m05fastbackGT

Guys, I desperately need help.. I've tried several times to install the Borla S-type mufflers, however I cannot get them attached onto the neck of the over the axle pipes no matter how I try to rotate them.. It appears the rear hanger brackets are what's causing the issue, as the brackets for some reason are just not providing enough clearance to be able to slide the neck of the axle backs onto the OTA pipes.. It's almost as though the hanger brackets are too long or something, but I know that Stage 3 motorsports sent the correct part number for my 06 GT.. Borla part #11750..

At any rate, I am totally stumped and don't understand what is causing the fitment and clearance issues, as Borla S types are supposed to be a direct fit for the 05-09 GT models.. I'm also still running the stock exhaust manifolds with stock catted mid pipe with magnaflow tru X welded in place of the original OEM H section along with Magnaflow street axle back exhaust..

I also followed the installation directions accurately and uninstalled the factory hangers from the body of the car and then transferred them over to the new mufflers prior to reinstalling..

Anyhow I'd really appreciate any feedback and advice that can possibly be provided.. Thanks in advance


-Rocky

2k7gtcs

Hey Rocky

I have Borla stingers on my 07 on original over axle pipes. Not sure if that's the same you have but they are exactly like the Ford Racing axle backs from back in the day. I think Borla made them for FRPP then.

I had an issue on mine with the passenger side. The over axle pipe had a **** or nipple on it of sorts at the *** end of the pipe. About 1/4" round and it lined up with a notch in the stock mufflers and was supposed to line up with a notch in the Borla but didn't. If it did there was no way to get the muffler tip to line up in the bumper like the drivers side. And if I did try to force it on like it was liked up correctly in the bumper then it wouldn't go all the way on. So I actually had to take a cutting tool, I think I used a dreamer, and enlarge that notch opening in order to accept the over axle pipe.

As far as pipe sliding over pipe I did not have any problem at all. In the past I've used some things like anti seize or even just motor oil to get them to slide together but never anything so bad that one pipe wouldn't fit into the other.

2k7gtcs

You know now that I read this again I get what you are saying.

I have always had to loosen the over axle pipe at the mid pipe and actually take it loose in order to slide the over axle pipe around enough to put the two together. Otherwise it would be impossible.

First time I put the axle backs in I actually took down the hangers as much of a ***** as it was to do to get to those bolts behind and above the larger stock muffler. In the many subsequent iterations of my exhaust I found the easiest thing is to just looney the clamps at the mid pipe and slide them forward onto the midpipe and then let the axle pipes hang loose and be able to push them around and get the stock mufflers out and new ones in.

wanted33

Rocky, did ya take both hangers off? I had to do that to be able to twist mufflers so they would slide onto the OTA pipe. And that little nipple was a bit of a PITA. Also, I tried to put one of the hangers on bass-ackwards. That didn't work either. It's odd that they are giving you problems at the FR500's are the same cans, and hangers as I was told. And as our bud 2k7gtcs said, I used some WD 40 to make help with the insertion.......Ummm, that sounds a bit nasty there.

Bert

I am not sure I understand the problem . . .
But if you unbolt the hangers from the car, then you should be able to move the muffler around any way you want, to get it lined up and connected to the over-axle pipe. Then bolt up the hangers and apply a little pressure if needed to push everything into position. There should be enough movement in the over-axle pipe to allow you to bend it a little to get the hanger holes lined up so the bolts will go in.

m05fastbackGT

Gary, I believe your 100% spot on about having to first loosen the mid pipe clamp, slide it forward onto the midpipe, then let the axle pipes hang loose in order to provide the clearance required to get the mufflers into the axle pipes.. As I tried uninstalling the hangers from the vehicle first, but didn't loosen the mid pipe clamp.. Just like you posted, it's practically impossible to get enough clearance for getting the new mufflers onto the axle pipes without first loosening up the mid pipe clamp.. In the meantime, I'll follow up and let you know how everything works out, as your feedback and advice appears to make the most logical sense Btw: I forgot to mention that my axle pipes are not the factory ones with the nipple, but are from the Magnaflow street cat back exhaust kit instead without the nipples..

