05GT-O.C.D.

OK guys, I've been around here for a while now and haven't seen this discussed in much detail. What exactly is the difference between a pony car and a muscle car? And, where's the '05 Mustang fall in? To me, I guess it's a combination of both based on my understanding of the terms, but what do the experts here have to say? I look forward to the responses.

stangscuba98a

Isn't Pony car in reference to Mustangs only?

ILikeBond

Pony cars are defined as those with long hoods and short trunks, front engines, and rear wheel drive. Some consider the Mustang the last pony car (or "ponycar") left, the camaro, firebird, and other competitors having been phased out of production.

A muscle car is defined the by relation of the engine size to car's body weight. John Delorian designed he first muscle car, the Pontiac Firebird. Another way its said is muscle cars are ones with large engines in small cars at realitively affordable prices.

TomServo92

Pony cars are defined as those with long hoods and short trunks, front engines, and rear wheel drive. Some consider the Mustang the last pony car (or "ponycar") left, the camaro, firebird, and other competitors having been phased out of production.

A muscle car is defined the by relation of the engine size to car's body weight. John Delorian designed he first muscle car, the Pontiac Firebird. Another way its said is muscle cars are ones with large engines in small cars at realitively affordable prices.
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The Firebird was not the first muscle car (in fact it's not a muscle car at all, it's a pony car like the Mustang). The first muscle car was the 1964 Pontiac GTO and was the brainchild of John Delorean. It was a mid-size car with a big V8. That configuration is considered the traditional formula for a "muscle car".

05GT-O.C.D.

That's what I thought too, but I've recently learned that to be incorrect... the reason I posted this topic.

ILikeBond

The Firebird was not the first muscle car (in fact it's not a muscle car at all, it's a pony car like the Mustang). The first muscle car was the 1964 Pontiac GTO and was the brainchild of John Delorean. It was a mid-size car with a big V8. That configuration is considered the traditional formula for a "muscle car".
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You're right - GTO, not Firebird. My bad, but that's what I meant.

TomServo92

That's what I thought too, but I've recently learned that to be incorrect... the reason I posted this topic.
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Just to clear a few things up: They're called "pony cars" because the 1964 Mustang created the market segment. The cars that are considered pony cars include the Cougar, Camaro, Firebird, Challenger, Cuda, and Javelin.

05GT-O.C.D.

OK, at what point would the '05 Mustang be considered a Muscle Car? Would it be considered that if it had a 5.4 in it for example?

TomServo92

Like I said earlier, the traditional configuration for a muscle car is a mid-size car with a big V8. The Mustang isn't a mid-size car so it will never be considered a muscle car in the traditional sense. The only new cars that might be considered muscle cars would be the GTO, 300C, and Charger.

jwede

Like I said earlier, the traditional configuration for a muscle car is a mid-size car with a big V8. The Mustang isn't a mid-size car so it will never be considered a muscle car in the traditional sense. The only new cars that might be considered muscle cars would be the GTO, 300C, and Charger.
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The GTO is much bigger than the Mustang. It is 2+2 as well.

TomServo92

The GTO is much bigger than the Mustang. It is 2+2 as well.
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That's why I classify it as muscle car and not a pony car.

AFBLUE

Not this answers any questions definitively, but if you pick any book at the bookstore with the words "muscle cars" in the title then I almost guarantee that you will find mustangs, camaros, firebirds, cudas and/or challengers in it.

I would define it this way. Not all pony cars are/were muscle cars (v6 versions of pony cars for example). But the HiPo versions of the pony cars would be muscle cars as well.

Just my opinion.

TomServo92

Yeah, there is definitley some blurring of the lines but the traditional definitions are as I have described above.

05GT-O.C.D.

Mark, last question from me... So is the Mustang too big or too small to be a Muscle Car? You said it has to be midsize, that's what I thought the '05 was.

mister_e

He said the GTO would be considered a muscle car because it is bigger than the Mustang, so I'm guessing the Mustang is classified as a compact car?

Zip34

Webster's Dictionary describes "muscle car" as follows:

Main Entry: muscle car
Pronunciation: -"kär
Function: noun
: any of a group of American-made 2-door sports coupes with powerful engines designed for high-performance driving

I always thought of pony cars as smaller versions of muscle cars (i.e. mustangs, camaro's). Whenever I saw a car such as a 1970 charger, I would think "muscle car". Maybe I'm way off, but if it's american and has a powerfull V8 (or larger) engine, I generalize and just call them all muscle cars.

But I'm not an expert!

Thunder Road

Having just recently gotten my GT, and having some 180 miles on it, including one awsome 2000rpm launch to 100 quicker than I can type this, its a Muscle car. Period.
Yes the 'first' Muscle cars were midsize, but muscle is all about performance. As someone already said some pony cars arent muscle cars, but for my money, and after all thats what matters, its a muscle car pure and simple.

Mongoose

The 05 Mustang is a FUN car.
ROLL ON

Enfynet

The original Mustangs were Pony cars, the GT500 Mustangs could be considered muscle cars. Thats how I've seen it anyways.

TomServo92

He said the GTO would be considered a muscle car because it is bigger than the Mustang, so I'm guessing the Mustang is classified as a compact car?
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That's correct. Officially, the Mustang is classified as a "Compact Coupe". The GTO is officially classified as a "Mid-size coupe".

All this is based on the classic definitions of these cars. By todays standards, it's hard to distinguish between what's a muscle car and what's a pony car. If it's got a powerful V8 and RWD, it's all good to me!