothing to worry about and you can reload your custom tunes and drive away happy. IF they dont then STOP there. Write down the new Strategy and contact your custom tuning dealer. They will need to rewrite your tunes for the new Strategy and help you install them on your X-cal as well as have you unlock your X-cal while you are using the Liveload software.


Now the above for SCT sounds like alot but it is truly very simple and once you've done it a time or two its second nature.

Also, the dealer doesn't come out with new codes for Mustangs daily, the only codes I've even seen revised so far have been 06 GT manual and autos and they've only made one change. So truly you have nothing to greatly concern yourself with.

Now, back to emails and phone calls

THanks, Doug.

 

Doug: thanks for the detail and clarification... as usual, awesome summary

 

Great response Doug

 

I am an engine calibration engineer, and everything Doug said about Flashing an ECU and how Ford can track it down is right: there is just a counter incremented everytime the ECU is being reflashed, no more no less.

Thx Doug!

 

Everything above is 100% correct. This isn't a huge deal.. just be sure to save your strategy in a safe place and read strategy every time you come back from the dealership so that you can be sure that you have the right tunes.

CR

 

If Ford changes the Tune, do you have to pay to have all your programed tunes on your SCT reprogramed?

 

Depends on your SCT dealer, with my tuners or even purchased tunes no as you have my support for as long as I can still write your tunes, I cant do mail or supercharger or turbo tuning. So new tunes wouldn't cost you anything from me but each dealer is different.

This is why buying your X-2 from Ebay for $20 cheaper isn't the best idea, you want after the sale support!

Now, if you have your X-cal locked and the bad senario at the dealer then you would have to work with your SCT dealer and SCT to have your X-cal unlocked and then have new tunes loaded into it, there again this is a question of your dealer and how they handle that end of the business.

Thanks Doug.

 

I need the tuner and tunes for my C&L Racer intake but no one has made any prices on here yet.

 

Doen't the tuner simply store tunes and you just flash it to the car's computer? its not like it downloads it and the tuner erases it. you should get free tunes for life to download considering what they charge for the little plastic box in the first place. Something tells me that any cell phone or mp3 player is by far more sophisticated at a fraction of the cost.

Heh, maybe in the future the car will have more AI and you can just send it a song playlist and it will know what kind a mood you are in

 

www.bamachips.com
www.tillmanspeed.com

Those are the two that posted in this thread. Please don't turn this forum into making these wonderful vendors post their prices in response to every post. These guys have been here since the beginning, their wares and customer service validated hundreds of times. It is absolutely not difficult at all to find background information about them and to contact them for more information.

With that said, no I'm not the forum cop. I just want these guys to be around for a lot longer and not feel like they have to justify their products over and over. These guys are champs, buy stuff from them.

 

Send a PM to either Doug at Bamachips or CR at Tillman speed or Brenspeed or any of the other vendors. They will give you prices in Private pm's in order to respect the other vendors on the site.