Jim, as previously mentioned.. Yes, I unbolted all the hangers from the car before uninstalling and then attempting to install the new mufflers.. Although I was able to uninstall the old Magnaflow street mufflers, I could not get the new mufflers to slide onto the over the axle pipes, as the hanger rod brackets from the new Borla's kept getting in the way and not allowing for enough clearance.. However what Gary (2k7gtcs) mentioned in his post appears to make the most logical sense by loosening up the mid pipe clamp.. Therefore I'm going to follow his advice which hopefully should do the trick

Bert, by reading over Gary's (2k7gtcs) responses and my response back to his will hopefully provide a clearer picture of what exactly the fitment issues I've been having.. Apparently just unbolting the hangers did not allow enough clearance to move the mufflers around in order to slide them onto the axle pipes, as the hanger bracket rods attached to the new mufflers wouldn't clear the frame rail at the rear valance.. Just as Gary mentioned in his post, the over the axle pipes need to hang loose in order to provide enough clearance to line them up and then have the ability to slide them into place of the new mufflers.. This approach seems to make the most logical sense IMHO

Bert

OK yeah I re-read more carefully and I understand what y'all wrote, but I still don't get it.

I have the FR500S mufflers, which are supposedly the same thing, and I had no issues (with the hagers unbolted and out of the way). Makes me wonder if maybe they extended the hanger bracket rods for some reason and now they are too long and hitting the rear valance; or maybe I didn't have the problem because my 2010 "diaper" has more bulge to it and clears.

m05fastbackGT

There are differences between the FR500S and Borla S type/ATAK.. The canister of the FR500S is larger and also hangs lower over the Borlas and I'm also not quite sure if the length and angle of the hanger rods are the same or not either

But yes, I was also thinking just as you are that for some reason Borla may had extended the bracket rods which ended up making them too long and hitting the frame rails of the rear valance.. Unless of course I was sent mufflers that are made to fit a 2010 like yours which has the different rear valance to begin with

2k7gtcs

My Borla's hangers are crazy long
Looks like Sputnik

m05fastbackGT

Then I'm really at a loss Gary, as from what you just described, the Borla hanger rods are designed to be crazy long.. Therefore it appears that I was sent the right mufflers which should fit..

I also got a response from someone over at S197 forums who claims he was able to install the Borla S type on his 06 GT without having to loosen his mid pipe clamps with no problems.. However I find that really difficult to believe

2k7gtcs

The very first time I installed them I was able to install them by removing the hanger bolts and I did not have to remove the mid pipe clamp.

Since then, since I have a lift, I find it easier to leave the hanger bolts in and just remove the midpipe clamp and the mufflers slide in and out of the hangers. Plus then it makes them easier to line up the tips.

m05fastbackGT

Gary, here's 6 images of the Borla S Types.. 4 of the 6 are the right side muffler and 2 of the 6 are the left side muffler.. Take a look at the hanger rod brackets and let me know if they look any different compared to your S Types..

2k7gtcs

This is the only pic I could find of mine

m05fastbackGT

Unless I'm looking at your pic in the wrong way, it seems as though the hangers on your (right) passenger side muffler are facing the opposite direction and also in different locations when compared with the pic of my passenger side muffler.. However it appears that your driver's side hangers and mine are both facing in the same direction and in the same locations

wanted33

Rocky, I wish I could help you more my friend. Good luck, you'll get it figured out.

2k7gtcs

Ok this is what I came up with from looking at mine

On the left side, drivers side, both hanger rods point towards the back of the car and of course the muffler installs so you can read Borla clearly upright from the outside of the car. If you could see through the car or lay down next to it.



On the right side the front hanger rod points forward towards the front of the car and the back one which is is welded pretty close to the front one just behind the muffler points to the back and again you can read Borla on the muffler from the outside side of the car

m05fastbackGT

Gary, after looking at your first pic from last night, I contacted Borla and spoke with their tech support rep Ernest in which I also sent him an e-mail attachment of both your pics and mine.. He called me back 20 min later after he spoke with someone from their engineering dept who informed him that Borla revised the design of the S type in 2009 by changing both the location and direction of the hanger rods on just the (right) passenger side muffler..

He also assured me that they will fit my car, however he also said that part of the reason I'm having such a hard time getting them to fit, may be due that my over the axle pipe isn't the stock OTA pipe, but is an aftermarket one made by Magnaflow which is part of the Magnaflow street cat back exhaust that's been on my car ever since I purchased it from the original owner..

He seems to think the bends in the magnaflow axle pipes might have slightly different bends to them compared to the stock axle pipes which could possibly be the reason why I haven't been able to slide the Borla S types onto the Magnaflow axle pipes.. However what I don't quite understand is the Magnaflow street mufflers are designed and compatible to fit with the stock exhaust including the stock axle pipes.. Therefore you would think if their axle back mufflers are designed to fit the stock exhaust, then why would the bends in their over the axle pipes for their cat back street exhaust systems be any different over stock


At any rate, I'm going to take my car to a local shop tomorrow morning and have them put the car on a lift and let them do the installation.. I'll also be taking along my stock axle pipes just in case Ernest was right about the Magnaflow axle pipes having a slightly different bend to them after the rear axle section.. In the meantime, I'll follow up and let you know how everything works out, so stay tuned

m05fastbackGT

Finally got around to getting the Borla S types installed.. At any rate, the muffler shop that did the installation confirmed what I suspected all along.. It was the Magnaflow OTA pipes that caused the fitment issues I was going through in which they have slightly different bends to them over the stock OTA pipes after the rear axle.. Needless to say the bends in the Magnaflow pipes were just enough to prevent the Borla S types from lining up properly.. So after removing the the Magnaflow OTA pipes and then reinstalling the stock OTA's, the Borla's lined up perfectly and resolved the fitment issues..

After the installation was completed, I made phone calls to both Borla and Magnaflow and found out from Borla that both their axle back and cat back exhaust systems are manufactured to OEM specs regarding fitment..

Magnaflow on the other hand, confirmed their cat back exhaust systems are designed only for their exhaust components.. However they do claim their rear axle back kits are designed for the stock exhaust.. I suppose this can be interpreted as meaning that Magnaflow has 2 different axle back components for their cat back and rear axle back exhaust systems

Anyhow, here's my review.. After listening to the Borla S types, they most definitely provide that deep throaty sound I've been searching for in which for the most part I've been very pleased with them where their loud when you want them, but not overbearing over the top.. The bad news is, yes there is a noticeable drone to them between 1500-2000 RPM when under load, during acceleration under 50 MPH.. The good news however, is once I'm above 55 MPH on the highway while cruising, there is no noticeable drone whatsoever in 5th gear at 2000 RPM and above.. In addition, Borla also confirmed that once the axle backs build up enough filament/carbon approx after 300-500 miles, the carbon build up should reduce the amount of drone..

That being said, from my personal experience, the drone isn't nearly as bad as from those I've read on this forum and also from others as well who've posted about the drone as being unbearable.. Perhaps it's just me or my hearing just isn't quite as sensitive to drone as others have reported about the S types..

All I can say is, the drone is very livable and isn't nearly as bad as I thought from reading all the negative reviews and horror stories from people who uninstalled their Borla S types and put them up for sale because of the drone being so terrible lol.

In the meantime, hope this review of the Borla S type axle back exhaust may be found as useful to anyone who might be considering them..




-Rocky

2k7gtcs

Rocky,

My experience with the drone is exactly the same as yours. Same speed, gear, and RPM. I have always thought it was livable for me and have never given it a second thought. It will not however go away in time. It seems to be the same with me now as it was 10,000 or even 15,000 miles ago.

m05fastbackGT

Gary,

I totally agree about the drone as being livable and like yourself, I'm very pleased with how they sound and have no intentions of getting rid of them..

I was actually considering the Borla ATAK until Steve from Borla warned me they would end up as being too loud because of the Saleen VI supercharger increasing the amount of airflow being pushed into the combustion chamber and then out through the exhaust which would also result in changing the sound of the exhaust tone.. He also stated the ATAK's are designed and tuned specifically for the stock 3v engine.. So in the end, I decided that it would be in my best interest to follow his recommendation to go with the Borla S type instead and after listening to how great they sound, I don't regret my decision in the least bit and if the drone doesn't ever go away, that's also fine with me as well, as I can deal with it